The cost of living......

[BillyP]

And on top of that, here anyway... Everytime I turn around, the county is putting a new tax on the ballot. 1/2 cent for the county hospital...3/4 cent for the county sheriffs office...3/4 cent for the county garbage system. The sad thing is, people around here just keep passing them. What happened to budgets anyway?

 

[Bob_Skurka]

We just defeated a 1-percent food and drink tax for our county and the politicians in the northern half of the county are blaming the southern half politicians and calling them racists. I opposed it because I didn't see any logic to the tax. I live in the south half of the county where we are very rural. The northern half includes Gary, IN and is very developed. Just because we are rural does not make us bigots. We just do for ourselves and don't want to fund the northern half of the county by paying extra tax.

For the most part, the northern residents & politicains in the county are Democrats, the southern residents & politicians are Republicans.

I just figure it is common sense, not political. If costs go up, we have to spend more of our individual spending money to pay for those costs, that reduces what we can spend on disrectionary spending. If they toss another tax on us, that is even more money we are paying out of that discretionary budget. At some point, there is no money left for food!

If we have to live with less, then the politicians should figure out how to restrain their spending too.

 

[BillyP]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If we have to live with less, then the politicians should figure out how to restrain their spending too. )</font>

Exactly my point, Bob. From the federal government, right on down to every city.

 

[Libertine]

TerryinMD:
I hate to confuse anyone with the facts, but your standard of living HAS to be forced down for many reasons. In fact whether you realize it or not, for someone in a given occupation, at a given point in their career, etc., it has been declining since the 1960s for most people. Standard of living = how many hours (net) do you have to work to earn a gallon of gas, a 2000 sq ft house, etc. In many ways it has been stagnant or declining since WWI! (I have done research for a book I am working on and have facts to back up that comment).

You live in a system based on monetized debt. Meaning, every dollar that is passed around came into being because someone borrowed something from the banking system. And every dollar of debt carries a never ending interest burden which, by pure arithmetic, requires a constantly expanding debt just to keep even. The 1960s was the end of the old system for many, many reasons. It's just a matter of when, how and who's running it as to how the collapse will be managed-and it is, dear reader, collapsing in slow motion even if you don't see it (we all tend to focus on what's going on in our own lives, that's normal). Last year, at least 3 months involved an actual decline in money supply. Several measures of velocity (how many times per year does each dollar change hands) has been declining since the mid 1990s. The only thing holding it up (temporarily) is the US gov is borrowing & borrowing (thus bringing more money into circulation). Thank your stars for the deficit. Private people aren't borrowing fast enough.

I had figured that this system would hold up till after I was dead. I'm not so sure anymore.

If you want to know why your standard of living HAS to be forced down, just add up the percentage of people who consume (eat, buy gas, etc) who don't put anything into the pot. When you look at THAT ratio, you realize that the people who work and produce things have to accept less and less for what they do so there's enough to support all the others.

Money does not make standard of living. Rather, it is the MEANS by which this system can be kept going. Remember, your standard of living is how many hours, net, do you have to work to earn, not money, but the things you buy with your money. 1 hour of your working life is worth? 5 gallons of gas (or whatever), 10 loaves of bread, etc. Figure in REALITY, not your governments money. If you must figure in money, use GOLD money-when you do that, the reality becomes much clearer.

JEH

PS I have set up some charts/spreads for 2500-3000 lb. tractors going back 80 years (Fordson, N series, etc.) and compared prices in labor hours at prevailing wages, prices in paper (debt) dollars, and, prices in gold dollars (1 gold dollar=approximately 1/20 ounce of gold). Prices havn't changed that much-it's your government's money that has depreciated. If anyone's interested maybe I'll take the time to post it.

 

[BillyP]

I can explain it with one word...GREED!

Whether it be stockholders demanding a better return on thier investment or the guy thinking he should have 30 days sick leave, 30 days emergency leave and 6 weeks vacation a year... You get my message.

 

[jinman]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I'm afraid it's that way for all of us. )</font>

As several folks have mentioned, I have really big problems with taxes increasing while the economy is in a recession. Does anyone know of a city council or a school district that pulled back on its tax rate over the last four years? I think the general principle could be stated: "Tax the heck out of them now and hope they forget it when election time rolls around." Unfortunately, history shows that we really do forget at election time.

But here is an example of something that happened at my company that I have to give credit where credit is due. A couple of years ago my company was purchased by a Canadian company called CAE which makes flight simulators, marine simulators, control systems for ships, and many other high-tech products. My company uses flight simulators to train pilots, so we actually enhanced the entire product line of CAE.

Since we had been owned by General Electric previously, we had a benefits package based on the clout of a massive industrial/service giant. Suddenly, we are owned by a small firm with only 6,000 total employees and we just can't get as good a deal on benefits as previously with GE. In order to have us pay our fair share, our cost of benefits had to double. This could easily mean an increase of nearly $2,000 per year for some employees.

Here is what CAE did that I find incredible. They gave everyone in the company a pay increase (essentially a raise) that exactly mirrored their personal benefits increase. That increase is independent of any longevity or merit raise in pay. It simply represents our parent company's realization that we lost something when we lost GE as a parent and they are making up the difference. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif I think there's some company loyalty being built here./forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[MossRoad]

So how many hours did the average person have to work to buy a loaf of bread this year, 5 years ago, 10 years ago, etc... ? I find this way of looking at things interesting. Thanks.

 

[BubbaJr]

Hi Mossroad,

Here is a LINK to a cost-of-living calculator. It will calculate the value of the 1940 dollar vs. the 1980 dollar or any year you input. Fun to see the difference. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

 

[MossRoad]

Thanks for the link.

I put in a nickle for a loaf of bread in 1935 and it told me it would be 68 cents today. A loaf of bread at the grocery store costs about $1.75. But I go to the thrift store down the street and get 3 for a dollar.

My dad bought a Nova in 1970 for about $2900. It said that would be about $13,800 today. That's doesn't sound too bad.

Dad bought a house in 1949 for $5000.00 new. Came out to about $39,000 today. I could get the materials for that same size house for about $30,000 today, but I would have to buy a lot to build it on and pay someone to build it, so that one went up quite a bit.

Here's an interesting one. I was making $7.50 an hour when I got married in 1985. Not a bad job for pumping gas into airplanes. It says I would have to make $12.91 today. That seems about right. Except for this. It's very hard to find a job around here that pays over $10.00 an hour to start unless you have an education past high school.

In 1985 the minimum wage was $3.35 an hour. That's $5.77 an hour in today's wages. The poverty level for a family of 3 was $8,850. That's $15,232.53 in today's wages.

The minimum wage today is $5.15. The poverty level for a family of 3 is $15,670.

So, based on those figures, the minimum wage is worth 52 cents an hour less than it should be, while the poverty level is about $438 higher.

Looks like I'm going to have to work more for the same buying power. I can deal with that OK, as my wife and I have been very frugal over the years. But I wonder how hard it will be for our children. Oh well. I have a better life than my parents did. I'm pretty happy. Hopefully our children will do the same things that we did, be frugal and enjoy themselves. All it takes is one medical disaster, twist of fate, etc... to put some folks over the edge of poverty(knock, knock).

That's one of the reasons I enjoy TBN so much... it helps you make an informed decision when you purchase a tractor. You do your research and get the most bang for your frugal buck. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

 

[BubbaJr]

I hadn't actaully tried any of the monetary conversions on the site until I read your post. Then I went back and input the price of my first new car (1971 Vega at ~ $2.8K) and it said that it would cost about $13K. today. Then I put in the cost of our first house (paid $23.5K in 1971) and it said today it would cost about $105K. Both of those seem to be about right based on my experiences. But then I put in my wages for 1971, and it said ..............well we won't go there /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif