survey stakes and neighbors

[hunterridgefarm]

I had a neighbor who would always pull the corner stake up when surveyed.

The last time he had it surveyed I found out about it and was standing at the corner when the surveyor got there with a car axle, drove it in the ground, he could not pull it up .

To mark the line we took a 5" flat disc and welded it to rebar. Every place the surveyor would mark the boundary we would drive one in. It stays flush with the ground, easy to find, don't have to worry about hitting it with the mower, and you can paint the disc to make finding even easier.

 

[Ifixcars]

Thanks Hunt, I was thinking of something like that. I better get busy on it before the stakes get "accidently" run over.

 

[Highbeam]

I had my lot surveyed a couple of years ago. I had the surveyor set official permanent corners with rebar and caps. In addition, I had him "mark" points every 1-2 hundred feet along the line so that I could establish line through forest and rolling topography. For the line stakes he used tall wood lathe with ribbon to mark the 1.5" square wooden hubs set flush with the ground and a tack placed exactly on the top of the hub on the line. This is good for the short term but for the long term I bought precut 1/2" diameter by 2 foot long rebar chunks at home depot and drove them in beside the hubs as close to online as possible. I drove them flush. A metal detector will always be able to find those bars even if a forest fire roars through.

The rebar is cheap and effective.

 

[Jstpssng]

If you're worried about it moving I'd consider driving another piece of rebar about 18" below the visible pin; preferably after marking it with a unique ID (Your deed book and page#?)

If you really want something easy to find, attach a magnet into your buried pin. We used to drop one into the drill hole on a granite monument, it'll drive a metal detector crazy..

 

[Ifixcars]

I made a couple test pins tonight. I picked up a handfull of 5x5x3/16 inch squares (drops from the local metal shop), cut them into circles and welded a foot of 3/4 inch round bar to them. The round bars were drops too, and were 2 foot lengths. I cut them to 1 foot to make more of them. I hope 1 foot will be long enough. Should I go 18 inch? I drove a couple down into the ground next to the stakes to see how they looked. They seem like they will stay put, as long as no one pulls them up. Maybe I should sink some rebar underground too.

 

[MossRoad]

Take a post hole digger, dig a hole two feet deep, dump in a bag of concrete, pour a bucket of water in it and push your pin thing that you are making into it. It won't go anywhere without someone doing some hard work and can't be removed "by accident".

 

[Timber]

In most places you can not place a fence right on the property line. Also, the wooden stakes are probably guard stakes. No surveyor I know, or worked for, would use wooden stakes sticking up out of the ground to mark the line.

I have never herd of such a thing, You can put a fence right in the line. In fact I had a big problem with my neighbor at my last property. He complained to the town stating it was on his property. With an instrument survey you put the fence right on the line, the down side is your neighbor owns that side of the fence. Now he can't vandalize it or remove it but he can paint it any color he wants. If you bring it in 1 foot then you own both sides and they can't touch it. Also if your neighbor disputes were you set the fence it is his responsibility to contract and pay for the instrument survey to prove his allegation. I just went through all this 2 years ago.

 

[Fug1000]

Sounds like your neighbor needs a visit from Bubba!

By the way, this is Bubba's Tractor....I want one!

 

[MikePA]

I have never herd of such a thing,

Because you've never heard of it doesn't make it so. I've not only heard of such a thing, many townships and municipalities do not allow it.

You can put a fence right in the line.

In your area you can.

In fact I had a big problem with my neighbor at my last property. He complained to the town stating it was on his property. With an instrument survey you put the fence right on the line, the down side is your neighbor owns that side of the fence. Now he can't vandalize it or remove it but he can paint it any color he wants. If you bring it in 1 foot then you own both sides and they can't touch it. Also if your neighbor disputes were you set the fence it is his responsibility to contract and pay for the instrument survey to prove his allegation. I just went through all this 2 years ago.

This is exactly why municipalities do not allow fences directly on property lines, property line disputes. It's my fence, on my property. I'm not looking for a fight with a neighbor.

 

[MossRoad]

Yeah. You can't put your fence right ON the line, but you can put it so that the fence surface is butted up TO the line.

Of course, if both parties agree to the fence, then you can put it on the line.

 

[Timber]

LOL there is nothing to dispute on an instrument survey. The line is were the line is. My neighbor and I had a long history. He poisoned my German Shepard and killed her before she was even 7 years old right in her prime. One of the reasons I bought my farm No Neighbors. At any rate Fencing is not considered permanent construction so they can go right on the line

 

[MikePA]

LOL there is nothing to dispute on an instrument survey.

LOL, this is flat out wrong.

When you do a property survey, you pull deeds from both the property you're surveying, plus the deeds of all adjoining properties. Disputes arise when the deeds containing the description of the same property line do not match.

Accurately placing the markers on the ground is simple. Determining which deed is accurate sometimes is not. That's how disputes arise with 'an instrument survey'.

 

[HomeBrew2]

Agree w/ MikePA and to keep it short, only Judges "set" boundaries, surveyors are charged with delineating a boundary on the ground to the best of their ability. Any survey could be subject to dispute by other, equally competant, surveyors and could ultimately have to be resolved by a judge.

 

[mjarrels]

Just my .02... but look at the copy of your survey... I bet you will see IP on it... look down in the corner and I bet you will see IP = iron pin set. All surveys I have ever seen done have rebar iron pins set... wood stake means nothing.

mark

 

[MossRoad]

wood stake means nothing.

Try telling that to a vampire!

 

[zeuspaul]

Agreed that judges determine boundaries and surveyors provide their expert opinion as to where the boundary is.

However a Surveyor may*set* a boundary if the survey is called out in a deed....such as Mr Jones sells a portion of his land as defined by the survey by Mr XYZ.

Zeuspaul

 

[riptides]

Agreed that judges determine boundaries and surveyors provide their expert opinion as to where the boundary is.

However a Surveyor may*set* a boundary if the survey is called out in a deed....such as Mr Jones sells a portion of his land as defined by the survey by Mr XYZ.

Zeuspaul

Hopefully the surveryer is looking at all the deeds associated with the property. Quite a lot of information, shall we say is lost in time.....

-Mike Z.

 

[mwechtal]

Hopefully the surveryer is looking at all the deeds associated with the property. Quite a lot of information, shall we say is lost in time.....

-Mike Z.

Or, it may just be in error. My MIL lives on a short street in a chopped up part of town. The house is at least 100 years old. There are only 6 lots on each side I believe. At any rate, if you add up the frontage of all the lots, you come up with a figure longer than the street. So, the surveyer measured the street, and divided it equally, since all the deeds on the street specify the same frontage for each lot. I guess he would have had to do it proportionally if the lots were not equal in width.

Mike

 

[Jstpssng]

Or, it may just be in error. My MIL lives on a short street in a chopped up part of town. The house is at least 100 years old. There are only 6 lots on each side I believe. At any rate, if you add up the frontage of all the lots, you come up with a figure longer than the street. So, the surveyer measured the street, and divided it equally, since all the deeds on the street specify the same frontage for each lot. I guess he would have had to do it proportionally if the lots were not equal in width.

Mike

There are all sorts of variables. Land is more valuable today, and survey instruments are more accurate. Surveyors are held to a higher standard than in the past... I'm not a surveyor, but I've done research where 100 acre parcels were carved up into 3, smaller 50 acre pieces. Most deeds include the phrase "More or less", which can include as much as 10% discrepancy.

 

[KentT]

Most deeds include the phrase "More or less", which can include as much as 10% discrepancy.

The tract I bought a couple years ago read 5.26 acres, more or less, and that's what I'm paying taxes on. When I had it surveyed, it came in at 4.25 acres (almost 20% less), and 3/4 of an acre of it is now under water where they rebuilt the dam on the pond (that they call a lake) and the water line rose that much...

Then, my neighbor tried to say that about 1.5 acre of my tract was actually his, and that he had a survey to prove it.... come to find out he'd had it surveyed three times, trying to get his tract to equal the 5 acre size on his deed -- and the third time the surveyor he used simply set a pin far enough down my property line to give him a full five acres -- even if amost 1.5 acre of it was mine...

He badgered me, trying to get me to sell my tract to him, and saying he was going to take me to court, until my surveyor finally sent him a letter telling him that the corner pin on my survey was the same corner pin on his first two surveys -- and on the plats at the courthouse that matched the deed and are the basis of taxes, and he finally backed off...

MY TAKEAWAY FROM ALL THAT: There's good surveyors and some that are not so good, there's good surveys and some that are not so good, and no two of them necessarily will agree...