Tractor dies intermittantly

[Jerry/MT]

The reason for the high and low current is it takes more current to move the solenoid than to hold it. If you used high current to hold it the solenoid would fail prematurely. I know it seems like it was over thought but it actually makes sense. You see the same thing with relays. There are momentary and constant duty relays. If you mix them they may work for a while but they wont last.

I have seen problems like yours on the Cummins engines at work and the fuel cut off solenoid is a common cause. I know its not a tractor but the idea should be similar.

the operative word in my response was "design". You can design the solenoid to take continuous pull in current. It certainly is a higher current but you can design for it. Bigger diameter windings should do it and the resistance would be less and the I^2 * R losses ( i.e. heat in the coil) should be less. As CalG pointed out, the envelop of the solenoid would most likely be bigger so that has to be accounted for in the design integration into the engine installation.

 

[CalG]

the operative word in my response was "design". You can design the solenoid to take continuous pull in current. It certainly is a higher current but you can design for it. Bigger diameter windings should do it and the resistance would be less and the I^2 * R losses ( i.e. heat in the coil) should be less. As CalG pointed out, the envelop of the solenoid would most likely be bigger so that has to be accounted for in the design integration into the engine installation.

I would prefer NOT to have the power draw of such a device.

Example. In preparation for the coming winter, I needed to "put away" the sports car, and mount the snow plow on the Fordson. Having the Hurlimann and the Bolens as "lawn and yard" tractors, the Fordson hadn't been run since last winter. (and we didn't have much of a winter at that) Still, with a MAGNETO ignition, the 65 year old Fordson started right up. No battery drain, nothing that needed any "cold cranking amps", just turn on the fuel tap, set the choke, the throttle, and the ignition advance and give the handle a pull. Ahh,,,simplicity! ;-)

 

[Jerry/MT]

I would prefer NOT to have the power draw of such a device.

Example. In preparation for the coming winter, I needed to "put away" the sports car, and mount the snow plow on the Fordson. Having the Hurlimann and the Bolens as "lawn and yard" tractors, the Fordson hadn't been run since last winter. (and we didn't have much of a winter at that) Still, with a MAGNETO ignition, the 65 year old Fordson started right up. No battery drain, nothing that needed any "cold cranking amps", just turn on the fuel tap, set the choke, the throttle, and the ignition advance and give the handle a pull. Ahh,,,simplicity! ;-)

Personally, I prefer fewer failure modes. With a block heater in the winter, starting is not an issue.

 

[davemhughes]

Well so far I completely drained and cleaned the fuel tank. I then took the fuel filter off and drained and cleaned it ensuring fuel flowed correctly. I took some bends out of the fuel lines. I turned the ignition switch on a let fuel flow to ensure it all flowed well and the pump was pumping. The intermittent dying continued with the Stop Solenoid making it's clicking sounds. Could not find this mysterious "Module" and I completely removed the loader arms and hood and mounts to really get in there and look around for wires and anything else that did not look right. I also checked my digital service manual for it also.

I ordered a new ignition switch and ordered a new Stop Solenoid from China paying for quicker shipping. I hate changing parts like this but I figure it cheaper than letting the dealer do the same thing and paying threw the nose for it.

 

[CalG]

I'm quite sure you will find the Fuel cut off control unit, the blinker control box and the heater timer under the steering cowl. Mounted to the fire wall. You will find them when you put in that switch ;-)

What model tractor do you have? SAME Solaris ##?

While you are waiting for the parts to arrive, unplug one or both of the wires connecting the shut off solenoid when you need to use the tractor. 'Just might do the trick to keep you running. ;-)

 

[davemhughes]

Thanks man, I guess I will see it when I do the ignition switch. Sort of dreading that part but like everything else it has to be done. I will remember to unplug the solenoid when it starts dying frequently until I change the part that actually needs changing to fix this.

I have the Solaris 40,owned since new (currently 681 hrs), just repaired the fiberglass hood that completely broke off :banghead:

2 more years and then I plan to get something bigger (50-60hp) but until then I want it to run right.

Also I checked and Anderson Tractor sells Hurlimann's

 

[CalG]

Thanks! I'll give them a call!

The hood on the Hurlimann is all steel. That made straightening out the rip when I was tumbling a large root an easy task with hammer. dolly, and the O/A torch. The head lights don't aim quite right now however ;-)

ETA Be ready for a let down when you "move up", These S&L&H (D-F) tractors are full featured in a small package. It's going to take some cash to get it all in another tractor.
A locking Front Diff is SPECIAL! ;-)

 

[CalG]

Your model may have the interconnection to the oil pressure sender which is located near to the fuel cut off solenoid.
And the interconnect to the coolant temperature sensor (I'm not sure where that sensor is located.

From the Agrokid service info, the oil pressure switch is a normally CLOSED switch (yellow wire), while the coolant sensor is normally OPEN. They both act to signal the cut off control unit through diodes, so the exact function may be obscured.

Here is an excerpt from the AgroKid service literature regarding the "Key cut off system":

"This system consisting of a switch, a control timer and a solenoid,
permits the operator to shut off the engine by turning the starter
switch key to OFF position. Another function of this system is to
shut off the engine automatically when the oil pressure is too low,
or when coolant temperature is too high."

Another item of note is that for the later modes, both "energize to stop" and "energize to run" systems are shown in the schematics. Easy to tell which, ETS has only two wires to the solenoid, ETR has three wires (with NO control unit!)

 

[pmsmechanic]

So if none of the parts you ordered solve the problem here is my solution.

If the fuel solenoid shuts of the fuel by having power sent to it for 5-6 seconds then it should be quite easy to wire in a momentary on switch (ie like a starter button) that you just hold in untill the engine shuts off. This would bypass all of the electronics. This doesn't solve the problem but it makes the tractor usable.

Also a faulty oil pressure switch could be causing the problem.

 

[davemhughes]

Great, now it could also be faulty sensors :confused3: Well to be honest if the parts I have ordered (Ignition switch & 2 wire Stop Solenoid) do not fix it I am going to concede defeat and haul it to the dealer so I replaced most of the expensive stuff by that time.

I need to check and see what unplugging the solenoid does as if that allows me to run the tractor I can just lug it down to kill it.

I agree the tractor has a lot of features but several I never use (Locking diff, rear remotes, 1000rpm PTO, Mid PTO)
Looking at the LS series tractors as the Andersons are LS dealers also. But I got to get this running first and then milk it for another 2yrs (Hopefully)