Shop slab additions!

[rangerfredbob]

Ok, I need ideas in the next couple weeks, hopefully a couple in the next couple days... I would post in my shop build post but I think some of it is already in there and I don't want to dig... plus thought this might be interesting... I think some of the ideas were in Big Barn's thread, but that's WAY too much searching...

Anywho, I'm building a 36'x48' pole barn shop with a 2 post lift planned and a 6" slab with rebar, hopefully pouring this month!

I want to add some sockets in the floor for grinder pedestals and frame straightening uses. I liked the idea of putting some chain in the bottom of the socket for frame straightening so that's in the plan, my current question is what size to make the socket? I would think the most handy would be 2.5" OD square tubing (AKA "Receiver stock") so I could stick 2" square tube in it for pedestals and such, thoughts? Going to try to get the metal for that Saturday if I can...

I had bought a brass floor mount outlet a year ago thinking about adding it but am rethinking that...

Am already going to do PEX for in floor heating, so that's covered, I need to order that...

Thanks!

 

[mikester]

Insulate your floor minimum of 2 inches and use a vapour barrier.

 

[3Ts]

As for floor mount electrical outlets. My experience with them has not been good, the builder has not been able to get them set in the concrete right and they end up tilted. Then the builder also can't get the height set right. If you do go that route, be sure you have a guy that has done several of them before. Otherwise they'll end being a trip hazard even without anything plugged in. I'm having the one in our house living room plugged and redoing the floor.

 

[Rustyiron]

I put in "sockets" that I welded up with some rebar to hit the surrounding concrete. I bought the longest reciever tube I could find and cut it down to shorter pieces. Regular tube has a weld seam that will interfere with sliding a 2" into it.

Chain pots, I ran into a guy scraping a bunch of automotive stuff (at the scrap yard waiting for the scales) I bought about 8 of them for cheap and have them in my slab now.
All of these slab goodies only get used maybe once a year, but when you need them, there's no substitute and with radiant, coming back in and busting up concrete to add something is risky. In my previous shop I cast in a 4-5' piece of rr track (up side down) and that was very handy for some stratening situations.
Take a ton of pictures just before you pour, then when you think you have enough, take some more. Be sure you include references points. I'm in a situation where I'm adding a 2 post lift 10 years later and am sooo happy to have good pictures.

 

[BackRoad]

Mikester, you said to insulate...and Rusty Iron's photos looks to have 2 inch foam vertically on side walls.

Is that what you're meaning?

Not thinking you put foam under the floor also - is it just plastic vapor barrier over the stone fill?

 

[Rustyiron]

Both, they call it a "thermal break". I have 2" under the slab also. Some guys will just do an 8' perimeter, and foam is expensive but well worth it especially if you have plans to be there for years to come. :thumbsup:

 

[BackRoad]

Rusty Iron, that floor you laid looks pretty well done...welded bracket supports for the rebar, foam holding it up around the edges, nicely tied down PEX. Sweet!

Have you used the floor heating and does the density/layout of tubing work for you?

Sorry, not intending to hijack the thread about floor and pedestal anchors!

 

[Hay Dude]

I put in "sockets" that I welded up with some rebar to hit the surrounding concrete. I bought the longest reciever tube I could find and cut it down to shorter pieces. Regular tube has a weld seam that will interfere with sliding a 2" into it.

Chain pots, I ran into a guy scraping a bunch of automotive stuff (at the scrap yard waiting for the scales) I bought about 8 of them for cheap and have them in my slab now.
All of these slab goodies only get used maybe once a year, but when you need them, there's no substitute and with radiant, coming back in and busting up concrete to add something is risky. In my previous shop I cast in a 4-5' piece of rr track (up side down) and that was very handy for some stratening situations.
Take a ton of pictures just before you pour, then when you think you have enough, take some more. Be sure you include references points. I'm in a situation where I'm adding a 2 post lift 10 years later and am sooo happy to have good pictures.
View attachment 678629 View attachment 678630View attachment 678631

Looks great. I just did a floor with rebar, WWF and foam insulation.
Soon will come the succinct “expert” concrete inspectors telling us “amateur contractors” that rebar isnt needed

 

[3Ts]

I'm curious - you have both rebar and mesh for your reinforcement, do you need both? I always thought one or the other was sufficient. I've never seen both used. Also, what does your concrete guy say about having the reinforcement on chairs, most of the ones I've talked with say they can pull it up into the concrete during the pour so they don't trip over the rebar during the pour. (I've never seen pulling it up work all that well though.)

 

[mikester]

Mikester, you said to insulate...and Rusty Iron's photos looks to have 2 inch foam vertically on side walls.

Is that what you're meaning?

Not thinking you put foam under the floor also - is it just plastic vapor barrier over the stone fill?

You want vapour barrier AND insulating foam under the slab. I can't tell from the pics, looks like concrete blocks under the slab. It might sound expensive to do it now but you will save it in heating bills over the years. You want the vapour barrier to keep the moisture levels down inside the buiding.

Lately I've seen builders using 2 inches of closed cell spray foam under the slab and onto the walls, makes a good thermal break.

 

[rangerfredbob]

I'm too deep in now to put foam under the slab, but I am putting in vapor barrier, just bought it a few minutes ago...

I know it would be easier to heat with foam, but it's only frozen here a couple times so far this year and normally doesn't get lower than the high 20's so I'm not too worried, just need the edge off the nip and a roof to keep the rain and wind out, I've been working on stuff in the driveway too long.

I was thinking about the $13 receiver tube from Harbor Freight, I'd only need 3-6 of them depending if I want to put pockets in one or two bays... being 12" long just cut them in half...

 

[mred2]

My boss built a shop. He put two I-beams in the floor, about 20 feet long. they were set about 5 feet apart. about 3 feet from each end was a hole cut in it. A piece of 8 inch metal pipe was cut and put on end over the hole. Concrete poured. A metal cap was made and put over each pipe end. So the holes with caps were even with the floor. You can take the cap off and hook a chain into the I-beam. Concrete is 8 inches thick. I am not sure what it will hold down, but he has a 10 ton crane overhead. Some people can have all the toys.

 

[Rustyiron]

Rusty Iron, that floor you laid looks pretty well done...welded bracket supports for the rebar, foam holding it up around the edges, nicely tied down PEX. Sweet!

Have you used the floor heating and does the density/layout of tubing work for you?

Thanks, and this is my first radiant I've done or experienced and it's very nice. Last shop I built was insulated walls only with a propane ceiling hung heater- pretty useless with 16' ceiling, and the ceiling fans blowing down basically just felt like a cold draft not to mention opening a 12x12 garage door (even at a Nascar pit stop pace) put you back to zero. And this was in central MD.
The radiant system was professionally designed and in the shop is all at 18" spacing but he knew my insulation values for the slab ceiling and walls.

 

[Rustyiron]

I'm curious - you have both rebar and mesh for your reinforcement, do you need both? I always thought one or the other was sufficient. I've never seen both used. Also, what does your concrete guy say about having the reinforcement on chairs, most of the ones I've talked with say they can pull it up into the concrete during the pour so they don't trip over the rebar during the pour. (I've never seen pulling it up work all that well though.)

Your right, they never pull it up! :laughing: With radiant heat that becomes more important.
I like steel in the slab, maybe old fashioned but for the most part, all concrete cracks and rebar and wire keep it together (I've always been told) and this being my first with radiant tubes in it really gave me concern. The wire gave me a perfect layout for tying the tube to and in my opinion, slightly providing some protection during the pour.
I have a friend that's a fairly big concrete contractor and he got me a full bundle (1 ton) of #4 bar, the bolsters (chairs) and the 6x6 wire panels and other misc. materials at his cost.

 

[Rustyiron]

Mikester what you're seeing is concrete. They are used 2" thick blue foam panels with a 1/2" layer of some type of concrete on the top that came off a commercial flat roof. I'm not sure if they were used for walkways or in place of stone ballast with an insulating bonus. They were very cheap compared to new and were t&g on all 4 sides. The poly is under them.

 

[rangerfredbob]

Oh, and like Big Barns thread, don't worry about threadjacking... any tips are welcome, some I would implement if it wasn't just too late...

What's the thoughts about getting chain pots like THIS, putting a plug out of 3" ABS where I want them and installing those? Has to be better than what I could hack together for $30 each and the chain on that is replaceable...

Still thinking of putting some plugs of receiver tubing in

I've heard of putting I beam in so when welding you just weld to the beam for the ground and weld what you're working on to the beam and just go to town, that would be nifty but I think conventional methods should work for me... I Might think about grabbing some steel pipe and putting some 1/2" or 3/4" pipe at the entrance to the garage with some rebar legs stuck to it so the entrance doesn't get chipped doing silly stuff...

 

[dstig1]

If you are going to add a lift you need space that you know is free of tubing to drill into the slab. I figured out a likely lift ahead of time and laid out where it would sit, then I compressed the tubing layouts in that area to either side of the mounting space so leave a tube-free zone. I took measurements and photos...now if I could only find them...

 

[rangerfredbob]

I downloaded LoopCAD and have it up currently with a box around where the lift will be to avoid that area, don't need to make a mistake like that early on

 

[Rustyiron]

Ranger those chain pots look like what I have and I'm with you on just buying them over trying to make something.
I really don't know what their intended use is or their recommend installation is, but somewhere along the line I think I heard that in setting up a body/frame area that they commonly are installed in existing slabs and use a core drill for the holes. Are you thinking (with the PVC pipe) that it would be just a form and you'd pull it out after pouring then installing the pots later?
I've found that I use my 2" receiver's the most. I have a pair of them about 4' apart and a couple of uses are plugging in a 2 legged "sawhorse" and using a single hole to stabilize my Hossfeld bender. Then there's the 4 plates that I have cast in that are handy to be able to weld something to the floor then cutting it off and grinding smooth when done.
And the least used are the chain pots. Everyone's needs will be different and the first time you need something like this it'll just make your day. :thumbsup:

 

[Hay Dude]

What is your pex heat source (electric, gas, wood, solar, etc)?
I would like to have my next barn with slab heated by roof mounted solar panels and maybe a nat gas backup????