steering on hay wagon running gears

[audiski86]

I have an 8 ton running gear, can't remember the brand but believe it was an Amish company that has changed names or doesn't manufacture them anymore. When towing down the road say at 35 mph, there is a some side-to-side tracking (not too much maybe a few inches to each side). I am wondering if there are any good articles or explanations someone could give on measuring/adjusting the steering to minimize the tracking.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I do not have much experience in this but on mine I set the center of the front side of the steering wheels 1/4" to 1/2" in versus the center of the rear of the wheel. Hard to explain but I think its called toe-in.

Chris

 

[Duffster]

I have an 8 ton running gear, can't remember the brand but believe it was an Amish company that has changed names or doesn't manufacture them anymore. When towing down the road say at 35 mph, there is a some side-to-side tracking (not too much maybe a few inches to each side). I am wondering if there are any good articles or explanations someone could give on measuring/adjusting the steering to minimize the tracking.

The tongue is likely worn, not really an adjustment to make other than to rebuild the worn parts.

Pick the tongue up when it is not hooked up and move it back and forth it will be real easy to see where it is sloppy.

 

[audiski86]

When I got it and built it last year I did notice some slop in the tongue. If I remember right, you could see where the slop was in one of the attachment bolts so I made some kind of a bushing that got rid of that. Wish I had a picture because it was a while back so I can't think of exactly how and where I did it at the moment.

I have also heard to adjust so it is toe-in slightly, and am wondering as to the exact steps to take to get this precise? How do you set it up to take measurement and where are you measuring from, etc? Maybe I am trying to be too exact?

 

[jayste]

I would check the steering linkage as others have said first. Also, you might check for excessive slop in the wheel bearings. Let us know how it goes.

 

[sweettractors]

I too, would check for play in the front end first and then set toe in. We use a tape measure and try to shoot for the front being in about 1/2 inch more that the back. Inside rubber to inside rubber. This may not be correct for all wagon gears. Ken Sweet

 

[audiski86]

I repacked the bearings when building it last year as well as fixed the tongue slop.

So first I should set the tongue straight, check that the tires are parallel to each other and to the tongue, then set the toe in?

 

[beenthere]

And then, not expect it to pull straight down the road at 35+ mph

But wish you well getting it to pull straight at that speed.

 

[mmurphy]

Running gears are meant to about 25 mph speed. If you tighten and make alignment right you could probably go 35. Some states has a rule if slow moving vehicle sign is on, 25 is top speed or you are speeding.

 

[sweettractors]

And then, not expect it to pull straight down the road at 35+ mph

But wish you well getting it to pull straight at that speed.

We have had good luck with the JD gears tracking well at 50+ and also the Kory wagon gears. All the rest 25-35 MPH (loaded) about as good as it gets. Ken Sweet

 

[3BPercherons]

We have had good luck with the JD gears tracking well at 50+ and also the Kory wagon gears. All the rest 25-35 MPH (loaded) about as good as it gets. Ken Sweet

I've never had the huevos to even think about 50+ w/ a hay wagon.

 

[sweettractors]

I've never had the huevos to even think about 50+ w/ a hay wagon.

We do that all the time with hay and tobacco. Of course, that is with a 1 ton 4x4 truck with 4x4 kicked it and a loaded aux 100 gal fuel tank and toolbox in the back bed. Ken Sweet

 

[3BPercherons]

We do that all the time with hay and tobacco. Of course, that is with a 1 ton 4x4 truck with 4x4 kicked it and a loaded aux 100 gal fuel tank and toolbox in the back bed. Ken Sweet

I suppose next you'll be bragging that you can accurately back a hay wagon into a tight spot. :laughing:

 

[sweettractors]

I suppose next you'll be bragging that you can accurately back a hay wagon into a tight spot. :laughing:

Only when I hook it to my front bumper. Ken Sweet

 

[3BPercherons]

Only when I hook it to my front bumper. Ken Sweet

Cheater.

 

[Duffster]

I suppose next you'll be bragging that you can accurately back a hay wagon into a tight spot. :laughing:

Can't everyone parallel park a hay wagon? :laughing:

 

[sweettractors]

Can't everyone parallel park a hay wagon? :laughing:

Sure, I can: First unhook from the tractor and then get the 4 big guys that helped load the hay, push the wagon while I guide it in the parking spot. Ken Sweet

 

[3BPercherons]

Can't everyone parallel park a hay wagon? :laughing:

My feeble mind can't comprehend the complex geometry required to figure out which way to turn my wheels to make the front wheels on the wagon turn in the direction required in order for the back wheels to go where they need to.

So I came up with a simple solution - I always volunteer to pull the gooseneck loads. :laughing:

 

[audiski86]

Well I can pick up the tongue and move it side to side - there is NO play between tongue and wheels! I was surprised at how tight it was compared to when I picked up one of my neighbors that seem to track good. The wheels are toe slightly in and I was going to adjust a little more and of course was not able to turn the end ball joints on the threads of the rod connecting the two wheels to the tongue. PB blaster didn't work, heating it up didn't work, I was just going to bend the long rod if I tried anymore so I let it be. I believe that the tongue is slightly out of straight along with the pipe connecting the front and rear which probably causes the very small amount of side-to-side tracking that I get. When I get some more time maybe in the fall I might try again and heat it some more but it is going to bother me that I couldn't adjust it to at least test it. For now I with wire brush the paint on the threads and keep hitting it with pb blaster.

 

[zzvyb6]

The 'weave mode' in your "wagon steering" wagons has several contributing factors, but the principle ones are front AND rear toe alignment and tire properties. Folks generally don't put the best tires on these rigs (and seldom check the pressures), but the best tires are radials running at their highest rated tire pressure. This is because the tires have a restoring self aligning moment ('twisting force') when the axle turns. This moment takes some time/distance to act on the axle, and this delay causes the chassis to weave. So, higher pressure lowers the self aligning moment, radials have less self aligning moment characteristic than bias tires and the speed at which the weave tends to start goes up. Another thing I've observed is the beam connecting the rear axle to the front gets bent downward from overloading the wagon. This increases the net caster alignment of the front axles and caster generates higher self aligning moment (which adds to the problem).