Traffic ettiquette

[jmc]

I'm looking for a reality check here. First, a little background-

This is a college town with a lot of bicycle traffic. Most bikers do ok and some bikers are especially carefully about obeying traffic laws, even though thats harder on a bike than in a powered vehicle. But then there is that last group. They ride down one way streets backward. Sometimes at night without lights. They morph between vehicle and pedestrian, depending on which right of way suits them. They zoom near you from behind on the sidewalks. They give the rest of the bikers a bad reputation. Not because they are malicious- just clueless. This summer one was killed by a cement truck as the biker was riding backwards down a one way main drag.

The city has thoughtfully put in bike lanes where room allows. They are one bike wide and well marked.

Tonight my daughter(12 YO) and I were trying to get past 2 bikes riding abreast. One was in the bike lane along the right side of the road and the other biker was next to him, blocking my lane. When oncoming traffic cleared, I pulled up beside the bike in my lane and said "Why don't you use the bike lane!" somewhat forcefully. They both looked at me indignantly. No suprise there but my daughter told me she was embarrassed I confronted him and thought the tone of my voice was rude.

Was I out of line?

BTW, 2 blocks later they passed me and I saw the guy formerly in my lane go full speed thru a busy 4 way stop.

John

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Not at all out of line. The biker was lucky all you did was fuss at him. Wasn't there a young woman hit while bike riding, then tossed off a bridge in an attempt to hide the death in Bloomington, just a while back?

 

[Junkman]

If the local police start enforcing the traffic laws, there will be less problems. One thing that these clowns don't realize that in most states being on a bicycle doesn't exempt you from the traffic laws. If you have a drivers license, the violation is the same as if you were driving a car. I would push the local law enforcement people to start enforcing the rules of the road. It won't take long for the word to get out that it can get expensive to violate the traffic laws.

 

[Egon]

</font><font color="blue" clasr="small">( One thing that these clowns don't realize )</font>

Many of these clowns riding cycles rdalize exactly what the rules are.

Now do the clowns driving the cars that beleive the cyclists should disapear know what they are.

Egon

 

[RedRocker]

We call folks like that donors.

 

[Junkman]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( We call folks like that donors. )</font>

I assume that you were refering to "organ donors" not "financial donors"...... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[JimR]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( We call folks like that donors. )</font>

That's what the hospital emergency ward calls motorcyle riders that don't wear helmets.

 

[JimR]

You were in the right to tell them they were in the wrong. Come to Ma. You'll likely get close to being hit for doing something that stupid. The drivers here are just plain stupid. Both bicycle and automobile.

 

[MikePA]

Please remember that TBN is a Family Friendly Site and language that's appropriate other places, is not here. (Refer to the Terms of Service and the FAQ) Also, replacing obviously inappropriate words with ***** or ----- are not acceptable alternatives. Thanks! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Cowboyjg]

I wouldn't base your questioning of yourself on your daughters reaction. Her reaction was really based on her own embarrasment issues. I've encountered that with my 4 from time to time as they have been growing up.

What you've experienced is a sad sign of what has become more common place. A basic lack of respect for one another, a sort of self centerdness. Now I'm not talking about donation giving in times of crisis. That's an anomoly of sorts in the big picture. What I'm refering to is the day to day general indifference displayed by people toward each other.

I have a theory I've been kicking around about this ever increasing behavior I'm seeing. When I was growing up I remember a common message told to me by the various role models in my life. "Learn to take care of yourself because no-one is gonna do it for you". Now, I took that to mean there was no free lunch and I should become self relient and work for the things I wanted out of life. Somehow, somewhwere along the way I think that got translated into something like "You just worry about youself" and "be careful out there, people will try to take advantage of you"...and so on. This... to me....never seemed to be tempered by direction of kindness and compassion. There are, of course, a whole host of supporting characters in this production, like the media in particular. I'm not quite sure it's a liberal v conservative issue. I think it's really more than any one thing that has lead to this change in values. I know I don't believe that as a society we are making progress. What ever we seem to gain in the technological area we loose alot more in the human relationship area.

To answer you question though....no I don't believe you were out of line. I have the same experience on a daily basis. I am working 5 construction projects along a beach road near me and need to visit my crews there several times a day. This area for the last several years has been a prime spot for renovation and new construction. It's a narrow two lane road and quite often one vehicle will have to give way for another in order to pass. There is what appears to be a colony of bicycle riders (I have nothing against bicycle riders and I'm only kidding about the colony) who every day, all day, sometimes in groups and sometimes individually ride up and down this 2-3 mile stretch of road. Many times it's several abreast taking up more than half the road so as to prevent vehicles from passing. The observation is that nobody wants to give. Not even a little. I know the day is coming when a driver and a rider go toe to toe. I see verbal confrontations periodically and think it's only a matter of time. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[RedRocker]

Speaking of getting together, recently in Dallas a woman gave a bicycle rider a little "love" tap at Whiterock Lake when he wouldn't share the road. Guy got banged up and the Gal was arrested. Big trial and she was found guilty. Funny thing is she was on her way to meet some friends to ..........you guessed it, ride bicycles, she is a lawyer too. Not sure what the message is here, but it's interesting. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[hobbyfarm]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Traffic ettiquette )</font>

That very title is an oxymoron.

 

[Boondox]

In most states, certainly in Vermont, it is perfectly legal to ride two abreast. I've complained to the police several times about a few bikers who completely block the lane on blind curves, pointing out that the law also requires slower traffic to stay right and not impede traffic flow. The police won't touch it. I pointed out that someday, when faced with a choice between a head on collision and swerving to the right while passing a bike lane hog, the biker would lose. The police assured me I would be arrested for manslaughter!

The sad this is my wife and I both ride bikes carefully and courteously, yet pay the price in the form of motorists' ire. Fresh from their encounters with those road hogging bikers, some motorists honk at my wife and I even though we are within six inches of the shoulder!

 

[JimR]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( In most states, certainly in Vermont, it is perfectly legal to ride two abreast. I've complained to the police several times about a few bikers who completely block the lane on blind curves, pointing out that the law also requires slower traffic to stay right and not impede traffic flow. The police won't touch it. I pointed out that someday, when faced with a choice between a head on collision and swerving to the right while passing a bike lane hog, the biker would lose. The police assured me I would be arrested for manslaughter!

The sad this is my wife and I both ride bikes carefully and courteously, yet pay the price in the form of motorists' ire. Fresh from their encounters with those road hogging bikers, some motorists honk at my wife and I even though we are within six inches of the shoulder! )</font>

Motorists honk just to try and scare the you know what out of you. Usually they wait till they are right aside of you to do it and watch to see if you fall over. My wife and I both ride bicycles also. People in general, both motorists and cyclists in Ma. are rude road hogs. We also ride single file and do not hog the road. I think motorists would like nothing better than to make a hood ornament out of a cyclists. I liked it better back in the 70's when we all got along and there were many fewer cars on the roads.

 

[Junkman]

I will always give the horn a short tap upon approaching them so they realize that a car is coming. Usually about 300 - 500 feet before my car is when I do this. I don't want to scare them, but want to warn them that I am going to be going around them. Some will pull out into the middle of the road and block it. All I can do then is just follow them until it is safe to pass them. Usually that is when the road ends in town. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif Many of these people are also drivers, so I can't understand their lack of understanding that cars also need to get by.

 

[PitbullMidwest]

It's just not collage kids on bikes either. Last night when I went into town to pick up my daughter from volleyball practice, an older "gentleman" rode out into my lane from a side street without looking for traffic. Because of an oncoming car I wasn't able to pass him so I had to hit the brakes hard, the oncoming car wasn't sure if I was going to pass or not so he also hit the brakes hard. The old guy's reaction? We both got the finger.

So how's that for traffic ettiquette.

 

[Sigarms]

Jmc, I think you were in your "right" to do what you did.

Vermont is a very "pro bike" state, tourist season in particular.

I used to road bike often, then taking up mountain biking.

Where I now live I'm lucky /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif, there are road bikes "all over the place" on the "country roads" right outside of the "city" of Winston Salem.

What I have noticed is a change of attititudes (sp?) of when I used to ride compared to present day (I road most often in the early mid 90's).

When my friends and I rode, we were always aware of where traffic was, and ALWAYS road single file when going around bends/curves/blind spots. Whenever a car approached either from front or rear, we again went to single file.

Yes, there were idiots driving in cars, but...on a bike you would "lose" with a car, and we knew that.

We always rode defensivly (sp?).

Just the other week there had to be at least 30 people riding 4 abreast, blocking the driving lane. NO ONE would move over if a car approached.

I went to the local township building to complain, to no avail.

Seems like nowadays people ride bikes on the "offensive", which for better or worse, I think is wrong.

Those road signs that state "share the road" (with the bike on the sign) should be meant for the bikes to share with the cars, not the other way around.

 

[dmccarty]

Boondox,

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I pointed out that someday, when faced with a choice between a head on collision and swerving to the right while passing a bike lane hog, the biker would lose. )</font>

I have reached the same conclusion. I have had multiple run ins with bikers this year. They have done things that have put myself, themself and other drivers in danger. Some of it seems intentional on their point. If my choice is running off the road and hitting a ditch/tree, hitting another vehicle to have a 110mph collision or hit the biker, who do I pick?

These bikers are out of control where I live. Very aggressive and they DO NOT SHARE the road, they hog it. I have gotten to the point where I think that they should be banned from the roads. The roads I'm driving are heavily traveled rural road and the bikers are riding either singly, pairs or in a pack which makes things very dangerous for every one. Its bad when you go thorugh a blind curve or hill and then suddenly there is a biker or bikers right in front of you. I have seen them PULL out in front of me leaving me no choice but to hit them, go off the road, or go into the other lane and hope another car was not there....

In my area they are traveling some very busy rural roads at rush hour! /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif There are other roads they could use and they certainly could wait until the rush hour was over but they don't. Someone is going to get killed.

I USED to feel bad when I had to accelerate to get around a biker and smoke them with unburnt diesel fuel. I feel bad about wasting the fuel but I don't give a rats you know what about them breathing the fumes anymore...

Later,
Dan

 

[Boomerang1]

Bikers around here will ride on mountain roads with speed limits of 55 mph. and no shoulders. By law, we have to give them 3 feet of clearance. I love to fly by them in my 18 wheeler making sure they don't get any more than the 3 feet. me /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif bikers /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

 

[jmc]

Thanks all, for the feedback. I thought I would hear more about bicyclists' rights to the road so I suppose that guy really was pushing it.

Several responses seemed frustrated with bicyclists in general and that was one of my points- that the clowns make the responsible ones look bad. I've actually had bicyclists wave as I pass them after I waited for a safer opportunity. And many give up that precious momentum at intersections.

Farmwithjunk- Good memory. That girl's skeleton was found 2 or 3 years later in a remote part of the next county. The FBI had gotten some false leads from people who had claimed to have thrown her body in a branch of the local reservoir. They drained the branch, did not find the body of course, but found "some very good evidence". Later, when the body was found 30 miles away, they must have been pretty embarrassed. Nobody knows if it was a coverup of an accident or intentional.

John