Stopping a snowmobile without injury

[MNBobcat]

Dave,

Yes, here in Minnesota the first 20 feet of a person's yard frontage on a road is public right of way for snowmobiles. Ditches on the outside of roads are also legal to ride. There are also marked public trails. I have one that runs in the ditch along my property. We have trails that run all the way to Canada.

The river is also public waters and can be used by snowmobiles. As can all of the lakes around here. I'm not sure about Minnesota but I believe in States like Wisconsin there are areas you can ride down a city street and go to the gas station to fill up. Every privately owned farm field around here that isn't posted has snowmobile tracks on it. Many towns are dependent on snowmobile and ATV recreation for their income. Its huge in this state.

To "charge" someone with trespassing they need to be given a verbal warning. But if signs are put up I don't think anyone would go on the property so his goal would be achieved.

Also...in his County the rules are a bit different. There you have to have permission before going on the property. Whereas in the vast majority of the State non-posted property can be ridden on. What I was trying to get people to understand is when 90% of the State has the opposite rules its not to be unexpected that someone might not know the rules in the area where its non-standard. Thus the signs would alert them to the fact they shouldn't be on the property.

 

[MNBobcat]

I was only citing an example of one possible scenario to illustrate why someone could end up on private property in a situation where its not reasonable to go knock on a door and get permission. We could come up with another 100 scenarios if we wanted to.

I notice the majority of people with an opposing view are from the North Eastern States. You guys need to spend some time in Minnesota to get some perspective. I had a friend from Boston visit a few months ago and he remarked that he was surprised to see gravel roads.

I'm done with this topic. We'll have to agree to disagree. Its a black and white issue for me. The dude could post some signs and resolve the problem with very little effort on his part. Or...he could have the sheriff patrol for a day or two and then when they quit he'll be right back to where he started from with the exact same "problem". And he will have that problem for year after year. Me...I'd put up some signs and be done with it. That's what I mean by common sense.

 

[swlman2]

Mr bobcat, u could have easily resolved this, u said u had " connections " in anoka!!

 

[jrwalkerpa1]

Around here any property not posted gets hunted. No permission required to hunt unposted property

If, as your location says, you are in Pennsylvania, you are 100% wrong that "no permission required to hunt unposted property". It is trespassing if you don't have permission...it makes no difference if its posted or not. Of course, both due to lax enforcement and the pathetic entitlement mentality/laziness of so many, I have no doubt that "Around here any property not posted gets hunted" Of course those types will hunt the posted property too....What is so hard about asking permission?

 

[swlman2]

try that in TEXAS, see what happens!
Atv riders are all over no matter where u are . Trespassing is Trespassing

 

[MossRoad]

I totally agree that the polite and respectful thing to do is to ask for permission first. But if its 10:00 pm at night and someone has been running the river for 40 miles and they see a good spot to exit onto what looks like a large wooded area with some trails...its not really realistic for them to find a house (in which case they would have already ridden on the private land) and knock on a door. They're going to look to see if the land is posted. If not, then its assumed they can ride the trails.

I'm just saying that some common sense needs to come into play here as well.

This land owner said he spent 6 hours on his property trying to catch snowmobilers. He has invested additional time meeting with the Sheriff (and frankly the Sheriff can better serve the public by catching criminals not trying to chase down people on snowmobiles.) He was also considering trying to sabotage and destroy snowmobiles.

In your mind, doesn't it make far more sense to spend a couple hours posting the property? I realize there is no guarantee that posting will stop the problem, but that's the place to start before going to other extremes, right? I think its wrong of him to make the assumption that these snowmobilers are flagrantly out to trespass on his land. Posting the property lets the snowmobiler know they shouldn't be there.

I agree with you except.... the law there states that they need written permission to exit the river and ride on private land. Its up to them to know the law. And my guess is almost every one of them in that county knows the law and exactly what it means, so they are flagrantly out to trespass. Its just like fishing regs. Its up to the person fishing to know the different seasons, size and bag limits on each lake.

 

[farmer2009]

Got a kick out of an earlier post about "posted property is asking for harassment". Posting property around here is your right. Ask anyone around here what happens to people that think they can "mess with you" for closing a trail through your property.

 

[Piston]

Snowmobilers don't want to lose their riding privileges. They'll respect signs and such. Mainly they just need an indication they're not welcome on the property.

Your kidding right?!?!?

 

[wawajake]

Wow.it is quite sad that there are people like MNBobcat that think that landowners are lazy for not posting their paid for land, but snowmobilers are not lazy for not checking whether there trip will bring them across private land. Unfortunately even in our future young teens we are seeing that aspect that the "world owes me a good time" .......just do it ....attitude. I for one hope all us posters here are not raising our children to have that same attitude. .....and instead teach them respect for others. If it is not yours its not yours to play with or on!

 

[aczlan]

This land owner said he spent 6 hours on his property trying to catch snowmobilers. He has invested additional time meeting with the Sheriff (and frankly the Sheriff can better serve the public by catching criminals not trying to chase down people on snowmobiles.) He was also considering trying to sabotage and destroy snowmobiles.

I agree with the not destroying snowmobiles part, but trespassing is a criminal office, thus someone snowmobiling on another person's property without permission IS committing a criminal offense which would make them a criminal...

In your mind, doesn't it make far more sense to spend a couple hours posting the property? I realize there is no guarantee that posting will stop the problem, but that's the place to start before going to other extremes, right? I think its wrong of him to make the assumption that these snowmobilers are flagrantly out to trespass on his land. Posting the property lets the snowmobiler know they shouldn't be there.

I agree that posting the property is a good start, but if there is an active trail (marked by a club or just by people going someplace that looks interesting), just posting it will NOT stop a snowmobiler flying by the posted sign at 60MPH after dark. They wont see it. Hence my suggestion of the highly visible barricade across the trail to give them a unmistakeable sign that they aren't welcome on the property.

Snowmobilers don't want to lose their riding privileges. They'll respect signs and such. Mainly they just need an indication they're not welcome on the property.

Riiiight. The same crowd that has no problem destroying someone's crop of winter wheat (despite the no-trespassing signs every 100'), or driving over someones new pine trees (despite them being marked with flagging tape) is just going to go somewhere else when faced with a no-trespassing sign that they wont see as they go down the trail at well over 60MPH in the wee hours of the morning...

Aaron Z