Sobriety check point, whadda think??

[CDsdad]

A roadblock a 1/2 mile from the bar at midnight Saturday is OK by me. But they can get ridiculous with them.

A lot of the reason roadblocks are done locally(here in MS) is to justify federal money recieved to enforce seatbelt, carseat, child safety etc... They generally have one at school entrance and exit at least twice a month. They give lots of tickets too. Lots of dummies I guess. Even if a grown-up won't wear it, they oughta at least buckle their kids.

As far as where are you going/have been questions, I politely told one at 7 pm on a Friday evening that it was none of his business. He proceeded to attempt to lecture me on the necessity of himself and his roadblock. I told him(not so politely) to shut up or write a ticket.

No tag light in Wayne County MS costs $47.68. He did shut up though.

Judge threw it out when I went to courthouse to dispute, said it was bull and not worth his time.

 

[dmccarty]

The civil liberterian in me does not check points. But they work.

- They are not searches. Regarding searching, anything in plain view is just that, in plain view. If there is a Bag O Pot on the front seat or if a guy is standing in frong of a window in his house smoking a big doobie its in plain view. If an officer drives by and sees it, expect the consequences.
- The courts have been very specific on how the check points have to be conducted. At least in NC the following has to be done.
--There has to be a plan filed regarding the check points location, time of operation, and how cars will be stopped.
-- Every car can be stopped, every other car, every fifth car, etc. It just has to be documented AND FOLLOWED.

I forgot the exact number, but the majority of drunks actually get through the check piont which is very scary. But a good number will be pulled off the street due to the checkpoint. The majority of arrests/citations are for outstanding warrents, driving with no license/suspended license, etc. If the check point has been set up at the right time and location it is NOT a waste of time/money. Certainly more arrests/citations will be made during the check point than if the officer where on patrol.

NC has been pushing boundries for the drunk driving by increasing penalties when people have been killed but that is too late as far as I'm concerned. Too many drunks are arrested, if they actually get sentenced, many will buy a beater and keep driving. If they are caught again they should go to prison for a few years to sober up. The problem is that we don't have enough space for all of the thugs as it is....

Later,
Dan

 

[Jagmandave]

But a good number will be pulled off the street due to the checkpoint.

I don't buy this........

Here in the KC area they have these frequently and the "Catch rate" is about what was mentioned above, 2 out of many thousands.........

Having them set up a block from the bar an hour before closing makes far more sense to me than closing a six lane hiway for 4 hours and catching 2 guys, barely over the limit - which is what happens here.........

What about the time wasted not only by the officers but by the thousands of people who had to wait to get thru the checkpoint? I'm sorry, but I think this is grandstanding and publicity only........I think the motor patrols can spot drunks far better on the road than they can with these check points........

I don't drink, so I admit to being somewhat biased, but I feel stronger drunk driving penalties and better education is a better answer than these....

 

[higgy]

Interesting thread.

I am not for road blocks and I agree with reasonable cause. When I lived in australia they had road blocks, automatic picture cameras for speed, lights, stop signs. All of these were run by contactors that were paid by the ticket. The govmt would send a pic of your cars plate with a ticket, then you had to prove it was you or not if your kid was driving. You were guilty by owning the plates. I would not like to see the same here.

Dane

 

[California]

I wonder if automatically forfeiting the car for every DUI conviction would get the drunks off the road. Or if that's too drastic, confiscation along with every one-year suspension. I think with that on the books we would see greater use of 'designated drivers' instead of the drunk operating the car.

Present methods don't seem to stop the drunks from driving.

 

[LMTC]

The civil liberterian in me does not check points. But they work.

- They are not searches.

If they are not searches are they then arrests without probable cause? The checkpoint absolutely serves the function of detaining you, making it at least a de facto arrest. If not an arrest, then detention? We will have to have differing opinions on this, as I don't really care how one terms it or what one makes of the semantics....I think it is wrong and I think it is anathema to a free society for police to be able to stop citizenry with no probable cause specific to the individual.

 

[dmccarty]

Here in the KC area they have these frequently and the "Catch rate" is about what was mentioned above, 2 out of many thousands.........

Two out of thousands does not sound right to me. Check points are not just about drunk drivers. The last checkpoint I know about sent a couple paddy wagons to the jail, at least six people per trip and a couple where DWIs. Lots of citations written as well. Sure as heck the check point did not stop thousands of people. And this check point was not unusual.

Having them set up a block from the bar an hour before closing makes far more sense to me than closing a six lane hiway for 4 hours and catching 2 guys, barely over the limit - which is what happens here.........

If that is what is happening in your location they are doing it wrong.

What about the time wasted not only by the officers but by the thousands of people who had to wait to get thru the checkpoint? I'm sorry, but I think this is grandstanding and publicity only........I think the motor patrols can spot drunks far better on the road than they can with these check points........

In 30 years of driving I can only think of two times I have been stopped at a checkpoint. How much time is a life worth? I spend far more time stuck in traffic caused by people doing stupid things. I would glady wait hours if it meant even one less drunk on the road.

A few years ago, well maybe more than a few, an habitual drunk driver T boned a minivan. A toddler strapped into her car seat was decapitated. How many hours of inconvience is she worth? The state won a conviction on a homicide charge which was overturned by the courts. NC has gone after these people pretty hard but the fact is the thugs are not convicted enough or sent to prison for the time the truely earn.

In my department, patrol is busy answering calls. They don't have much time to catch DWIs. It happens but they are busy. Check points are staffed with officers from other units in the department, other agencies and reserves. What I have seen checkpoints make more arrests and write more citations than patrol with with fewer officers and in less time.

Later,
Dan

 

[Sigarms]

If the check point has been set up at the right time and location it is NOT a waste of time/money. Certainly more arrests/citations will be made during the check point than if the officer where on patrol.

Dan, don't know what the checkpoints are like in your neck of the woods, but here in Winston off of I-40 where they set up (usually on the on ramp from Silas Creek parkway onto I-40) it's like a fiesta going on. Kind of funny, 6 or so marked cars with the lights flashing, and about 20 cars pulled over with the drivers standing around. All Mexicans looking so lost and dumbfounded.

 

[dmccarty]

If they are not searches are they then arrests without probable cause? The checkpoint absolutely serves the function of detaining you, making it at least a de facto arrest. If not an arrest, then detention? We will have to have differing opinions on this, as I don't really care how one terms it or what one makes of the semantics....I think it is wrong and I think it is anathema to a free society for police to be able to stop citizenry with no probable cause specific to the individual.

They are stops not searches.

The vehicles are not being searched but are being stopped.

And the semantic are important. Those little details are what the lawyers love and allow thugs to get away with crimes. And of course they do protect civil liberties.

If you don't want to be stopped then don't drive. Driving is not a right. If you are not driving you won't be stopped.

My opinion, your opinion and ALMOST every other person's opinion on this matter is irrelevant. The Supremes have said that check points, if done within limits, are constitutional.

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Dan, don't know what the checkpoints are like in your neck of the woods, but here in Winston off of I-40 where they set up (usually on the on ramp from Silas Creek parkway onto I-40) it's like a fiesta going on. Kind of funny, 6 or so marked cars with the lights flashing, and about 20 cars pulled over with the drivers standing around. All Mexicans looking so lost and dumbfounded.

Only six patrol cars? They need more!

And most of the south of the border people are illegals but the feds won't touch them so they get written up and sent on their way. What is sad/scary about them is how petrified of the POlice they are. But they have good cause to be given how corrupt the POlice are in the home countries. They really don't have civil liberties that far down south.

There is an NC Trooper that has been dragged through the courts because he made lots of arrests, DWI and others, by parking near a South of the border bar. Ask him if one should just setup outside a bar and wait for the drunks....

Later,
Dan