Turf (R3) tires better in snow - but why?

[ning]

For car tires, snow tires mainly help by having a softer rubber compound that doesnt get as hard in the winter, and therefore bites ice and snow more effectively.

I am curious if Turf tires are softer rubber than R1 or R4s?

In cold hard-pack snow, the best car tires are those which are siped - they have small slits, which deform slightly as the tire rotates, which provide many more small ridges which cut into the hard pack snow to provide what I believe someone above called "mechanical traction" (much like what chains do - they dig in, like crampons or spikes or studs). Softness of the rubber may affect the ridging action; I wouldn't be surprised if harder rubber makes for better cold&dry snow traction. Soft rubber provides traction on a road by actually deforming into very small pockets in the pavement; I don't think you're going to get that sort of deformation on snow & ice.

My guess is that the Turf tires work the best in cold/dry/hard-packed snow because the leading edges of the small tread blocks mechanically dig in and provide grip. The large tread block on the R4 doesn't have as sharp of an edge, and even if the edge digs in, you have a large smooth surface what's quick to slide and then a big gap to the next one. The Turf has many small edges and less open space to slide on.

Sipes and small ridges don't help much in very wet snow / slush conditions; in those cases, about all you can hope for are tall narrow tires with enough weight that you can get the tire to the bottom of the slop, so the tire can get a grip on something solid. In these conditions, R1's for tractors (and tall narrow tires for a truck) are best.

R1's probably have decent traction even on hard pack because a heavy tractor will have lots of weight concentrated on the small tread bars, which makes them dig in at least a bit even in hard packed snow. They're not wide enough to get much floatation, which is fine for snow removal work (not sure if there's a situation where you'd want a tractor to have floatation?).

:cold:

 

[Industrial Toys]

Winter conditions are so variable, that you still wouldn't know what to choose. Ice, snow, deep snow, thawed snow all pose unique challenges for various tires.

And don't forget, tire size plays a major factor. Bigger is always better.

I had sleepless nights when I bought my loader with Turf tires. They do have issues on ice and when packed with mud, but on account of their ground friendly nature, I would not change them to anything else. I hate wrecked turf!

 

[ovrszd]

I don't understand this. Are you saying if your treads fill up with snow, this snow's friction with the snow below it provides the traction?

Yes. Whem I was a kid I had a snow tobaggon made from a piece of smooth rubber belting. It wasn't as fast as Griswold's disc sled but worked very well.

So snow tires are cut to retain snow on the contact patch, then throw it off during rotation.

 

[ovrszd]

For car tires, snow tires mainly help by having a softer rubber compound that doesnt get as hard in the winter, and therefore bites ice and snow more effectively.

I am curious if Turf tires are softer rubber than R1 or R4s?

The intent of better flexibility in a snow tire is to help it clean during rotation.

Maybe All Season tires use something similar?

 

[cqaigy2]

In regards to snow on a road surface. The rubber tire isn't what provides traction. Traction is provided by the friction of snow against snow. So the tire's ability to collect and hold snow in it's contact patch is equivalent to it's ability to provide traction. Consequently the tire with the most sipes, cavities and edges will always be better.

In regards to deep snow on a surface such as pasture, hay field, timber, etc. Traction in this situation is obtained by the tire's ability to displace the snow in large quantities and dig itself down to the good traction below. In this scenario the tire with the largest lug openings configured to self clean is best.

:thumbsup: or is that X1

 

[mcfarmall]

Ovrszd hit the nail on the head twice in a row. The principle he described is the reason why grooving R4 tires will improve their traction dramatically. Grooving, not siping on the R4's.

 

[ovrszd]

Ovrszd hit the nail on the head twice in a row. The principle he described is the reason why grooving R4 tires will improve their traction dramatically. Grooving, not siping on the R4's.

And that don't happen often.....

 

[LouNY]

Well here's my two cents on tires and snow.
I'll start this by saying I have no personal knowledge of turf tires on tractors other then lawn mowers.
On the farm out of 13 tractors there is one Kubota (about 45-50 hp) on R4's and I had mostly wore out R-4s on my Oliver 1550, 16.9-28's.
As far as I can see R4tires are a compromise between turf and Ag not real good on a lawn unless it's hard and dry and worthless in a field if the grass is wet or the slightest bit muddy.
As far as snow every storm is different, in my area most of the storms are a wetter snow then the western states get most of the time. When the temps are 25-35 and it's snowing its a packy slippery snow, in this snow any tire is good till it slips once its spins and makes ice your done. What I have seen an R1 tire will work good on this snow till it gets deep and a hill is involved.
When you get a snow and it's colder and the snow is drier and fluffier I don't know which tire would work the best but I would go for the R1 again.
When the snow is deep and settled and you are running on top of the settled snow the R1's work good till you start pulling hard when you start digging down and end up with a 6-8 inch step that you have to climb to get going again R1's may do it.

One thing not mentioned was the surface below the snow and it's temperature pavement and hard frozen dirt are much different then soft dirt or mud, in the last 2 R1's would again be my choice.


If I wasn't going to be on R1's I would just as soon have turfs, either way when snow is involved as far as I'm concerned high quality chains are the answer.
I have heard many people that get around with turfs or R4's in snow, in my situations you wouldn't get far or last long without chains.

 

[Industrial Toys]

I once read a rather scientific piece claiming that ice itself isn't slippery but rather a thin layer of water. I can't say I understand that but that's what I remember reading.

 

[oosik]

I would guess that R1's are superior to any other in the snow. On ice - I doubt any tractor tire does really well.

And as rankings go - chains on any type tractor tire will have better traction than any type of bare tractor tire.