Sonotube questions Please respond if you know

   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #11  
We have a lot of sandy conditions here on Cape Cod, so for heavier loads (like a house) we'd use a sonotube with an expanded footing -- like the "bigfoot" system. Works well.
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #12  
Hi Steven,

All the above is way ahead of me. I have never even seen a sonotube.

So I will try to tell you how we did it 50 odd years ago.

We made our own tubes from 15# felt paper. Cut long enough to roll and make 2 turns plus 3 or 4" lap. Cut it for heighth, maybe 6" taller than your pier would be above ground. Roll & pin them with nails, kind of like pinning a diaper.

Dig pier holes & pour concrete to near ground level. Set the felt tube into the wet concrete. Shoot your grade & mark by pushing a nail through the paper wall. Fill tube with concrete to grade marking nail.

I suspose you might drive reinforcing steel in the ground to grade if you prefer.
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #13  
I am in the planning stages of about the same situation as you are, but my ground is sand about as far as I can dig with my PHD. I found this site, http://www.soundfootings.com

I called them about the product, and in some quanity, the 22" model runs around $13.00, and the largest aroound $27.00

I think this will solve all your problems, well, it did mine.
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #14  
what is sonotube? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #15  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( what is sonotube? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif )</font>
Sonotube

Round heavy cardboardlike tube that is used for pouring foundation piers and concrete columns. You see it used in bridge construction to form the round columns.

Bill Tolle
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #16  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( the building company that he has worked for in the winter for the last 10 year starting in NOV and ending in May each year called and gave him until that friday to be on the job )</font>

One possible alternative: Could you get him to give you some instructions on how to do the sonotubes? Maybe pay him for a couple of hours of his time (or maybe he will feel guilty for leaving you holding the bag) on a Saturday or Sunday?

He could show you more in 2 hours than we can tell you in days.

You might be able to get him to let you use one of his crew to help you for a couple of days when you get ready to set the tubes and the day you pour them.

I would highly recommend you have at least 1 or 2 people helping on the day you pour, it can get awfully hectic, especially if one of the tubes slips or leans or something.

Bill Tolle
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know
  • Thread Starter
#17  
Bill, I thought about calling him and asking but my decision to do this all myself although it does look like a pretty major mountain was pretty well finalized when I ordered the tractor because that puppy with all the toys is mite near half of the $ we got from selling our house in town and so my eggs are in one basket for a while and I'm pretty sure I can do this without much other than folks like ya'll to sound ideas off of to make sure I don't do anything really bad and irreversable or fixable. The clocks ticking and my honey's already talking about maybe fixing up the cabin we are living in a bit its hard to argue with a gal thats willing to let you buy 350 acres, sell her house in town, and live in a less than 1,000 sq ft cabin heated solely by woodstoves and take half her new house money and "invest" it in a tractor and implements and still goes to work with me everyday to our print shop in town and last but not least still Loves me. Although she did look at me the other day and said just don't get sick and die on me now.
Thanks for everyones continued support.

I'm planning on buying readymix and mixing it in a wheelbarrow here again I've never worked with this volume of concrete so I may have to use somemore of Mrs. F's house money to rent or buy a mixer. I'll try it and see, I can probably get one footing and tube per wheelbarrow.
Steve
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #18  
First, I thought you were talking about piers 3' high. If so the wheelbarrow won't reach up that high to pour it and shoveling it is going to be back breaking.

On the upside, if you buy/rent a concrete mixer you could move it right next to the pier and dump directly into the pier. You might have to put it on a pallet or 2 to get it high enough to dump it but you could use your loader to move everything around.

You need to figure out the exact amount of concrete needed in each pier. I think you will find that it is going to take at least 4 or 5 sacks of concrete mix in each pier and each sack weighs 80 pounds. An 80 pound bag of concrete mix is only 3/4 of a cubic foot of concrete. You are talking about lifting 320 pounds or more of sacks into the mixer for each pier X how many piers.

According to the calculator at Volume calculator a 6 inch column 6 feet tall (3' underground, 3' above ground) is 4.71 cubic feet. Divide that by .75 cu ft and that is 6.28 sacks of ready mix per pier X 80 pounds per sack is 502.64 pounds X 55 piers gets you to 11,310 pounds. Approximately 350 sacks of concrete mix. And looking back at your original post you said they were going to be 12" piers so double all the above figures.

BTW, I have never seen a residence with 12" piers. 6" is common and some 8" are used but I have never seen a 12" and I was a Licensed Texas Real Estate Inspector for a few years so I have been under a few houses. I was also a licensed Master Electrician in Dallas, Texas for 20 years and built my own 625 sq ft lake cabin virtually singlehanded so I feel I have some qualifications. (No wonder I have a bad back!)

Don't even consider trying to mix it by hand in a wheel barrow. When I had a guy I hired pour some 6" square concrete curbs for me I rented a mixer and was way ahead on both time and money. And he was an experienced concrete man.

From the size of your project it would seem that you would be better off buying than renting a mixer and selling it when the house is finished. Just make sure you buy one that is big enough to handle 6 sacks of mix (4.5 cu ft).

I have done a major remodel including building a 28 X 32 garage and an 8 X 40 front porch. I couldn't find a contractor to do the work so I hired some hands and did it myself. I got it done but it took it's toll on me, even with the hired help. Only things I subbed out were the concrete, roofing, tape and texture sheetrock, and exterior painting.

I am not trying to scare you, just trying to make you aware of what you are about to tackle.

Sounds like your wife is really supportive, you are very fortunate. My wife said she was happy to see me spend $12K on a tractor that is basically a hobby for me. Sounds like we are both very lucky husbands.

Bill Tolle
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #19  
For 55 piers you definitely want to use readimix. Buying QuickCrete from the home store comes out to about twice the cost per cubic yard as you can buy the stuff. The minimum load on a truck is usually three yards. You can buy less, but you'll pay for three yards.

If you can auger to rock easily, foot your piers on the rock, as others have suggested. Set the tops of your Sonotubes level and to final grade. That way, you can strike off on top of the tubes and be done. If you'll be tubing the whole hole, wedge the tubes in the bottom with a bit of backfill, and brace the tops solidly with 2x4s nailed to the tubes and secured to 2x4 stakes driven into the ground. As others have said, brace them well. Concrete is heavy.

Be sure the truck can back up to all the tubes, or carries enough chute to reach them all. They will load extra chute if you ask them. You absolutely don't want to move mud by hand. It will kill you, and may set up before you're done.

For your first day, plan on a small load of mud. That way, you'll learn what you're doing and won't have to worry about two truckloads going hot while you're stumbling around in crisis.

Calculate your quantities accurately and allow about 5% waste. Have a place on site to dump the waste. You may want to form up some patio blocks of dead weights or something to use up the scrap. Otherwise, ask in advance if they will take away the extra. Have a place for the truck to wash out.

Get a vibrator. You can get one from Rent-All or buy the cheap one from Harbor Freight. I have the $80 HF one. It's kinda junky but I will probably never manage to kill it. Don't over vibrate, but do use one to consolidate the mix around your rebar.

It helps to have three or four friends around, even if they're idiots. Having someone to shovel and shift things can be precious in a rush.
 
   / Sonotube questions Please respond if you know #20  
<font color="blue"> It helps to have three or four friends around, even if they're idiots. </font>

Sounds like I might qualify as a helper...too bad Texas is so fare EAST of here... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

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