Universal CUT Loader 3rd Function *final thoughts and best price*

[Sysop]

Ok, I've read hundreds of pages from several dozen threads weighing all the pros and cons of various methods and I'm about ready to make the plunge. I was fully well set on a DIY solution, but upon really digging into pricing things up it's really hard to beat the kits produced by some of the manufacturers. When you take into consideration what you end up with and also that you are more likely to end up with a wrong part or some fitting needed and not at hand when purchasing things individually, the kits begin looking more and more attractive. What's included in the kits though? Some aren't entirely clear.

I've noticed the electric valves like those on the universal type kits are rated anywhere from 13 to 24 GPM and any would be in excess of what my tractor produces. My thinking is, when you run too much pressure through one, it creates a restriction, fails, and leaks fluid all over. If it is rated for double, triple, or quadruple the tractor's output, it's no big deal, it just flows whatever the tractor pushes. One ran at it's rated capacity I'd think would be more prone to fail than one ran at half capacity... So given the choice, I'd prefer go with a valve with a higher rating with everything else being equal. Am I being silly?

I'm able to get the Construction Attachments universal kit with hoses, valve, handle, and wiring for $650 delivered. It's rated to 20GPM. I like the two button handle they use (by appearances anyway).

I'm able to get Brian's FitRiteHydraulics kit for $535 and I've not checked to see what all it includes or what the specs are. It seemed by the pictures on his site the FEL handle he uses has one button and a trigger which I could get used to, but I don't think I'd prefer it.

EverythingAttachments kit is $787 delivered (if you count the $50 coupon on their site) for up to 15GPM and I assume since there is a $60 hose saver upgrade, hoses are included, and the handle has a side to side rocker switch I'm sure I could get used to easily, but I don't know if I prefer it. Being a rocker switch I think rocking up and down would be preferable.

ANBO has a valve kit that is up to 24GPM with the wiring, not sure about a handle, hoses, or pricing... I'll need to call them for information as they want too much information to view their info online... :thumbsdown: (likely to bypass them altogether for that reason alone...)

Are there any other universal kits on the market I'm missing? For what you get in these systems, how much savings can you actually yield from someplace like surplus center on an equivalent system? Is it enough to warrant the searching and piecing together for a "non-hydraulics sorta guy"?

Thoughts? Opinions?

Thanks and have a great Monday morning everyone!

 

[J_J]

What is the purpose of the 3rd function valve?

If it is for a grapple, I would suggest a diverter/selector valve.

I would say the do it yourself round up of all the parts would save about half.

I would say it is up to you as to how good the installation will look.

12 VDC 10 GPM OC DA SOLENOID VALVE

1 STATION DO3 SUBPLATE OPEN CENTER

12 VDC 13.2 GPM SAE 8 DOUBLE SELECTOR VALVE

Look up all the parts and see if you can do it.

It's only money.

 

[Sysop]

What is the purpose of the 3rd function valve?

If it is for a grapple, I would suggest a diverter/selector valve.

I would say the do it yourself round up of all the parts would save about half.

I would say it is up to you as to how good the installation will look.

12 VDC 10 GPM OC DA SOLENOID VALVE

1 STATION DO3 SUBPLATE OPEN CENTER

12 VDC 13.2 GPM SAE 8 DOUBLE SELECTOR VALVE

Look up all the parts and see if you can do it.

It's only money.

Yes, the primary use would be grapple. Perhaps an auger or something later on also.

I have been pricing things up individually, and unless I go with items that are rated for substantially less GPM than the kits, the kits seem cheaper. For instance a 20GPM double selector is over $300, nearly half the cost of CA's 20GPM kit...

I think I prefer the true third function. I realize if I get three functions going at once things are going to move really slow, but I'd rather them move slow than need to choose what operation I want disabled while selecting diverted flow to the grapple. I can see times I would want both curl or lift to function while clamping or releasing the grapple. Not that I would be using all three functions at one time, but I want any of the three functions to work as a pair.

Where am I going wrong? With hoses and wires and connectors and the grip and everything, I do not see how I'm going to get an equivalent system for less money, let alone half.

I think I can make the installation of one of the universal kits look as good as anything. From what I can tell of the CA kit, the hoses and wires they send are somewhat too long for the average installation, but I can get them cut down and the ends replaced for next to nothing through a friend as long as I've got the hose which should clean up the install to "custom standards" nicely...

I know it's only money and money is a replenishable resource, but I try not to spend more on less when I can avoid it. I'm happy to pay more as long as I can see the difference the extra money buys.

Thanks for the reply! I hope you don't find my ignorance too annoying, I'm eager to learn all I can.

 

[J_J]

One more thing about true 3rd function you might not know, is that when activated, the valve provides full flow.


However, you can reduce the flow by reducing engine rpm or use a needle valve or a restrictor washer in the flow path.

 

[Sysop]

Wouldn't I want full flow for things like an auger and be best to install a flow restrictor at the grapple or whatever else I use I didn't want taking full flow?

 

[MtnViewRanch]

SYSOP, not sure why you are thinking that with the control grip that I provide you would have a trigger and a button, :confused3: normally you would get 2 buttons. I can furnishe any combination of the 2 buttons and 1 trigger switch, but typically only have a single trigger or 2 buttons and a trigger. It would be a custom request to have a single button and a trigger.

If you plan on running an auger, be sure to tell whoever you get this from that you want maintained switches. That or you may be using duct tape to hold the button down when drilling.

I believe that $535 was for a diverter setup. Normally a true 3rd function would be $560, but if you want to get the maintained switches, then the cost would go up. But if you want that capability to run the auger, you should have a maintained switch.

 

[Sysop]

I was going by the images on your site.



I assumed the forward-most controller was the FEL and was the controller handle shipped with the kit.

That's why I posted this thread. I'm getting closer to a purchase and wanted to get some comparison things worked out before committing.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I was going by the images on your site.

View attachment 342626View attachment 342627

I assumed the forward-most controller was the FEL and was the controller handle shipped with the kit.

That's why I posted this thread. I'm getting closer to a purchase and wanted to get some comparison things worked out before committing.

It is, but I use diverter 3rd functions on both of my tractors that have them and only require a single button. You would get a grip like this.

The rearward grip is the control grip for the rear remotes and has 2 buttons and a trigger for the 3 switches.

Just don't want people to get confused.

 

[Sysop]

Just don't want people to get confused.

As I obviously was.

You would get a grip like this.

If you plan on running an auger, be sure to tell whoever you get this from that you want maintained switches. That or you may be using duct tape to hold the button down when drilling.

I believe that $535 was for a diverter setup. Normally a true 3rd function would be $560, but if you want to get the maintained switches, then the cost would go up. But if you want that capability to run the auger, you should have a maintained switch.

So that controller above is what one would get with the $560 third function? The "maintained" are push-on push-off buttons? What else is included or required for installation? What is the max GPM of the valve (for sake of comparison)?

Sorry to hammer you with questions, these are the types of details I'm down to in a decision. I was seriously considering the CA kit primarily due to the completeness of it (not needing to seek out a silly little connector or something), controller ergonomics (which you've obviously "set me straight" on , I like yours better), high GPM availability (not that I ever plan on moving it to another unit, but who knows what the future holds), single point of contact for any questions or issues. At $560 if your valve is close to 20 I'd likely take the plunge your way even if I had to source some stuff myself, I know I can't source it all myself for that price and get it right.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

As I obviously was.





So that controller above is what one would get with the $560 third function? Yes The "maintained" are push-on push-off buttons? Yes What else is included or required for installation? I do not have a plug and play set. You will need to source the wire ends. I have no idea what each model out there has.What is the max GPM of the valve (for sake of comparison)? 15GPM

Sorry to hammer you with questions, these are the types of details I'm down to in a decision. I was seriously considering the CA kit primarily due to the completeness of it (not needing to seek out a silly little connector or something), controller ergonomics (which you've obviously "set me straight on ), high GPM availability (not that I ever plan on moving it to another unit, but who knows what the future holds), single point of contact for any questions or issues.

To be honest, the CA kit may very well be the best kit for YOU.

 

[CJONE]

Sysop, I do hydraulics for a living and MtnViewRanch's set up is hard to beat. No real advantage to go too large on your valve specs, the disadvantage is larger plumbing and a harder install. Anyway have fun. CJ

 

[Sysop]

CJONE, I'm honestly thinking it would be as well. I noticed how thick and inflexible the hoses on CA's kit were. I don't mind sourcing some stuff myself as long as I know what I'm in for and can plan ahead and have it ready to go when I am. I hate a single process ending up being a half dozen trips to the store. I think the main problem is there are benefits and drawbacks to ANYTHING I want to do and the goal is more to find the proper balance rather than a silver bullet. My purpose for this thread was to get the tidbits of info that either weren't available or were not quite clear to me (I'm sure I'm not the first person who's had curiosity over such things). I preferred CA's kit for the reasons I'd stated before, I preferred Brian's kit due to the obvious reason of price, but wasn't sure exactly what I was getting for the money (I now have a better idea). I also preferred Brian's kit because he's a one man operation just out trying to do the best by folk, that strikes close to home for me and I appreciate and respect that a lot (I'd pay extra for that alone).

MtViewRanch, the only wire ends I would be concerned with would be any sort of specialty connectors used on the valve or handle. If they just have pigtail wires hanging out or take something like a standard spade connector I could handle that, I can cut and splice or add standard connectors as needed (with some sort of diagram to follow). I even have several places I can have ends put on hoses. I never really considered the CA kit to be the best for me, my "serious consideration" was from frustration of not finding comparable "what's included" and "specs" info on other kits, or looking up individual parts and finding this requires that and another thing and by the time it's all said and done I'm approaching the kit costs and have a headache to boot. I like your controller, even though it isn't as high GPM as the CA kit, it easily beats the price on the equivalent EA kit and is far enough above my tractor GPM it quells any concerns there.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

CJONE, I'm honestly thinking it would be as well. I noticed how thick and inflexible the hoses on CA's kit were. I don't mind sourcing some stuff myself as long as I know what I'm in for and can plan ahead and have it ready to go when I am. I hate a single process ending up being a half dozen trips to the store. I think the main problem is there are benefits and drawbacks to ANYTHING I want to do and the goal is more to find the proper balance rather than a silver bullet. My purpose for this thread was to get the tidbits of info that either weren't available or were not quite clear to me (I'm sure I'm not the first person who's had curiosity over such things). I preferred CA's kit for the reasons I'd stated before, I preferred Brian's kit due to the obvious reason of price, but wasn't sure exactly what I was getting for the money (I now have a better idea). I also preferred Brian's kit because he's a one man operation just out trying to do the best by folk, that strikes close to home for me and I appreciate and respect that a lot (I'd pay extra for that alone).

MtViewRanch, the only wire ends I would be concerned with would be any sort of specialty connectors used on the valve or handle. If they just have pigtail wires hanging out or take something like a standard spade connector I could handle that, I can cut and splice or add standard connectors as needed (with some sort of diagram to follow). I even have several places I can have ends put on hoses. I never really considered the CA kit to be the best for me, my "serious consideration" was from frustration of not finding comparable "what's included" and "specs" info on other kits, or looking up individual parts and finding this requires that and another thing and by the time it's all said and done I'm approaching the kit costs and have a headache to boot. I like your controller, even though it isn't as high GPM as the CA kit, it easily beats the price on the equivalent EA kit and is far enough above my tractor GPM it quells any concerns there.

This info is for anyone looking at the thread.

Several things about most of my valve kits, electric or manual. You purchase a kit from me, you get 2 separate shipments. First shipment will be the control grip, the valve, the QDs in the mounting block. And a sample hose to be used for hose measurements.

You get these items mounted how and where YOU want them. You then use the sample hose, routing the hose how YOU feel is best and measure for each hose length. You get me the hose lengths. I get the hoses out to you, normally in 1-2 days. You then have a custom fit kit for your tractor, how you want it.

This takes a bit longer than if you buy a complete kit, this takes some thought on the purchasers end. Everything is not spelled out for you, there are just to many variables to be considered.

Everyone doe not like things done in the same manner, besides it being about impossible for me to have access to all the different makes and models to be able to have a 100% custom fit kit for every tractor out there.

So as of now, this procedure seems to be working out the best for my customers to get their custom fit valve kits.

The wires on the control grip are just striped ends and actually the bare ends are what get used at the valve. So depending on how and where you get your power, those would be the ends that you would need to get.

I probably forgot something, but you get the general idea.

 

[Sysop]

You sir are one awesome individual!

 

[hawkeye08]

Fit Rite would be the one I get if I ever need a 3rd function. I am still in the thinking stage (not yet planning) and I want some rear remotes, but if I am going to be messing the hydraulics, I might just want to go ahead and add the 3rd function also.. in case I want a grapple later....

 

[1648nc]

Sorry to highjack but mtnviewranch if you don't mind would you pm me a price minus hoses if you'll sell like that for a true 3rd function kit (valve, grip and switches, qds and mounting block etc.) If the tractor make matters its a massey 1648. I can make hoses but don't wanna track down all the other stuff. Thanks

 

[Sysop]

Don't be sorry, and feel free to post the price here. I'd be interested as well as I'm sure anyone else reading would be too. I'm sure future readers will understand if prices change later down the road (everything does). I posted this thread publicly because I was sure my questions were things others might wonder about as well, so any sorts of questions relating to anyone's "final thoughts and best price" questions or comments are 100% welcome, so hijacked it is not.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Sorry to highjack but mtnviewranch if you don't mind would you pm me a price minus hoses if you'll sell like that for a true 3rd function kit (valve, grip and switches, qds and mounting block etc.) If the tractor make matters its a massey 1648. I can make hoses but don't wanna track down all the other stuff. Thanks

Keep in mind that this kit is for an above 10GPM implement pump. I believe that yours is above 12GPM and we don't want to cook the oil.
Control grip with 2 momentary button switches
Valve with subplate
QDs in mounting bracket
Shipping
Total for this kit $570

Same kit, but for 10GPM & smaller systems. $459

Add $108 for hoses and fittings for either kit.


So for others looking for a complete kit shipped to your door.

10GPM and under kit. $567

10GPM and up kit. $676

 

[1648nc]

Thanks! I will definitely keep you in mind. Trying to decide between 3rd function or doing rear remotes first. You don't have any valve ideas for that do you? I don't really wanna pay mf prices for remotes but wanna make it look decent ( wanna hide it under the factory cover) don't wanna just mount a bank of valves on the fender.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Thanks! I will definitely keep you in mind. Trying to decide between 3rd function or doing rear remotes first. You don't have any valve ideas for that do you? I don't really wanna pay mf prices for remotes but wanna make it look decent ( wanna hide it under the factory cover) don't wanna just mount a bank of valves on the fender.

It really is best to just go with the OEM remotes. Pretty hard if not about impossible to match what they have to offer for the custom fit that they provide.