smoke

greg_g · Jun 3, 2006

( on the safe side should I put so barrs stop leak in it? )

Personal preference based upon personal experience, but I say no. There's a 99.99% chance that there's nothing wrong with the INSIDE of your cooling system. If there's any problem with the coolant flow, it's almost certainly external and/or mechanical; blocked fins, misaligned fan shroud, loose belt, tall battery, breather intake, leaky cap, wrong thermostat, loose hose clamp. Except for that other 0.001% chance, Barr's cling to the inside of an otherwise perfectly good radiator - thereby restricting the coolant flow for no reason whatsoever. In the rarest of situations, it might flow into hairline defects between the head and the head gasket - but figure the odds.

//greg//

greg_g · Jun 3, 2006

( on the safe side should I put so barrs stop leak in it? )

Personal preference based upon personal experience, but I say no. There's a 99.99% chance that there's nothing wrong with the INSIDE of your cooling system. If there's any problem with the coolant flow, it's almost certainly external and/or mechanical; blocked fins, misaligned fan shroud, loose belt, tall battery, breather intake, leaky cap, wrong thermostat, loose hose clamp. Except for that other 0.001% chance, Barr's cling to the inside of an otherwise perfectly good radiator - thereby restricting the coolant flow for no reason whatsoever. In the rarest of situations, it might flow into hairline defects between the head and the head gasket - but figure the odds.

//greg//

tat2z1969 · Jun 3, 2006

I have to agree with Greg on this one, Barr's is known to plug up a rad.
The best thing is to find the problem with a rad pressure tester and fix the problem or use the following in a pinch.
The Military and Big trucking companies and the JD dealer here use what I have used for years if a head is seeping and the owner doesn't want to pay for a repair and that is Water Glass, sodium silicate. I won't plug up the cooling system. Buy it at a drug store, drain all anti freeze out, add clean water and run with rad cap off for 10 minutes, pour in the sodium silicate, run for 2 hours with rad cap on, let cool after 2 hours, drain and leave rad cap off and petcocks open over night, next day refill and run.
As always fixing the problem is better than any mechanic in a can.

tat2z1969 · Jun 3, 2006

I have to agree with Greg on this one, Barr's is known to plug up a rad.
The best thing is to find the problem with a rad pressure tester and fix the problem or use the following in a pinch.
The Military and Big trucking companies and the JD dealer here use what I have used for years if a head is seeping and the owner doesn't want to pay for a repair and that is Water Glass, sodium silicate. I won't plug up the cooling system. Buy it at a drug store, drain all anti freeze out, add clean water and run with rad cap off for 10 minutes, pour in the sodium silicate, run for 2 hours with rad cap on, let cool after 2 hours, drain and leave rad cap off and petcocks open over night, next day refill and run.
As always fixing the problem is better than any mechanic in a can.

schmalts · Jun 4, 2006

well said. The only fix in a can i ever found to work was Cheveron Textron injection cleaner for gas engines. Well... and fix-a- flat if your in a pinch LOL
What? split fire spark plugs and slick 50 wont make your engine run better and longer /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif what about those magnets you clamp on your fuel lines to give you better fuel milage?
I have some oceanside property here to sell in Wisconsin

schmalts · Jun 4, 2006

well said. The only fix in a can i ever found to work was Cheveron Textron injection cleaner for gas engines. Well... and fix-a- flat if your in a pinch LOL
What? split fire spark plugs and slick 50 wont make your engine run better and longer /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif what about those magnets you clamp on your fuel lines to give you better fuel milage?
I have some oceanside property here to sell in Wisconsin

3RRL · Jun 5, 2006

I wanted to comment on using the sodium silicate in the radiator. First off, I have never tried it in any radiator but I do know it will seal leaks.

We use it extensively in plastic injection mold cooling lines. The mold steels we use vary from pourous non ferrous metal castings like Beryllium Copper, Meehinite, Kirksite or Aluminum to hardened and pre-hardened forged tool steels such as P-20, 4130, 420SS, H-13, A-2, D-2, O-1 etc. Occasionally the water passages will develop leaks from small cracks from millions of heating and cooling cycles. We use sodium silicate to re-seal them. We have to pre-heat the metal to just under 200°F and introduce the solution under pressure for about 2 hours. It sticks to EVERYTHING, sealing the leak and leaving a thin film that hardens around the perimeter of ALL water passages. In taking thermal readings to determine the resultant thermal conductivity of treated metals there is a difference in heating and cooling cycles of the metal inserts. In each case, their thermal conductivity properties have been compromised by the sodium silicate and no longer respond to the faster heating and cooling cycles as before. This is due to the "water glass" effect, the coating of the water passages. This is extremely important when costing out piece price. These molds run millions of cycles and a one penny on a $1 piece (1%) can make a huge difference when considering if it makes 10 million cycles per year or 11 million. And this is for only ONE injection mold. For example, if the mold is a 32 cavity mold, the additional 1 million cycles will produce 32 million more parts per year....do the math. If you have a hundred molds running, it becomes astronomical.

Now I don't think it will plug up radiators as stated above, but I do know that there will be a film of it adhered to the internals of the radiator and will definitely have an effect on it's performance ....whether measurable or not. How much?...I don't know, but it will. ?? Or will it make a difference on the engine's ability to operate... probably not significant enough to worry about. Of course, that's why we use it in our plastic injection molds even though we know the results. In that respect it may be similar to Barr's except that it does not plug up radiators as stated about Barr's but I don't know because I've never used that either.

3RRL · Jun 5, 2006

I wanted to comment on using the sodium silicate in the radiator. First off, I have never tried it in any radiator but I do know it will seal leaks.

We use it extensively in plastic injection mold cooling lines. The mold steels we use vary from pourous non ferrous metal castings like Beryllium Copper, Meehinite, Kirksite or Aluminum to hardened and pre-hardened forged tool steels such as P-20, 4130, 420SS, H-13, A-2, D-2, O-1 etc. Occasionally the water passages will develop leaks from small cracks from millions of heating and cooling cycles. We use sodium silicate to re-seal them. We have to pre-heat the metal to just under 200°F and introduce the solution under pressure for about 2 hours. It sticks to EVERYTHING, sealing the leak and leaving a thin film that hardens around the perimeter of ALL water passages. In taking thermal readings to determine the resultant thermal conductivity of treated metals there is a difference in heating and cooling cycles of the metal inserts. In each case, their thermal conductivity properties have been compromised by the sodium silicate and no longer respond to the faster heating and cooling cycles as before. This is due to the "water glass" effect, the coating of the water passages. This is extremely important when costing out piece price. These molds run millions of cycles and a one penny on a $1 piece (1%) can make a huge difference when considering if it makes 10 million cycles per year or 11 million. And this is for only ONE injection mold. For example, if the mold is a 32 cavity mold, the additional 1 million cycles will produce 32 million more parts per year....do the math. If you have a hundred molds running, it becomes astronomical.

Now I don't think it will plug up radiators as stated above, but I do know that there will be a film of it adhered to the internals of the radiator and will definitely have an effect on it's performance ....whether measurable or not. How much?...I don't know, but it will. ?? Or will it make a difference on the engine's ability to operate... probably not significant enough to worry about. Of course, that's why we use it in our plastic injection molds even though we know the results. In that respect it may be similar to Barr's except that it does not plug up radiators as stated about Barr's but I don't know because I've never used that either.

Harrygoodwrench · Jun 5, 2006

Thanks for the education guys. I've spun wrenches for over 30 years and I gotta admitt I never heard of Water glass (sodium silicate). Although it doesn't address the problem like a repair would, It sure sounds like a better alternative to "Barrs leak" "Stop Leak" and similar products.
I had to Google it so I could edu-ma-cate myself more. LOL.
Thanks Taz and 3RRL, all.

Here is what I found to those that might be interested.

Water Glass

Harrygoodwrench · Jun 5, 2006

Thanks for the education guys. I've spun wrenches for over 30 years and I gotta admitt I never heard of Water glass (sodium silicate). Although it doesn't address the problem like a repair would, It sure sounds like a better alternative to "Barrs leak" "Stop Leak" and similar products.
I had to Google it so I could edu-ma-cate myself more. LOL.
Thanks Taz and 3RRL, all.

Here is what I found to those that might be interested.

Water Glass