Shed wiring question

[rbstern]

Getting ready to do a shed project that has the following parameters:

1) Power to shed will be from an exterior, post-mounted meter and breaker panel.

2) Distance from panel to shed anticipated to be approximately 50'.

3) Shed needs two circuits:
a) 20A dedicated to an HVAC split system (can be either 240v or 120v) and
b) 20A circuit for three outlets.

My question: Does this application require a subpanel in the shed? The NEC is a bit tricky to interpret for a specific case: It seems that if the HVAC is 240v, it is not considered a parallel feeder with the second 20A/120v line, and both circuits to the shed can be wired directly to the external breaker panel, without a need for a subpanel.

I don't have a problem doing a subpanel, if it's required by code, but the shed will be a temporary setup, and since I have a breaker panel nearby with ample capacity, so I don't want to overkill this, if I don't have to.

 

[ponytug]

For non-professionals at least, the NEC is not simple in my opinion, but I believe that you need a sub-panel. AC units alone get a waiver, but do need a disconnect nearby, but you have more than that. Therefore, I think you need the sub panel. More here, if you want;
Sub-panel, MLO or Main-Breaker requirements

I am not an NEC expert!

All the best,

Peter

 

[rbstern]

For non-professionals at least, the NEC is not simple in my opinion, but I believe that you need a sub-panel. AC units alone get a waiver, but do need a disconnect nearby, but you have more than that. Therefore, I think you need the sub panel. More here, if you want;
Sub-panel, MLO or Main-Breaker requirements

I am not an NEC expert!

All the best,

Peter

I think that discussion you linked focuses on a different issue: Whether or not the sub-panel needs a main breaker to protect the feed and circuits in the subpanel. Pretty sure, with only two circuits, I wouldn't need a main breaker in a sub-panel. The breaker in the source panel (on the post I described) provides the needed protection.

My question is whether or not the subpanel is required.

EDIT: Aware of the need for AC disconnect.

 

[JPRambo]

What is the amp draw of the mini split(?) On 120volt?
If only 50' I think I would put a 2/4 circuit panel and put 240v/30a 4 wire to it.

 

[Topzide]

If 50' from post panel, just run a 20amp and what you need for hvac from there. No different than in house with panel on opposite side. As long as proper gauge wire for loads and length and you said was temporary. If you had a sub panel laying around, use it. Not sure if a local code would need more. A lot of mobile homes are set up with panel outside on pole.

 

[rbstern]

What is the amp draw of the mini split(?) On 120volt?
If only 50' I think I would put a 2/4 circuit panel and put 240v/30a 4 wire to it.

IIRC, 17 amps on 120v, and 9 amps on 240v.

 

[JPRambo]

IIRC, 17 amps on 120v, and 9 amps on 240v.

I think you will end up with nuisances tripping of circuit breaker at that amperage. Keeping it below 16 is recommended at 80% of 20 amps.

 

[MossRoad]

I think that discussion you linked focuses on a different issue: Whether or not the sub-panel needs a main breaker to protect the feed and circuits in the subpanel. Pretty sure, with only two circuits, I wouldn't need a main breaker in a sub-panel. The breaker in the source panel (on the post I described) provides the needed protection.

My question is whether or not the subpanel is required.

EDIT: Aware of the need for AC disconnect.

I'd guess that if you have a panel at the meter on the pole, that is considered your main panel, and any panel after that would be wired as a sub-panel.

 

[LouNY]

I wouldn't bother with a sub panel.
I'd run a 12/3 with grd for 240 v for the AC and a 12/2 with grd for the 20 amp receptacles.

Now you mentioned 3 120V receptacles are they going to be heavily loaded were a single 20 Amp breaker will not be sufficient?

If so then I'd consider a sub panel feed with a 30 Amp two pole on #10 wire or go whole hog and #6 with a 50 Amp,
then add the breakers you need at that panel.

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

Getting ready to do a shed project that has the following parameters:
1) Power to shed will be from an exterior, post-mounted meter and breaker panel.
2) Distance from panel to shed anticipated to be approximately 50'.
3) Shed needs two circuits:
a) 20A dedicated to an HVAC split system (can be either 240v or 120v) and
b) 20A circuit for three outlets.
My question: Does this application require a subpanel in the shed? The NEC is a bit tricky to interpret for a specific case: It seems that if the HVAC is 240v, it is not considered a parallel feeder with the second 20A/120v line, and both circuits to the shed can be wired directly to the external breaker panel, without a need for a subpanel.

I don't have a problem doing a subpanel, if it's required by code, but the shed will be a temporary setup, and since I have a breaker panel nearby with ample capacity, so I don't want to overkill this, if I don't have to.

Yes, a sub panel will be required. NEC 225.30