small sq baler input HP

[jimg]

Thanx for posting JDs reply. I wonder who made the choices on how to spec the balers? In my experience marketing/sales doesnt always listen well to engineering. Its the cold dead fish thing vs sushi and coming to a happy point is usally an unhappy compromise (for enineering). I have extensive experience in this...on one side of the table a bunch of tech-nerds and on the other touchy feely sales and marketing types. Everybody's speaking english but no one is communicating. LOL....

As w/ any startup youd like to spend only whats necessary to guard cash flow. I was hoping that I could comfortably use a TN. Perhaps I should rethink my choice of baler. Hay is going to be my main business and I want reliable, efficient but cost effective equipment. Once Im established itll be easier to justify bigger machines. I understand that I need to get it out of the field and all so bigger equipment would be good but if Im not in business then whats the point? I guess my hang up is knowing where to put the money...baler or tractor. Running a business is hard work...but well worth it .

 

[Robert_in_NY]

The TL isn't that much more then a TN but I strongly urge you to buy the best equipment you can up front as it will be more efficient and cheaper in the long haul. Otherwise you are always spending money to upgrade.

 

[rambler]

I run a small cash grain farm with some cattle on the side. Bale 3-4000 square grass & alfalfa, 1-2000 straw bales for myself for the most part.

Hey, best way to learn how a baler works is to stand on the hayrack behind it for a few years. Come on over, I'll let you get an education. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

So, how much hay are you planning on making, & how do you plan to collect the bales - accumulator, grab, NH bale wagon, thrower, ....

If you want to start small & work up, for gosh sakes stop looking at new stuff, & get some good used stuff for 40% off. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I don't know of any cases in farm machinery or in railroad equipment where lighter is better.... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

--->Paul

 

[jimg]

>>Hey, best way to learn how a baler works is to stand on the hayrack
>>behind it for a few years. Come on over, I'll let you get an
>>education. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
LOL...Ill keep that generous offer in mind.

>>So, how much hay are you planning on making, &
Im thinking about 80-100ac in the SE.

>>how do you plan to collect the bales - accumulator, grab, NH bale
>>wagon, thrower, ....
Either a bale wagon, thrower and wagon or bale baskets.

>>If you want to start small & work up, for gosh sakes stop looking at
>>new stuff, & get some good used stuff for 40% off. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Yes, that was my plan (start small)...I was also going to buy all used to begin w/. The only reason I was looking at new was to get an idea of capability as finding specs for old equip is very difficult. I just want to make sure I dont over (or under) spec my equipment. As i get closer in my plan Ill be asking many more questions.

>>I don't know of any cases in farm machinery or in railroad
>>equipment where lighter is better.... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
I was speaking of tractors (as in tractor tailer). Was at a Paccar open house last yr and one of the presentations focused on lost styrofoam casting. The part in particular was a frame brace/steering box bracket that was reengineered to become an investment cast AL part which req'ed almost no machining. It replaced a much neavier steel part. Its long to go into the entire thing here but it was all very carefully thought out and tested. I think Ill be goin gto the open house again this yr...very interesting stuff for sure and lots to learn. My hats off to the brilliant engineers who figure this stuff out.

 

[Banjo]

Once again a topic has come up that's right in line with questions I have /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.

FWIW, my current NH271 baler worked just fine behind my AC D14 last year, which is about 30 HP. It never seemed that HP was an issue. Interestingly the engine powered version of this baler had a 17HP Wisconsin Engine.

However, I'm thinking of "upgrading" to a higher capacity baler. I had fairly heavy windrows and it seemed that I had to bale very slowly, often down to first gear. Given that this was my first time baling, I'm still not sure how hard I can push things, so maybe I was just being a whimp! The other contributing factor could be that just about all the chains on the baler have slack in them, even with the tensioners at max. The baler tied fine with 10,000 twine, but missed a few when I switched to 7200, especially when I was going faster.

Anyway, based on last year I'm thinking that in addition to being able to bale faster, I'd like to have a baler with a wider pickup (easier with some of my winding windrows (blush)), and the "super sweep" as I'd like to grab all the little bits.

The references to stroke speed as an indicator of capacity was the first reference I'd seen on this. The NH literature doesn't seem to give any specs on capacity, and the 271 Operators Manual doesn't either. It's listed as 70 SPM and 56" pickup.

I now have an IH 674 tractor as well which is about 60 HP and 5,000# so I figure I should be able to manage most balers. I'll have about 60 acres of my hay to do this year (hopefully), and might do some other fields if I find I have time. I'm a one man operation, which is the main reason I'd like to be able to bale quicker. I'm going to be picking up with my stackwagon.

In looking on-line to get a sense of what's available, it seems that maybe a 320 might be a good option. Am I right in guessing that it was near the top of the line in it's day (early 80's I think)? In one ad they mention 105 SPM, and a 68" pickup. Any other suggestions? How would a 320 compare to a 565, 315, or 326 for instance?

Does anyone have pointers to a site that would have specs for these older balers?

Thanks in advance, Andrew

 

[scott_vt]

Jimg,
Here is a pic of a 1939 Farmall A pulling bailer and haywagon.

scotty

ps I wouldnt reccomend this but it could be done, especially on a flat.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

The 320 was a good baler as was the 326. Either baler would fit you nicely. NH sped up the balers during this time frame but later slowed them back down with the 570, 575's.

However, I would look at fixing up your 271 and seeing how far you can push it before you sink $3-5k into another baler.

Also, a 60 horse tractor is the minimum NH wants in front of a 570 in order to run it close to potential. Most people I have talked to want at least 90 horses in front of the 575 but would rather have a 100 horse or more tractor in front to take advantage of the capacity of the 575.

 

[gf5205]

About five years ago I upgraded from a 1968 NH 270 to a 1988 JD 328. The 328 can handle much more hay than the 270 - larger windrows at higher speeds. The manual says 40 HP min, more if you're pulling a wagon. I've had no problem pulling it with a Ford 3600 (42 PTO) and am now using a JD 5205 (48 PTO). The NH 270 definately took lesS HO to run. For years I used an IH 300, it worked hard, but was okay with a wagon on behind.
Greg

 

[robert1]

I bale with a hayliner 270 and a 38 hp IH 424 with no problem at all. Been doing it for four years so far. My hay wagons usually hold about 100 bales or so.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

I guess I am not sure what you are implying?

If you are trying to say people don't need 75 horses in front of a 575 then you are right, they don't. But to use that baler to capacity then you will want at least a 90 horse tractor in front of it. You can get by with less but it is harder on the tractor and you are not as efficient.

My grandfather used a MF 135 to pull his old NH baler around. Dropped the bales on the ground but baled hay on a hill and went as slow as the tractor would go. If you are in the business to make hay then you need to be efficient. If all you do is bale a few acres for your own use then you don't need all the newer, high capacity equipment.