Shared Roads and other issues.

[pappy19]

This is a very interesting thread. I am a seasoned right of way agent that deals with easements every day. Just before I became one, I had a shared road easement with 2 other landowners. They had an easement across my property to access theirs. One of them, the 1st one was a dipstick. His claim was that since he was the first driveway along the common road that he only should pay 1/3 of 1/3, since the rest of us had to continue on. This was not only for general road upkeep, but also for snow removal, which on bad snow years, could amount to a chunk of change. Long and short is that my nice neighbor and I got together and we built a new road on my property to the county road and let the pantload have his own road.

As far as your situation is concerned, I would recommend the following:

1) Get a Registered survey on your property and register it at the county recorder's office, ASAP.

2) After the recorded survey, and assuming the grapes are on your property, have an attorney write the trespasser a letter of demand to remove the grapes by a certain date(I recommend 2 weeks), or you will charge him to remove them and put a lien on his property for those charges along with the attorney fees.

3) Unless the easement lists that the buttwipe as the recipient of the road maintenance money each year, then have your friendly landowner sign a statement, notarized, that you will be the "lead maintenance manager" for the road and you complete one of the same instruments. Your attorney can draft this up. Record both intruments at the recorder's office and after recording, send buttwipe a copy. If he is designated as the recipient of the maintenance money, then you and your friendly neighbor should send him a certified letter stating that unless he complies with the terms of the easement to fix the road, then you will cease to provide any funds for the road until he fixes the road.

4) I would highly recommend that if you and your friendly neighbor have a path to get to the county road along your property line, that you do so as soon as possible.

5) It is also possible to charge for the trespass of the grapes for the length of time that he was under trespass and bill him for a reasonable amount of rent, usually at least 10% of the value per acre of your property per year during the entire time of the trespass, plus attorney fees.

6) Once you obtain the registered survey, and it is recorded, you should talk to the county engineer, county procecutor, sheriff, and your local county commissioner and let them know what you are about to begin, why and by what means you intend to initiate your legal rights.

Good luck and keep us informed.

 

[thingy]

You and the good neighbor should just get together,fix that 100 yd section and send him a bill for 1/3 of it by cerified mail or something,,[not that you probably ever would take it much farther than that,just maybe down the road and it would be a record],,you gotta tractor,,just mainly need gravel I bet,,what 4-500 dollars or so ,split two ways? than you and good neighbor can use your driveways without tearing up your stuff. Probably only have to do it every 3-4 years,probably won't cost as much next time whatever it costs this time would be one good thing,,,,just the price of doing bussiness as they say,,its real hard to make somebody do something if they don't want to,,,thingy

 

[Catman1]

Pappy19

If you have an easement thru another persons property, do you have the right to maintain the road (do what you need to do to keep it up or fix it) without permission from that landowner if he is a problem?

Thanks

 

[pappy19]

Pappy19

If you have an easement thru another persons property, do you have the right to maintain the road (do what you need to do to keep it up or fix it) without permission from that landowner if he is a problem?

Thanks

You have the right to maintain the road for the easement width and length that you have, whether it is stated in your deed or in a seperate easemenr document, no question and you would not need permission from anyone to do maintenance unless the grant of easement specifically states such a condition. I would have a copy of the easement or easement language with me while doing the maintenance to show anyone that might challange you.

 

[Catman1]

Thanks Pappy19 for the info.

 

[thingy]

I forgot about this shared theory,,,send him a bill for whole thing on his section,,he won't pay unless made to,,but down the road,,you might have him owing you guys 2-3,000,,than,,maybe,,you might want to push it farther,,but for now,if you want to drive on it,you guys have got to fix it up,,its your drive way to,,,and he does kinda have a point,,he doesn't get to use you guys sections,or has no use for rest of road,,you guys need his part,he don't need your part,,,and who knows,,maybe he only drives out once a week,,maybe you guys use it alot more with bigger things? As far as trash,,well,take it down to end of road,[next to his place],and set it out and if dogs get in it and tear bags up,,well,tell him your sorry,,but you ain't got enough money after fixing his section to buy lumber to build trash box to keep stuff out,,,thingy

 

[rox]

Before we purchesed the ~4.5 acers of our property we had it surveyed at a cost to us of $2K

we found out that there was nearly 3/4 of an acer that was not deeded to either myself nor the neighbor and the area comprises a triangle that my 400' driveway and a "sizeable" portion of his front yard sits on.

so you can understand what happened when a pink stake showed up in in the middle of his front yard... (he showed up at our surveyer's office asking questions)

it took another $800 to have a custom title search done, and a layer to draw up the paperwork to properly dead my driveway to me, and my neighbors front yard to him.

Should pins go missing (the neighbor digs them up) the surveyer will (well mine will) come out and resurvey and replace them for fee.


a "shared" drive is no ones specific property. He cant keep you from fixing the bad portion on your own. (we covered this when there was talk of the neighbor wanting to use my driveway to access his property, i was DEAD set against it. we were able to work around that issue, he does not have any right to my driveway)

IF you want the grapes removed, youll need to get it surveyed, then have a lawyer send him a letter stating that his property is crossing the line and give a reasonable amount of time to have the property removed. (note a solution can also include him purchesing the property from you) Should that not occur you are free to remove it by any means nessacary.

A recent story about a developer my wife is working with....

He is putting in a new subdivision, and ran accross a fiber optic line 35' outside the area it should have been. It ment a major redesign to detention basin that resided in that location. (an addtional 10K in engineering cost). He inquired with the phone company about moving it. they said, shure you pay to move it, could run as much as $10mill. He set out to find the easment they had for it. (again laywers that specialize in land disupute, happend to be the same one we personally used for our driveway issue) are involved. Turns out the phone company has NO easment. Therefore the devloper was able to FORCE the phone company to purchase an easment from them, MOVE the line at THERE expense, AND pay for damages due to the project being held up.

IN short, when it comes to property disputes, survey's and lawyers, while expensive, are the proper and best way to go about it.

You are right. We don't fill our own cavaties not set our own broken bones, we all hate to spend money on lawyers fees but when we have, when it is all over and done with we did get our money's worth, same for surveying. Sure you can come close using plats etc. but there is nothing like the certantity of seeing thos lttle flags a professional surveyor puts in. I would always rather bit the bullet and pay the freight and see my actual lot lines as determined by my surveyor. I just need to know for certain where my lot lines are.

 

[BillyP]

You have the right to maintain the road for the easement width and length that you have, whether it is stated in your deed or in a seperate easemenr document, no question and you would not need permission from anyone to do maintenance unless the grant of easement specifically states such a condition. I would have a copy of the easement or easement language with me while doing the maintenance to show anyone that might challange you.

pappy, Catman brings up a good question and you answered it. Now let's turn the tides.

1) Does the land owner have the right "not" to maintain the easement?

2) Do these easement laws change from state to state?

 

[Catman1]

Good question BillyP. I had been wondering about your first question.

Pappy19, does the landowner maintain any responsibility concerning the easement? Can he/she allow the easement land to become unusable (say the road caves in) or does the responsibility to make sure passage is available fall on the easement user.

 

[Jstpssng]

pappy, Catman brings up a good question and you answered it. Now let's turn the tides.

1) Does the land owner have the right "not" to maintain the easement?

In the original post, he stated "The deed might (recall it saying that but have yet to find the wording) say that we all pay $100 a year for common upkeep." Assuming that is indeed the case, it won't change unless all parties sign off on it.