Securing Equipment on Trailer

wkpoor · Mar 8, 2009

Remember to locate the tractor so you get ~10% of the weight on the truck.

I realize that is the excepted standard but I don't think every trailer needs that much. And some may need more. The distance from the hitch to the axle/axles will determine how much tongue weight is necessary for a good track. Look at boat railers. Typically they have about 5% but there axles are further back than most equipment trailers. My trailer if loaded level regardless of weight will track perfect. So tongue weight is really not a factor to me. Time and experience will tell what any givin trailer will need to pull straight.

Diamondpilot · Mar 8, 2009

wkpoor said:
I realize that is the excepted standard but I don't think every trailer needs that much. And some may need more. The distance from the hitch to the axle/axles will determine how much tongue weight is necessary for a good track. Look at boat railers. Typically they have about 5% but there axles are further back than most equipment trailers. My trailer if loaded level regardless of weight will track perfect. So tongue weight is really not a factor to me. Time and experience will tell what any givin trailer will need to pull straight.

That is not what I find. I have seen many with 5% but they tow like crap at 65mph or faster, darn near scary. Most of what we sell has 10% to 15% with more leaning to 15%. The reason a boat trailer has the axles so far back is 80% of the weight is in the last 1/5 of a boat. We pick boats up with a crane a few times a year. The boats weigh between 10,000# to 30,000# using a spreader bar. The spreader bar is like the thing on a engine hoist that allows you to balance the load. On a 30' boat weighing 13,000# for example your CG will be about 6' from the transom. The transom is the rear of the boat for you land lovers.

Chris

wkpoor · Mar 8, 2009

My Chris Craft weights without fuel and other stuff 4800lbs. boat and trailer. I can lift the tongue myself so it obviously isn't 480lbs. Its tows perfect at any speed. Most of the boat I've been around don't carry the 10% and I do realize why the axles are far back and why they are able to get away with that. I still think its a case by case basis. Some trailers just plain track well regardless of how they are loaded and some are finicky. My neighbor has a cheap built 12' tandem that appears to be glued to the truck no matter how it loaded. Others I've towed have to be weighted forward alot or they wander. Maybe how well the axles are lined up umungst other factors determines how much is necessary.

Diamondpilot · Mar 8, 2009

wkpoor said:
My Chris Craft weights without fuel and other stuff 4800lbs. boat and trailer. I can lift the tongue myself so it obviously isn't 480lbs. Its tows perfect at any speed. Most of the boat I've been around don't carry the 10% and I do realize why the axles are far back and why they are able to get away with that. I still think its a case by case basis. Some trailers just plain track well regardless of how they are loaded and some are finicky. My neighbor has a cheap built 12' tandem that appears to be glued to the truck no matter how it loaded. Others I've towed have to be weighted forward alot or they wander. Maybe how well the axles are lined up umungst other factors determines how much is necessary.

If you can lift it up its not on the the right trailer or if on the right trailer its not on properly. I picked up a Ebbtide 2300 Mystique on a Custom Built Tennessee tandem axle trailer in Chicago 2 years ago with a F-150. It was empty with less than 5 gallons of fuel and weighed right at 6,000#, towed like a dream and the guy who rode up with me commented also how well it towed.

Took it to my house, topped it off with fuel, water, anchor, gear, ect and hooked it up to the same truck and it towed like crap. Tracked fine but made the rear of the truck bounce all over the place. Call Tennessee and the tech told me to move the front bow stop forward 4". Made all the difference in the world. Probably added 500# of tongue weight. Just moving the CG forward 4" really put some weight on the pin/ball due to the arm/lever length of the trailer.

If you are happy then leave it but its not right. As you and I both know you should have between 10-15% of the weight on the tongue. It may handle fine behind your 1 ton van but put it behind a Trail Blazer and could be a dangerous hand full.

Chris

wkpoor · Mar 8, 2009

It may handle fine behind your 1 ton van but put it behind a Trail Blazer and could be a dangerous hand full.

That is probably the other part of the equation. Me and my bro did towing tests with the same boat (6000# boat and trailer) with my van and his 1/2 Silverato. My van was very stable feeling and his truck had some wiggle in the but end.
Also amazed at how well my van can pull from the ramp vs a PU truck. Both 2WD his will spin and mine never has on any ramp.

Diamondpilot · Mar 8, 2009

wkpoor said:
That is probably the other part of the equation. Me and my bro did towing tests with the same boat (6000# boat and trailer) with my van and his 1/2 Silverato. My van was very stable feeling and his truck had some wiggle in the but end.
Also amazed at how well my van can pull from the ramp vs a PU truck. Both 2WD his will spin and mine never has on any ramp.

Yep, your 1 ton is what is making it tolerable. You should look into moving the boat forward if the axles are fixed by moving the bow stop. Or on some older boats the axles could be move to a variety of different locations. They has 5 or so sets of hole to bolt the spring purchase too. Just loosen the bolts and use a come-along to move the axle aft. Just check to make sure you can still lower the motor all the way down without contacting the trailer cross brace.

Your brothers 2 wheel drive Silverado would greatly appreciate more tongue weight. It would help with wheel spin on the ramp and make it tow much nicer. On the ramp angle of 30 deg or more with such little tongue weight on that trailer it will be pulling up on the ball if the weight is really low. I have seen a trailer come off a ball on the ramp and tip back on the motor. The guy forgot to couple it and drove nearly 5 miles with no issues until he went to back down. The safety chains held so we chalked the trailers wheels and 4 or 5 of us had to hang from the boats bow to get it to lower down on the ball as he backed up the SUV. He could not understand why it went down on the motor but at home on level ground when uncoupled it would stay on the tongue jack.

Also your boat should sit on the trailer with the transom having 2" of bunks minimum sticking out. If not when trailering your transom takes a beating with the weight of the engine/outdrive hanging off back there. You never want the bunks ending before the transom. On the boat I was talking about earlier the bunks were 2" shy of the transom. That was the first question the trailer tech asked me. That is why he wanted me to move the bow stop forward 4" so that it would leave 2" of bunk exposed.

Ok, enough boat talk, back to the original post although a boat is a load on a trailer that needs to be distributed and secured properly.

Chris

john_bud · Mar 8, 2009

wkpoor said:
I realize that is the excepted standard but I don't think every trailer needs that much. And some may need more. The distance from the hitch to the axle/axles will determine how much tongue weight is necessary for a good track. Look at boat railers. Typically they have about 5% but there axles are further back than most equipment trailers. My trailer if loaded level regardless of weight will track perfect. So tongue weight is really not a factor to me. Time and experience will tell what any givin trailer will need to pull straight.

Yes, boat trailers with the rear axles farther back tow differently than an equipment trailer.

And your point is.....?

Topic of discussion is equipment trailers and as the others have stated, 10% tongue weight is about right. Maybe more, maybe less ... that's true. But where do you start ? At 0% tongue weight that may be a dangerously unstable ride? Or at the normal value? Me, I'd rather start at the expected normal value and moderate from there. It's safer to have too much tongue weight than too little -- right?

jb

wkpoor · Mar 9, 2009

And your point is.....?

Topic of discussion is equipment trailers and as the others have stated, 10% tongue weight is about right. Maybe more, maybe less ... that's true. But where do you start ? At 0% tongue weight that may be a dangerously unstable ride? Or at the normal value? Me, I'd rather start at the expected normal value and moderate from there. It's safer to have too much tongue weight than too little -- right?

Actually my point is a 10K fully loaded trailer at 15% would be 1500lbs of tongue weight. Even at 10% and a 1000lbs. your into 1ton territory. So how are all these 1/2 and 3/4 ton bumper pulls able to do it? Then there is me with the 14K trailer. I have a titan hitch with a 2000lb ball mount which isn't the norm for most people. I guess thats where I'm coming from. Then think about all these SUV's out there supposedly towing 6-8K and there is no way they can handle the 10-15% tongue load.
I'm guessing may be at 1000lbs tongue when I'm loaded to 12K. I know thats considered light but it pulls perfect and I'm saying that because my axles are quite far back.

George2615 · Mar 9, 2009

wkpoor said:
Actually my point is a 10K fully loaded trailer at 15% would be 1500lbs of tongue weight. Even at 10% and a 1000lbs. your into 1ton territory. So how are all these 1/2 and 3/4 ton bumper pulls able to do it? Then there is me with the 14K trailer. I have a titan hitch with a 2000lb ball mount which isn't the norm for most people. I guess thats where I'm coming from. Then think about all these SUV's out there supposedly towing 6-8K and there is no way they can handle the 10-15% tongue load.
I'm guessing may be at 1000lbs tongue when I'm loaded to 12K. I know thats considered light but it pulls perfect and I'm saying that because my axles are quite far back.

My 3/4T can handle 1000 lb. tongue weight and 1500 lb. with a weight distribution hitch. Its on the hitch label.

Diamondpilot · Mar 9, 2009

wkpoor said:
Actually my point is a 10K fully loaded trailer at 15% would be 1500lbs of tongue weight. Even at 10% and a 1000lbs. your into 1ton territory. So how are all these 1/2 and 3/4 ton bumper pulls able to do it? Then there is me with the 14K trailer. I have a titan hitch with a 2000lb ball mount which isn't the norm for most people. I guess thats where I'm coming from. Then think about all these SUV's out there supposedly towing 6-8K and there is no way they can handle the 10-15% tongue load.
I'm guessing may be at 1000lbs tongue when I'm loaded to 12K. I know thats considered light but it pulls perfect and I'm saying that because my axles are quite far back.

I love the Titan Hitch, have 2 of them. One on the F-250 after breaking the factory and one on the F-350. Actually its not a Titan, its Fords 2.5" hitch with the same load specs as the Titan.

As for the SUV with 10%. Most have a Class III Hitch which is rated for 5,000# 500# tongue weight. With WD Hitch it jumps to 7,500# and 750# tongue weight or even 10,000# and 1,000# tongue weight on a Pickup with a Class III/IV.

Chris