Smoke detectors?

   / Smoke detectors?
  • Thread Starter
#11  
I'd rather have you all here complaining about the inconveniences of smoke detectors, rather than you not being here because you didn't have them. ;)

The problem is when they become too much of a nuisance people defeat them -- unplug them and take the batteries out, or put tape over the sensors. Then they're not doing any good at all.
 
   / Smoke detectors? #12  
We need to replace our smoke detectors also, have not decided which brand yet or which type.. My wife does not like me on the ladder so she goes up, takes it off the wall and hands it down to me for battery replacement, I replace said battery, hand it back to her to be re installed..
 
   / Smoke detectors? #13  
The reason Smoke Detectors are mounted 1' from the ceiling (and not lower on inconveniently high ceilings) is because of the volume of smoke required to fill the space above the detector before it trips. The larger the "gap" from detector to ceiling means the greater and more advanced the fire conditions would have become before you are alerted to the fire.

Yep, I understand that.

The reason Hardwired units have a battery back-up is not in the likelihood of a fire during an (unrelated) power outage but rather if the fire caused the power failure (to the building or just the unit) that it will still operate for a short period as a stand alone device.

I get that but the battery in either hardwired or standalone units has power to alarm plenty long enough for you to get out of the house. I see no reason for hardwired units in a home.

...

And the reason you want linked detectors is to alert you to a fire as quickly as possible - i.e. you're asleep on one end of the house when a fire starts on another floor at the opposite end of the house. Having several non-linked units could allow the fire to have a very large head start before you are alerted or even worse you could be overcome by CO and other poisonous gasses from a remotely located fire before ever being awakened by the closer smoke detectors.

Depending on who's studies you read a free burning fire that has all the fuel & oxygen it needs will double in size every 15 to 60 seconds. Every bit of advanced warning you can get (especially when you're asleep) is critical.

You should always have a primary and back-up exit route from bedrooms and a designated meeting point for your family. Never rely on what detector is going of to guide you out of a fire.


I don't know about your house but there is no way anyone in my house wouldn't be woken up by a single unit alarming anywhere in the house. They are amazingly loud. And I repeat the reason I don't think they should all go off at once - yes we need 2 escape paths. WHICH do we choose when all the alarms are going off?? If only one goes off, we can go the opposite direction.

If you research you will find that very few fire fatalities were caused by the fire itself (i.e. they burnt to death) - the vast majority succumb to the fire gasses and byproducts of combustion long before the fire ever gets to them. This is why early / remote detection is so important.

I'll get off my soap box now, but I will say I'd rather have you all here complaining about the inconveniences of smoke detectors, rather than you not being here because you didn't have them. ;)

Thanks! :)

Stay safe everyone.

We need to replace our smoke detectors also, have not decided which brand yet or which type.. My wife does not like me on the ladder so she goes up, takes it off the wall and hands it down to me for battery replacement, I replace said battery, hand it back to her to be re installed..

So get the 10 year units. Neither of you will need to go up on the ladder for a very long time.
 
   / Smoke detectors? #14  
About a year ago, we bought a different home. I updated the four detectors to Kidde FireX 21007624 smoke or carbon monoxide. The units have voice alarms advising you of either threat, front loading battery so you do not have to remove the unit from the ceiling. I had to change the electrical plug on all of the fixtures that plugs into the back of the detectors. No false alarms in the year that we have had them. Found the best price on Ebay.
 
   / Smoke detectors? #15  
Before I start my responses, let me preface by saying that I agree with you all 100%. I am not trying to be argumentative (and hope I don't come across that way).
I'm just simply trying to answer the questions put forth and hopefully educate and keep good discussion going. I'm no expert by any means & am learning from you guys too. :thumbsup:
====================================================================

As a home owner / resident I hate them as much as you. I have vaulted ceilings for the great out of reach locations. I have linked units so one chirps, they all chirp (by the way if your units have an indicator LED on them, the one in alarm / low battery will be the one with the light on, the rest will just be audible alert only)

I recently replaced all my units AND put brand new batteries in them. Less than 2 weeks later one is alerting low battery - I swapped batteries between it and another unit as a test and both were happy - go figure.


The problem is when they become too much of a nuisance people defeat them -- unplug them and take the batteries out, or put tape over the sensors. Then they're not doing any good at all.

The issue is we as human beings are our own worst enemy. How may of those problems/conditions that turn the alarms into a nuisance are, in reality, our own fault? We pick the wrong type or mount them less than ideal locations, we don't change the batteries according to the instructions, we don't clean them, we paint over them, etc.

I'm not saying they couldn't be made better / work better. But working with what we have at the moment - we cause a lot of our own problems and then blame the units.


I get that but the battery in either hardwired or standalone units has power to alarm plenty long enough for you to get out of the house. I see no reason for hardwired units in a home.

Again - saving us from ourselves. Case in point - my grandmother used to never be able to hear the low battery chirp on hers. Now imagine if she were the shut-in type that no one ever checked on and the battery died then there was a fire and the alarm didn't go off because the battery was dead. Or the case where the battery is removed because it was chirping annoyingly all the time and the owner said I'll get a new one tomorrow. Months later still no battery and then there's a fire.

Hard wiring provides an alternate and (mostly) reliable power source.

I don't know about your house but there is no way anyone in my house wouldn't be woken up by a single unit alarming anywhere in the house. They are amazingly loud. And I repeat the reason I don't think they should all go off at once - yes we need 2 escape paths. WHICH do we choose when all the alarms are going off?? If only one goes off, we can go the opposite direction.

There have been several studies that show that children will sleep through the alarm on smoke detectors. Now imagine a scenario where the adults & children's bedrooms are separated. Linked units are more likely to alert parents to an issue on the children's side of the house sooner. Or if a fire were in a basement and the occupants bedrooms are on the 2nd floor.

In the area where I run, we have several million dollar "Mc Mansion" resort lake homes. (I am not fortunate enough to live in one) I'm not sure you could hear the smoke alarm in the "next room" in some of these places they're so large.

Again hard wiring provides the linking capability. Newer units are starting to utilize wireless linking technologies, but hard wired remains the simplest & most reliable.

As for the escape route - always take the shortest/quickest one to the outside unless you find it blocked by fire (which is usually a window, we're just creatures of habit and want to go thru the house to a door, and if you're on an above ground floor - fire escape ladders are a great idea).


In your specific situation (Home, age, health, family make-up, etc) a couple of old school stand alone units may in fact be all that you would need. Unfortunately the device manufacturers and code writers are forced to look at a much larger picture and then work to that lowest common denominator. That's why you have what we have so far. Is it perfect? Not by any means, but it's better than what we had.


I apologize if I seem too "preachy", but I've seen families standing barefoot in the snow with nothing left but what few clothes they were wearing from fires that could have been much less severe if smoke alarms had been present (or worked) and the fire detected sooner. I have unfortunately seen them lose more than just a home and possessions.

Like I said before, I am just as annoyed & inconvenienced by them as you or the next person but they are a small price to pay for all the potential "bad things" they could prevent and if all my "preaching" saves one family or even one person from going through all that, then brother show me to the pulpit. ;)
 
   / Smoke detectors? #16  
McMansion :laughing:
Yeah I can see where one of those could have a fire at one 'end' and a single alarm not heard at the other 'end'.
"Honey, do you hear something? Nah, it is just the wind go back to sleep".

Interesting note on the "alarm/low battery" LED, I didn't know that. There are 2 LEDs on our hardwired units. I presume the green one means power is on since they stay on. But the red ones, presumably the "alarm/low battery" LED, flash occasionally. I wonder if that is a battery test and why the "never been used" batteries go dead.

Hopefully I'll still have my hearing when I need to replace the ten year detectors in 9 years. And I'll need to replace the other 3 in 5 years when they have hit their 10 year lifespan.
 
   / Smoke detectors? #17  
May have been mentioned - just skimmed thread - but I had same problem with the 7 smoke detectors in our house. 9V backup batteries never fail other than 0230-0330hrs. And when one fails, the remainder seem to go within 60 days. At first, I replaced with regular name brand 9V alkaline batteries but was really upset appx 18 months later and the 0230 hrs chirping began again. We aren't prone to power outages & they rarely last more than a few hrs, so no idea if whatever the detector does to test backup battery state drains it a lot or what, but they just seem to go thru batteries way too fast. So finally about 5 yrs ago bought these: Amazon.com: Energizer Ultimate, Li 9V-2 Emod: Health & Personal Care

@ $7 ea really not thrilled, but at least 5 yrs now and not a single chirp from any of them.

Plus - it scares the bejesus out of my dog when they start to chirp. So not distressing him is good too.
 
   / Smoke detectors?
  • Thread Starter
#18  
The issue is we as human beings are our own worst enemy. How may of those problems/conditions that turn the alarms into a nuisance are, in reality, our own fault? We pick the wrong type or mount them less than ideal locations, we don't change the batteries according to the instructions, we don't clean them, we paint over them, etc.

I'm the OP who started this thread. An alternate title may have been "help me pick the right type of smoke detector." I thought I'd did a pretty good job of outlining my needs and issues, but I haven't gotten much in the way of specific advice so far. Any thoughts about what type/brand I should be looking at?
 
   / Smoke detectors? #19  
I'm the OP who started this thread. An alternate title may have been "help me pick the right type of smoke detector." I thought I'd did a pretty good job of outlining my needs and issues, but I haven't gotten much in the way of specific advice so far. Any thoughts about what type/brand I should be looking at?
Kidde combo unit from big box
 

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