Tractor for land clearing and preparation

[Rockbadchild]

1 - 2 inch trees? I've done that with a riding lawn mower. I've done a lot with it. "Oh it's bad for your mower", save your comments, the mower is 24 years old. Still runs and cuts fine.

yeah but he has 300 acres of it … i am assuming the trees are bigger then that or it is very very dense …

 

[Rockbadchild]

Mulchers just make a mess. Mulching is really only a good option if you plan on waiting years before you do any ground engagement work and you continue mowing it for those years. Sure you could mulch 2 inch trees or a heavier duty bush hog could do that. But the stumps are still in the ground. How to you plan on planting with thousands of stumps and a thick layer of tree mulch on the ground? You’re still going to have to rake it with a dozer. You might as well start with that option and save the cost of mulching. And land clearing is expensive. You’re delusional to think you’re going to get it done for only a few dollars an acre. Bigger equipment cost less to do the same job as smaller equipment. It wouldn’t exist if it didn’t. It took me like 10 minutes to rough in this driveway on my dozer. How long would the same job take with a small tractor

I know what you are saying but making a mess is inevitable regardless of the option… just brains storming here, how big of a stumps a 2” trees leave behind ? he will have to bottom plow it regardless if not these roots will sprout again. A bottom plow will go through roots from two inch trees … it might get jammed once in a while between the plow’s but he could do it with a large single deep bottom plow. But then i agree he will be picking up roots and piece of wood for ever after… Then with a Dozer with a rootrake in front won’t catch everything ether at the small diameter of these trees or just have the blade and he will be ripping all the top soils and you still have to deal with a brush piles or you don’t and let if rot for many years … just a matter of choosing your poison i guess … regardless it’s a tremendous task … we have all these choice equipments and we are complaining when the pioneers did it by hand with a few horses lol.

 

[big bubba]

OP: have you stated why you want to clear 300 acres, how cost effective the project would be, or is cost not an issue. forgive if i missed something scanning through the replies

 

[paulsharvey]

Take at look at some of this guy's videos. That's a 10 ft forestry chopper. Now, I "think" I read similar size Requires 150 hp, Min; but the picture I posted earlier has an 84" one that 'claims' 75hp requirement. If you are more handy then rich; you could take a 48" heavy steel pipe; weld grader blade cutting edges around it, say every 12" around the circumference; weld end caps out of 1/2" plate; put a 3" steel axle shaft; and some short of draw bar hook up. A large propane take would also work; but the blades are a function part to break up the wood/roots. Fill it with water; that adds another 6400 lbs; for about a 10-12,000 lbs chopper. Like he talked about; chop then Rome plow/breaker disc or bottom plow or subsoiler; and no joke, a ton of ground picking/piling/burning; this could be spread up by a chisel and chain harrow; but in the end; somebody had to pick it up.

I would imagine for 300 acres your going to want to be running a absolutely min of 8-9ft equipment; probably more like 12 ft equipment; look at the HP recommendations for any 12ft ground engaging equipment....

8 ft equipment; you might get 24 acres/day; 12 ft equipment maybe 35 acres per day. 8 ft would be 12.5 days of straight culvivating; 12.5 days of straight planting; all with no weather problems; break downs; ect. A 12 ft off set disc would require about 60 brawbar HP. Maybe an engine 80hp would do what you want; no way in heck a 60hp engine HP tractor is going to survive constant 12ft ground engaging impliments. I dont think the price of a light used 100hp tractor is as big of a jump over a 75hp is as much as you think. Quick scan on the Web shows several 100-125hp Massey Fergusons with loaders for $67,000, 2016-2018 models; with under 2000 hours.

I dont know if any 60hp are autosteer compatible; and the Tech stuff maybe dictate your primary farm tractor, once the clearing is done.

 

[paulsharvey]

Good day everybody,

I'm looking to buy a tractor which will be mainly used for land clearing and preparation in the beginning. Land is full of small 1-2 inch thick trees which need to be cleared.
Short story, I bought recently 300 acres of virgin land which needs to be cleared, leveled, prepared from scratch.
Initially I was thinking to start with an 80 hp tractor with a front and loader , grapple and leveler but afterwards I had second thoughts that it might be cheaper fuel wise to start with an 50-60 hp tractor which might reduce my costs for clearing the land but I will have to buy a bigger tractor afterwards for land preparation, tilling, planting.

Short version; no matter what you end up doing; start with the larger tractor. Buying small to save fuel and up sizing later; 1st: you won't save fuel; 25% more trips at 15% fuel savings=more fuel; 2nd: your going to put a lot of wear and tear trying to push the smaller machine; probably decreasing the resale value; that 50-60hp might be in rough shape after 300 acres of this; and you already know your going to need bigger for your end use. Might even be worth it to start out with a larger tractor/machine that is more primitive and old; say a 1980s 150hp; knowing that you will later step into a 100hp-125hp more modern machine.

Something like the New Holland Woods Boss; its a 120hp tractor model designed for Right of Way clearing/mowing; used by foresty departments and powerline companies; sounds like exactly what your needing. Now, it's not going to be a row crop package; but that's not to say the cage can't be removed after; change to a typical ag style tire; ect.

I did read into this crop tillage and planting; but if your talking grass pasture you could bush hog/chop; then disc; then hydroseed. If your long term goal is cattle pasture; it doesn't have to be picturesque hay field.

 

[ROUSTABOUT]

yeah but he has 300 acres of it … i am assuming the trees are bigger then that or it is very very dense …

1"-2" ? Sounds like a bush hogging job. Will be easier than cutting thick grass.

 

[Rockbadchild]

1"-2" ? Sounds like a bush hogging job. Will be easier than cutting thick grass.

I know and I agree but see that’s the thing I find the words somewhat misleading … it’s land clearing and it’s full of small trees, it’s a virgin land that need to be prepared from scratch but the trees are 1-2” diameters and it’s 300 acres … so it’s hard to visualize … was it clear cut by a foresters compagnie or burn by a forest fire and it new growth with very dense 6’ tall trees with old stumps all over the place ? …is it in the desert or in the prairies? it dosent sound like a old field that was neglected and starting to grow back with a few sporadic trees … that’s where my confusion is.

“used for land clearing and preparation in the beginning. Land is full of small 1-2 inch thick trees which need to be cleared. I bought recently 300 acres of virgin land which needs to be cleared, leveled, prepared from scratch”

 

[paulsharvey]

That's what I'm saying; everyone who reads it is picturing something in their mind; and that'd why we have; I assume; good intentioned comments from D9 to lawn mower.

I read tillage and seeding and assumed row crop production is his plan; but reading it again and again; he could mean disc and grass seed.

In my part of the world; what he describes is common after about 5 years after cutting planted pines; but once you get in there and look, there's lots of 12" stumps hidden.

It doesn't help to say; outside the USA; it could be Thailand, and I have idea how to treat a bamboo forest; or it could be Chihuahua Mex and it's mesquite. It could be Belarus, and it's giant hog nettle. My first thought was central america; but we could just as easily be in South Africa.

The term 1-2" trees throws me off too. Noone around here would call it a tree, that would be dense brush. Also; people often say 1-2" and it's maybe 2-4" at chest height and 5-8" balls at the base. Soft wood vs hard as rock species; lot of dry climate "brush" is very hard; if it's wet swampy stuff; it might pull out easily.

Also; 300 acres is a big chunk of anything to start from scratch.

Local labor if we are in Vietnam might be $20/day; but if we are in Portugal, there might not even be labor to hire at $200/day.

We might have laws regulating burning; or it might be the wild west...

We might be dealing with an area that new equipment is virtual impossible to get; or there might be a Kirovets K700 for sale for $5000 down the road, with a 14 ft wide deap turning plow...

All that said; I wish I had 300 acres of 1-2" trees...

 

[bcp]

Call your local biomass facility and tell them to come and get it or you'll throw it out.



Bruce

 

[Rockbadchild]

Call your local biomass facility and tell them to come and get it or you'll throw it out.



Bruce

in our neck of the woods they wouldn’t be interested in that … there is free biomass everywhere never mind having to work for it.

 

[Egon]

wow that disk is something else to pull

Yes it is. There are smaller ones still heavy enough to chop up stumps and tree stems.
My main point is 300 acres is little to much for low horsepower lightweight gear. Both time wise and job properly done for putting the land into cultivation. This will also apply for working the land agriculturally.

The original members of my family that came to Canada cleared many acres but it was a long hard process. They first killed the trees by cutting a circular strip of bark off of the tree, waited a few years and used axe’s/saws to fell the trees. Then four horse teams to pull stumps and a single bottom walk behind breaking plow followed by disks, harrows, rakes and hand labour to pick roots. It was a tedious undertaking. There were no tractors.

 

[Rockbadchild]

Yes it is. There are smaller ones still heavy enough to chop up stumps and tree stems.
My main point is 300 acres is little to much for low horsepower lightweight gear. Both time wise and job properly done for putting the land into cultivation. This will also apply for working the land agriculturally.

The original members of my family that came to Canada cleared many acres but it was a long hard process. They first killed the trees by cutting a circular strip of bark off of the tree, waited a few years and used axe’s/saws to fell the trees. Then four horse teams to pull stumps and a single bottom walk behind breaking plow followed by disks, harrows, rakes and hand labour to pick roots. It was a tedious undertaking. There were no tractors.

I get it and I have the same thoughts...

I know its crazy the work that was done so so little.

 

[Egon]

I get it and I have the same thoughts...

I know its crazy the work that was done so so little.

Another on land clearing:

 

[plowhog]

good intentioned comments from D9 to lawn mower.

 

[Rockbadchild]

Another on land clearing:

wow that's crazy... I am surprise they can go right to disking

 

[EddieWalker]

Do not buy a dozer to clear land. It's probably the very worse machine for clearing land ever used. Years ago, they where popular, but labor and fuel was cheap, and everyone had a big dozer sitting around to use.

The only thing that is effective at clearing land is an excavator. The bigger the better. Do not even try to clear that much land with anything under 20 tones. That would be the starting point. It's big and powerful enough to take out any trees, and fast enough to make it worth your time. If you can find a 30 ton machine, that would be even better.

What everyone seems to be missing is what do you do when the trees are out of the ground. It's easy taking them out, it's very hard getting them to the burn pile. A dozer with a root rake takes forever to take out a tree, but when the tree is on the ground, it's even worse at piling them up to burn. Even with a rake, you will get massive amounts of soil in your burn pile. The dirt slows down the burn, and it builds up so quickly that you will be left with mountains of it at every burn pile to deal with. The excavator can pick up the entire tree, root and all, and put it on top of the burn pile. This way it burns cleanly and quickly.

That would be step one.

Depending on your soil, what you want to grow, and how much time you have, you can sell the excavator and buy a dozer to clean up the land after it's cleared. A dozer is good at this. The bigger the dozer, the faster you will get it done. Mine is 170 hp, and it's pure torture after a few hours, but it does move a lot of dirt fairly quickly.

Once you have the land graded, then you can sell the dozer and look into buying a tractor to farm the land. Not knowing your crop, or how much time you will have to till, plant and harvest your crops, I would suggest starting out with something over 100 HP with 4 wheel drive. It doesn't really what brand you get, at that size, they are all pretty much the same. Just buy something that you can get parts for when it breaks down. The more HP you have, the bigger the implement you can use, and the more you can get done in a day.

Avoid shortcuts, and especially anything that looks like a neat or clever idea. Stick with what's been proven to work, and what is used on big commercial operations.

 

[paulsharvey]

So, as a way of rewording the OPs question (based on what he told us); if all you had was a 75hp 4wd tractor with loader; how would you go about clearing 1-2" thick brush over 300 acres; with "unlimited time", with the end goal of culvivating crops, while not taking out loans.

I would get a heavy duty bush hog; mow down a 5 acre square, then run the heaviest disc I could get my hands on over it multiple times, from multiple angles.

I would then run a rake of some sort, or maybe a chisel plow to cut and pull roots to the surface.

I would try to push the debris in about 8 ft wide windrows, about 24 ft apart; and burn them.

I would look for old heavy impliments locally such as 8 ft off set disc; 3 bottom plow; 3 tooth subsoiler; and use what I could find.

I would probably fabri-cobble together something heavy and steel, and drag the he'll out it. It could be as simple as a couple heavy chains and some I beams or rail road rails; or even a fairly round, heavy log.

And if affordable, I would hire some local day workers to pick roots.

If the 1st 5 acres goes good; I would temp seed 1st 5 acres with a fast growing cover crop and attack the next 5 acres. If the 1st 5 acres takes 3 weeks-3 months; and yields unsatisfactory results; I would adjust my original plan.

If it was primarily vines/briars; I would attack it a bit different; I would 1st; box out a 5 acre square with a 12 ft wide fire break; I would then spray a broad spectrum herbicide on that 5 acres; I would then wait 3 weeks; and about 48 hours before a good rainy forecast, I would start multiple fires in the dead vines/brush/briars. I would then assess the results; and remove stumps/roots as above; But I would be willing to plow/disc/chisel Around the odd stumps.

If it was more of a mesquite type environment, with tougher brush/trees, but spaced more widely; I might try: run a bottom plow or dig/cut wide roots around 75% of a single "tree", wrap a logging chain around the base; and pull individual "trees" out. I would then disc/chisel once I had a 5 acre square "cleared" and plant a fast growing cover crop.

If it was giant hog nettle type stuff; I would start by cussing the man who sold it too me; then spray; and disc; while in full long sleeve everything, and an enclosed cab machine.

 

[4570Man]

Do not buy a dozer to clear land. It's probably the very worse machine for clearing land ever used. Years ago, they where popular, but labor and fuel was cheap, and everyone had a big dozer sitting around to use.

The only thing that is effective at clearing land is an excavator. The bigger the better. Do not even try to clear that much land with anything under 20 tones. That would be the starting point. It's big and powerful enough to take out any trees, and fast enough to make it worth your time. If you can find a 30 ton machine, that would be even better.

What everyone seems to be missing is what do you do when the trees are out of the ground. It's easy taking them out, it's very hard getting them to the burn pile. A dozer with a root rake takes forever to take out a tree, but when the tree is on the ground, it's even worse at piling them up to burn. Even with a rake, you will get massive amounts of soil in your burn pile. The dirt slows down the burn, and it builds up so quickly that you will be left with mountains of it at every burn pile to deal with. The excavator can pick up the entire tree, root and all, and put it on top of the burn pile. This way it burns cleanly and quickly.

That would be step one.

Depending on your soil, what you want to grow, and how much time you have, you can sell the excavator and buy a dozer to clean up the land after it's cleared. A dozer is good at this. The bigger the dozer, the faster you will get it done. Mine is 170 hp, and it's pure torture after a few hours, but it does move a lot of dirt fairly quickly.

Once you have the land graded, then you can sell the dozer and look into buying a tractor to farm the land. Not knowing your crop, or how much time you will have to till, plant and harvest your crops, I would suggest starting out with something over 100 HP with 4 wheel drive. It doesn't really what brand you get, at that size, they are all pretty much the same. Just buy something that you can get parts for when it breaks down. The more HP you have, the bigger the implement you can use, and the more you can get done in a day.

Avoid shortcuts, and especially anything that looks like a neat or clever idea. Stick with what's been proven to work, and what is used on big commercial operations.

It would be pretty hard to consider a dozer the worst land clearing machine. A dozer beats the heck out of a tractor for clearing. A dozer benefits greatly from having an excavator to knock over larger trees and to stack taller burn piles but an excavator is pretty bad at transporting brush longer distance and isn’t very good for leveling up the stump holes. Throwing a whole tree on a burn pile might be easy enough but when it’s been logged and you’re left with 50 million pieces of brush a dozer to gather then up is the only real option. An excavator isn’t very good at clearing 2” trees either. If you don’t have a pretty good thumb setup a 2” tree is hard to grab and even if you do pulling every tree separately takes forever. It’s way faster push out a 10ft path at once.

 

[Torvy]

Given the vastly different tasks here, I would contemplate what you really want to do. Clear land or grow crops. Clearing 300 acres is a large area to do alone with a small to mid sized tractor. I would likely try to hire out the clearing portion if raising crops was my goal.

300 acres of saplings is a lot of biomass to dispose of. You need a plan just for that. Burn, mulch, or a huge slash pile all have drawbacks. If i had to do it myself, I think I would personally mulch it first, then move the mulched material into a set aside area and then remove roots/stumps. Of course, seeing pictures may change that. It may be better to use an excavator and pull them up by the roots. I would also break it into sections and do 5-10 acres at a time. This will be slow or expensive no matter which way you decide.

 

[mikester]

Mulchers just make a mess. Mulching is really only a good option if you plan on waiting years before you do any ground engagement work and you continue mowing it for those years. Sure you could mulch 2 inch trees or a heavier duty bush hog could do that. But the stumps are still in the ground. How to you plan on planting with thousands of stumps and a thick layer of tree mulch on the ground? You’re still going to have to rake it with a dozer. You might as well start with that option and save the cost of mulching. And land clearing is expensive. You’re delusional to think you’re going to get it done for only a few dollars an acre. Bigger equipment cost less to do the same job as smaller equipment. It wouldn’t exist if it didn’t. It took me like 10 minutes to rough in this driveway on my dozer. How long would the same job take with a small tractor? View attachment 798714

Rent a mulcher to clear the land then get a sub soiler to grind up roots and rocks in place and push the leftover mulch below the soil.