Thoughts on this grapple from a local dealer?

[LD1]

You have to decide if you want a diverter setup, or a true 3rd function.

A diverter will only tie into an existing circuit. Usually your curl. Its electric, and you would either need a joystick with a button, or add a button to your current joystick. you are basically using your existing loader valve, but when pushing the button, it will divert fluid to the grapple instead of the curl cylinders. Thus the name...diverter. But whatever circuit you link it to, you will not be able to use that function at the same time as the grapple. So if you link it to your curl.....

Move stick left-right and your bucket curls and dumps. Push and hold button and move stick left and right and it opens and closes the grapple. But cannot do both at the same time, its one or the other.

Plumbing is pretty easy. Two hoses that go to curl will now go to the diverter valve. From there, you hook your two curl hoses into one side, and run two new lines for the grapple. Then its just wiring.

With a true 3rd function, it involves a little more plumbing, as you come off the power beyond of the loader, to supply a new valve (which can either be a manual valve with a lever, or an electric solenoid valve). then you have to run power beyond back to whatever hose you removed from the loader PB port (if applicable) that normally feeds the 3PH, and also need to tee into a tank line. Then from the new valve, you run your two hoses to the grapple. And wire a button if you choose solenoid. With this setup, you can lift, curl, and close grapple all at the same time if you so choose. But with a solenoid, you dont really have precise control, no feathering to make it open or close slow. Its either open, or close, at full speed (based on your RPM).

You can buy components separately, couplers, valve, hoses, etc and probably save a few bucks to design it all yourself. Or I think both brian (fitritehydraulics.com) and ken (boltonhooks.com) have kits to make things easy on you.

 

[FTG-05]

True third function.

I think............


Looks like I need to go to a hydraulics class......

 

[LD1]

Start by googling and reading about the difference between 3rd and diverter. I am gonna be doing a diverter on mine in the near future because I too want a grapple. I dont see any benefit for me in having a 3rd function. Especially with having a loader joystick valve. If I had an old school 2-lever valve....maybe add a third one? But I cannot ever see me trying to control all 3 functions at once. Especially with having a second lever to do so. And I didnt want a solenoid 3rd function because of lack of speed control. Imagine using your loader and the only options you had was lever all the way, no feathering for precise work? For those reasons, I chose a diverter and joystick button.

They also make a joystick valve with a 3rd spool/lever already there for a different approach. You would just remove your existing valve, plumb new one, then the only added lines are grapple lines 3 SPOOL 25 GPM JOYSTICK LOADER VALVE W/GRAPPLE

 

[CobyRupert]

You have to decide if you want a diverter setup, or a true 3rd function.

A diverter will only tie into an existing circuit.........

Very good explanations.
Is there also the cheap option of running the grapple cylinder off a rear SCV valve? Just run longer hyd. lines from rear SCV up to grapple, no expensive tractor mods required?

 

[Threepoint]

FTG-05, I'm in the market too, so thanks for posting. I'm going to add a 72" double-lid grapple for my Kioti NX4510HST cab in the next couple of weeks, once my W.R. Long electric-over-hydraulic third function is installed. That looks like a fair price for that grapple, and I'm sure it would do what you need. But here are some thoughts.

Don't know where in TN you're located, but are you close enough to pick it up yourself? I'm guessing freight would add at least $200. I'll also second Turbys point about the weight. 600 lbs is a lot to subtract from your lift capacity. My loader is rated at 2761 lbs at full height at the lift pins, but I'm still thinking something in the 450 lb range would be preferable. I'm impressed with the new design features of EA's double-lid Wicked Root Grapple for our sized tractors: Compact Tractor Dual Lid Wicked Root Grapple from Everything Attachments. Just 435 lbs, and they've increased the cylinder size/clamping force. They've added what they call "protection bars", which look like a nice feature. Also, tines are spaced at 7.5". Just some more data points for you.

 

[FTG-05]

Threepoint, Skid Steer Attachment Depot is about 40 miles +/- from me, hence, I'll just go pick it up (assuming I decide to buy it).

I looked at the EA Wicked stuff: Double the price, $1990 vs $1000, plus I still need the 3rd function controller etc.

Turby's, thanks for posting those link to the Construction Attachments videos! CA has several dealers in my area, so buying the parts should be easy. Don't know what installation would cost if I decided to have them do it. Gonna call SSAD this morning and see if they have the kits, do installation etc.

Thanks,

 

[LD1]

Just 435 lbs, and they've increased the cylinder size/clamping force. They've added what they call "protection bars", which look like a nice feature. Also, tines are spaced at 7.5". Just some more data points for you.

Actually in this case, the SS depot will probably have more clamping force w/2" cylinder than the EA with 2.5" cylinder.

The EA uses a 5" stroke and opens 38", The SS depot uses 8" and opens 35". So even though the cylinder is smaller, the mechanical advantage is greater.

And tend to agree, gaining a mere 165# lift capacity (bout 6-7% increase) at double the price.......I wouldnt pay the premium for that reason alone.

 

[LD1]

I also wonder why the SS depot is listed as being so heavy.

I have been considering the tomahawk grapples. Tomahawk Attachments :: Tomahawk 72" HD Two-Cylinder Brush Grapple

Their 72" model uses 1/2" ribs/tines as opposed to 3/8". And the same number of them as the SS depot. Yet tomahawk only lists 535#. Price is similar. I have seen them at dealers in my area for ~$1200.

Wonder if the 600# is accurate for the SS depot unit, or if that is shipping weight including pallet or crate??

 

[joeu235]

I would be concerned that the hydraulic fittings on the cylinder are exposed. Crunch down on a stump that sticks through the tines and you've got hydraulic fluid squirting everywhere.

 

[Threepoint]

I also wonder why the SS depot is listed as being so heavy.

I have been considering the tomahawk grapples. Tomahawk Attachments :: Tomahawk 72" HD Two-Cylinder Brush Grapple

Their 72" model uses 1/2" ribs/tines as opposed to 3/8". And the same number of them as the SS depot. Yet tomahawk only lists 535#. Price is similar. I have seen them at dealers in my area for ~$1200.

Wonder if the 600# is accurate for the SS depot unit, or if that is shipping weight including pallet or crate??

Good point. I'm wondering about that, too. Worth a call to SS Depot. As you note, the SS Depot and Tomahawk models have 8 tine sections of 1/2" solid plate. The EA has nine tine sections of 3/8" plate cored out to reduce weight. But it also has the three horizontal "protection bars" running the full width, so that has to add something. For that matter, I'm wondering if the 435 lb weight listed on EA's web site has been updated yet to reflect the new Ver. 2 enhancements. Maybe EA will weigh in on this.

The Tomahawk grapple looks interesting, but I notice that the cylinders aren't centered on the lids. Don't know if that makes much difference as a practical matter. But seems to me it could contribute to asymmetric loading that could cause the lids to rack at the hinges.

I'm sure all three grapples would serve my needs fine. Assuming that the 600 lbs listed on the SS Depot site is accurate, I agree that the 165 lb reduction in FEL lifting capacity than with the EA is not much of a trade off, if that were to be the last determining factor. I think these tractors have enough FEL lift capacity to spare. Another thing to consider, though, is that 165 lbs of surplus weight for every payload requires that much compensating weight at the rear of the tractor to maintain the same balance front-to-back. In my case, the counterweight will usually be a 750 lb Woods BSM84 box blade. I'm hoping that that, along with loaded rear tires, would be enough with either grapple.