Traction Using a Tractor on Mountain Property

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

My only issue with the max and any other comparable brand name sub compact is that they have a pretty high price tag compared to their ability. Some of the heavier work you have to do may be to much for a small machine when you start talking about large trees and land clearing or building roads. A backhoe on a tractor that size as far as I am concerned is useless, not to ruffle any feathers but you guys simply cannot dig very well in hard ground especially in rocky soil with a machine that small. I have a kioti dk50se hydro with a Woods bh90x hoe, which is substantially larger than the machine you are considering, and it has no problem lifting my machine off the ground and moving it around when in harsher soil. Doing harsher work like this with a machine that is too small is hard on equipment and in some situations you won't even be able to accomplish the work you need done. For the money you will pay for a scut you can find a cut or utility tractor that is much more capable, even if you go used for a tractor that is well taken care of it will be worth it.

"Ability" I think is subjective. You guys who have machines that can take down the side of a mountain in a few passes have one idea of ability; for folks like me who've been doing everything with a rake and shovel for years, even a small tractor is a BIG step up. Even if my backhoe can only take small scoops, if it doesn't involve using my back and a shovel, it's a good thing.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

When it comes to Mahindra tractors what I know for sure amounts to exactly zero. I poked around a bit trying to answer your question and found the same info you gave me but not much else. I could not find if the rims were adjustable for width or if spacers were available or recommended. On this site.
Max 24 4WD HST | Mahindra
I noticed that for AG tires they use 9.5x 16 on the rear while the three they compare it to use 26x12-12.
The larger the tire the more Rimguard you can put in it. I'm not sure that carries through the other tire types.( and perhaps it is a misprint)
When you mount a loader you take the suitcase weights off. It is one or the other not both. Yes a MMM is low weight that lowers COG. A back hoe is a gommin thing that is often in the way and it's COG depends on what position you have it in. I''d spend the same money on renting a mini excavator a couple of weeks a summer and get more done with it and have your tractor free to back fill and tend the excavator.

There do appear to be 'perhaps misprints' with the tire dimensions??? I've heard a lot about a backhoe being a less necessary attachment, but I keep going over it in my head and actually think it's more important for me than the FEL. I mean, how else am I going to get rid of all those 4-foot-high humps of dirt throughout the woods (presumably left over from the original clearing of the land, building of the house)? We need that dirt in other places! With mountain property, you always need dirt, for leveling. And you can't buy it; I've tried. We're so remote there are no subdivisions, so no basements being dug, so no "free fill dirt" or indeed at any price! I do keep thinking about the "just rent a tractor a few weeks a year" idea and have to ask: Why don't you do that?

 

[drajj5]

I looked at getting the smaller Max series tractor, I ended up getting the bigger Max 28. I also mowed with a husky garden tractor. Good little lawn mower, but it sounded like it was going to die while mowing light hills (whined at me). I have some rolling terrain and some steep terrain. I did attempt it (steep area) from the bottom and lost traction not far from the bottom.... So being a Guy, I took the long way to get to the top and thought, "Down should be easier than up"- Butt pucker factor went through the roof as I dropped over the edge. The husky never spun a tire.....Nope I was picking up some speed and slammed it in reverse to try not to hit Mach 1. Heart pounding, I putted back to the barn to break out the weed eater and regain my manhood. I had about broke the steering wheel off merely by clutching it so hard. Oh well 3 hours using the weed eater scalping the hill so bad that I wouldn't have to break it out again for a month.....

Then it came time to purchase a tractor, I knew sitting high would give me the Heeby Jeeby's. So I looked for a low profile design, and ended up with the 28 model. Got that sucker home and drove both ways (up and down) and it was a success. Still, starting from the top and going down hill has pucker factor (this hill does not 'ease' into it) dead level to a steep grade. There is no way I could ever mow this sideways, up and down is the safest for sure.

Both my back and weed eater are thankful that the now, "not so new tractor" handles the task..


I wish I could use a tractor set up like "vtsnowedin", darn thing looks as wide as it is long. No way I could navigate my tight spots dotted around my property. Guess that is why he owns two different sizes.:thumbsup:

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

I looked at getting the smaller Max series tractor, I ended up getting the bigger Max 28. I also mowed with a husky garden tractor. Good little lawn mower, but it sounded like it was going to die while mowing light hills (whined at me). I have some rolling terrain and some steep terrain. I did attempt it (steep area) from the bottom and lost traction not far from the bottom.... So being a Guy, I took the long way to get to the top and thought, "Down should be easier than up"- Butt pucker factor went through the roof as I dropped over the edge. The husky never spun a tire.....Nope I was picking up some speed and slammed it in reverse to try not to hit Mach 1. Heart pounding, I putted back to the barn to break out the weed eater and regain my manhood. I had about broke the steering wheel off merely by clutching it so hard. Oh well 3 hours using the weed eater scalping the hill so bad that I wouldn't have to break it out again for a month.....

Then it came time to purchase a tractor, I knew sitting high would give me the Heeby Jeeby's. So I looked for a low profile design, and ended up with the 28 model. Got that sucker home and drove both ways (up and down) and it was a success. Still, starting from the top and going down hill has pucker factor (this hill does not 'ease' into it) dead level to a steep grade. There is no way I could ever mow this sideways, up and down is the safest for sure.

Both my back and weed eater are thankful that the now, "not so new tractor" handles the task..


I wish I could use a tractor set up like "vtsnowedin", darn thing looks as wide as it is long. No way I could navigate my tight spots dotted around my property. Guess that is why he owns two different sizes.:thumbsup:

That is so funny! OMG that's exactly what I've been going through. Yeah, the Huskvee is a bit of beast; I've beat it all to heck! But it's just not made for this stuff. Our grades too are often like that: dropping over the edge. Going down/going up; equally scary in different ways. Sideways forget it. But I have to say, losing traction at the bottom when going up ain't half as bad as losing it right at the top (the steepest part); I HATE that. I always feel like I'm gonna tip over backwards. Then out comes the weedeater, then when your shoulders are still aching a week later you think, well I didn't actually kill myself on that hill, I just need to suck it up....

Nice to hear your Mahindra is doing the job. Curious, why did you choose the Max 28 over the smaller Max? Seems like the bigger you go, the HIGHER profile you have?

I too want vtsnowedin's rig. He won't say what it is though.

 

[woodlandfarms]

I am an owner of a power trak 1850. It is a beast. It is rated at 45 degrees sideways and operates a majority of implements found on scuts and cuts. Having been up to 40 degrees on this machine I can tell you it is not for the feint of heart. If you decide to dismount on that kind of slope you will probably tumble to the bottom.

I like Steiner but have found them more of a mower than a tractor. On your slopes I would absolutely recommend the pt line. I would be nervous about a standard cut.

But, the while I feel the pt is a Swiss Army knife (it does everything good, none of it perfect) and it does do everything it has a lot of quirks. Swing by the pt forum for more opinions if you want

 

[Coyote machine]

One additional way to increase safety on any terrain is to work with 2 way radios AND a cell phone when using any machinery that has the potential to maim or kill you. I have all kinds of equipment, and have found the tipping point on most of it the hard way. I dislike my Scag zero turn because on even a reasonable slope, especially with damp or wet grass it's deadly. It has broken free on me a couple of times with it's swivel front wheels. Once down my septic mound I forgot that pushing the handle bars forward doesn't make it stop, instead it hurls me faster toward the tree directly in front of me. Second time I was coming up the side of my drive in a rush because guests were arriving any minute. The grass was wet probably because it was raining as I whipped the Wildcat up the slope, only to find myself being hurled down the embankment faster than it's ever gone when I lost traction at the top of the hill. That mower spun around faster than a bumper car in a kiddie park, and this time I was pulling back as hard as I could on the handlebars as the mower went out of control toward a big tree at the bottom of the embankment. Happened so fast, I could do NOTHING to stop the rapid descent. Hit a rock before the tree and had to use the tractor to pull it out backwards up the hill.
So, the walkie talkie are backups in case I roll or flip or do something that has me under or beside the tractor or mower. Phone is there two in case I can't raise family on the walkie.

What tractor dealers do you have near you? If there is a Kioti dealer I strongly suggest looking at their line of machines in the 30-50 HP range. I've had 2 since 2009 when I had previously not owned a tractor. I learned what I needed was more loader capacity then my DK-35 had so I traded up to the DK-40. Now I have what I need, and I have similar terrain as you spread out over 25 acres of field, streams, ponds, woodland, steep drives, ditches, bog land that never dries out, etc. I have a backhoe by Kioti that will dig 8' deep and it does an amazing job. I leave it on most of the time with loaded rear tires.

My take on your situation is you really need to be well versed in your specific terrain, and know where you can go, and what you can do when, with a particular machine, in any given conditions. Some places you may need to deem to dangerous for you and machine for now. The challenge, as I see it is to determine those places now, and possibly visit them later once you have experience with whatever machine(s) you end up with. I've bought a lot of different mowers over the last 30 years on my property, for different tasks, as I've changed the landscape in the process. I've put several of them in my pond, over the banks, in the ditch, etc. And hopefully I've learned something each time.
If you could post some pics of your land and it's biggest challenges that could help us help advise you further.

 

[drajj5]

Sounds like the terrain in VA is similar to where I live in North Ga. There is no flat spot on my property (unless it was graded). Just hills and valleys....

I went with the 28 VS the smaller Max for several reasons.

First, I wanted a loader that could reach over the side of a full size pickup truck (some of the small tractors- loaders will not go high enough).

Second, it had a bit more ground clearance. I feared that the belly would drag in uneven terrain and I didn't want to get hung up cresting a hill.

Finally, power, more lift capacity in the loader, more lift at the 3pt hitch - had the most to offer in a (small package).

There are several companies that make the same general size tractor

Max 28
Kubota B series
Yanmar 324
John Deer 2032
Kioti ck20
Their are others, trying not to discriminate.....

They are all good, but I took a chance on Mahindra... So far so good!

Highly recommend trying one this size as it should do what you need as they can navigate some tight spaces around the house. Good luck as you muddle through the process to find your perfect fit.

 

[vtsnowedin]

That is so funny! OMG that's exactly what I've been going through. Yeah, the Huskvee is a bit of beast; I've beat it all to heck! But it's just not made for this stuff. Our grades too are often like that: dropping over the edge. Going down/going up; equally scary in different ways. Sideways forget it. But I have to say, losing traction at the bottom when going up ain't half as bad as losing it right at the top (the steepest part); I HATE that. I always feel like I'm gonna tip over backwards. Then out comes the weedeater, then when your shoulders are still aching a week later you think, well I didn't actually kill myself on that hill, I just need to suck it up....

Nice to hear your Mahindra is doing the job. Curious, why did you choose the Max 28 over the smaller Max? Seems like the bigger you go, the HIGHER profile you have?

I too want vtsnowedin's rig. He won't say what it is though.

It is right there in my info under my avatar. It is a 2012 JD 5045E with a 553 loader. the spacers are JD dealer installed 4.1 inch each side. Cost me $27,350 as shown and the 72" cutter was another $2K The tranny is nine F 3R gear partially synchronized so you can shift up or down while moving but not shift ranges until a full stop. The JD lawn tractor has been sold and replaced with a new one. I forget which exact model. It stays up at my daughters house and the girls have been doing all the lawn mowing so I haven't touched it in over a year. That may change as One daughter has moved to Atlanta and the other is moving to Maryland so I will end up being house maintenance man and lawn boy.

 

[SpringHollow]

I agree with WoodlandFarms. I bought my Power Trac 1850 (same tractor he has) because of the slopes I live and I have not regretted it. So much more stable than regular Cuts etc. It handles slopes steeper than what I am comfortable on. Beats having my rear tires go up in the air which happened all of the time on my CUT's even with the tires as far out as possible. But not a great tractor if you want to do lots of plowing for crops.

Ken

 

[Gafn]

Someone mentioned the B - BX series... My experience says to stay away...
I was mowing a 30 degree slope (dry grass), driving directly up, using a B series, with 4 foot finish cut mower, 3 suitcase weights on the front - no FEL.
That tractor has 25ish HP, weights less than 1500 lbs and on that slope it simply would spin out, make ruts and be a real PITA to recover.

I have since upgraded to a 35hp tractor that weights a touch over 4000 lbs, and have no issues.
I am a chicken-chit on the steep slopes, so I keep a used (cheap) commercial walk behind mower for that work.... if it starts to slide of flip, just let go of it - use your tractor, or wench to recover it.

 

[cartod]

There do appear to be 'perhaps misprints' with the tire dimensions??? I've heard a lot about a backhoe being a less necessary attachment, but I keep going over it in my head and actually think it's more important for me than the FEL. I mean, how else am I going to get rid of all those 4-foot-high humps of dirt throughout the woods (presumably left over from the original clearing of the land, building of the house)? We need that dirt in other places! With mountain property, you always need dirt, for leveling. And you can't buy it; I've tried. We're so remote there are no subdivisions, so no basements being dug, so no "free fill dirt" or indeed at any price! I do keep thinking about the "just rent a tractor a few weeks a year" idea and have to ask: Why don't you do that?

A backhoe is really not a necessary purchase for removing and moving dirt, save yourself $10,000! A front loader is 10 times more efficient when coupled with a box blade at moving earth.

Unless you plan on digging ditches don't waste your money at the beginning on a hoe. With the setup I just mentioned you "can move mountains". If you decide later that a back hoe is needed you can rent one for a weekend or borrow mine that sits about 90% of the time in the barn.

 

[SpringHollow]

My swinging mini hoe is my most used implement and a reasonable compromise to a true backhoe attachment. I use it mainly as a grapple for use with logs or rocks. Invaluable for how I use my tractor. I have dug a fair amount of trenches and post holes with a mini hoe as well. For serious backhoe work like digging a basement, rent or hire it out.

Ken

 

[vtsnowedin]

I wish I could use a tractor set up like "vtsnowedin", darn thing looks as wide as it is long. No way I could navigate my tight spots dotted around my property. Guess that is why he owns two different sizes.:thumbsup:

No one is a lawn mower and one is a tractor. I like to use the right tool for the job. The 5045E is sixteen feet long from bucket lip to 3PH pins and just under eight feet wide out to out on the rears so it is quite a way from square. If I need to go between two trees that are less then eight feet apart I can and have cut the lessor of them and put it into the wood pile. Ten or twelve feet apart is a good spacing for trees and I have no tight spots between buildings I need to go through. If I was doing a lot of row crop work I would change the tread setting to match the row widths but as I spend a lot of time in the woods I like it the way it is. I did unzip and remove the back panel of the soft cab yesterday to have an unobstructed view of the two bottom plow as I was plowing a food plot.

 

[Gary Fowler]

A backhoe is really not a necessary purchase for removing and moving dirt, save yourself $10,000! A front loader is 10 times more efficient when coupled with a box blade at moving earth.

Unless you plan on digging ditches don't waste your money at the beginning on a hoe. With the setup I just mentioned you "can move mountains". If you decide later that a back hoe is needed you can rent one for a weekend or borrow mine that sits about 90% of the time in the barn.

I agree that a backhoe is not a necessary purchase, BUT, they are sure nice to have. I didn't realize how much use I would get from mine when I bought it. To put into perspective, I have a 5 year old 70 HP Utility tractor with FEL that has 120 Hours on it. I bought my used B26 TLB Kubota in 2011 with 60 hours on it and now has 350 hours. I use it for everything thing but bush hogging (once a year activity), prepping up the garden by disking, tilling and rowing up. Everything else I do with the TLB. Mine has a hydraulic thumb on the hoe and I can use it to pick up rocks both large as a wheelbarrow and small as a softball plus lift trees for piling, lift them up for cutting into firewood sizes pieces etc. A backhoe can be used for lots of stuff other than just digging when properly equipped. Mine was definitely worth the price that I paid for it. The only bad thing I can say about the Kubota B26 is that the tires cant be moved on it, they are set at the widest on the dish and are pretty narrow tracked at that (about 4 feet ) so it is a bit tippy on the sideways hill.

If you have the need for a backhoe AND the money, then get one because they are very handy attachments. Just make sure that what you get can be removed easily AND that you get 3 point hitch arms with it. Also be aware that most backhoes with a sub-frame wont be compatible with a belly mower. You would have to use a rear finish mower with it and that would require removing the back hoe. On my B26 it is at most a 5 minute job to get the back hoe off, but at least 10 minutes to put on the 3 PH arms. I am not sure if this is correct when speaking of the Kubota Bx25 though, and not all models of tractors are even available with a mid-PTO shaft.

 

[flusher]

For low center of gravity, you want a straddle tractor like my 1964 MF135 diesel. Your legs straddle the transmission/drive train with your feet below the top of the transmission. The other type of tractor is the platform tractor that has the pedals above the transmission so you sit higher on the tractor making for a higher CG.



That 135 has been modified. The 28" diameter rear rims have been replaced by 16" diameter rims and the front wheel spindles have been shortened to keep the tractor level. The wide rear tires are 18-16 size.

Other older straddle tractors include the Ford 8N, Ford Jubilee, Massey Ferguson MF65, 150, 165, Ford 1000, 2000 and 3000 series.

The Case/IH JX is a modern straddle tractor.



Good luck and be careful on those slopes.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

One additional way to increase safety on any terrain is to work with 2 way radios AND a cell phone when using any machinery that has the potential to maim or kill you.
If you could post some pics of your land and it's biggest challenges that could help us help advise you further.

Thank you very much for the advice. Scary stories. My worst fear is dropping the tractor into the big pond (14 ft deep).

We have always had two unbreakable rules when operating ANY kind of power equipment:

1) Never unless someone else is there on the property.
2) Always carry the cell phone.

(We have a lot of bear so we even carry a cell when walking in the wooded areas.)

I do intend to post some pics of the project areas, and I look forward to hearing your ideas.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

I looked at the PT. Impressive little critters for sure. Kitted up it's about the same cost as the Mahindra though.....

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

It is right there in my info under my avatar. It is a 2012 JD 5045E with a 553 loader. the spacers are JD dealer installed 4.1 inch each side. Cost me $27,350 as shown and the 72" cutter was another $2K The tranny is nine F 3R gear partially synchronized so you can shift up or down while moving but not shift ranges until a full stop. The JD lawn tractor has been sold and replaced with a new one. I forget which exact model. It stays up at my daughters house and the girls have been doing all the lawn mowing so I haven't touched it in over a year. That may change as One daughter has moved to Atlanta and the other is moving to Maryland so I will end up being house maintenance man and lawn boy.

Was just kidding you. I guess I meant all the little mods and tricks you used to make it all-terrain capable. Sounds like an ideal rig but out of my price range, probably even used.

 

[Creamer]

From all the OP has mentioned I am envisioning a Powertrac type of machine for all its versatility and slope capability as maneuverability between the trees. She also seems very concerned about lawn damage. These little guys are very capable machines and will handle the jobs she has mentioned very well. They also will give her reduced risk and - as mentioned - "pucker factor" for the tasks she has mentioned.

If these are not enough because she wants to move bigger logs I would go a low profile 30-40 hp CUT and put on wide tires but not duals. Duals may be an option but the do reduce maneuverability and in tight turns tear up lawns. She mentioned moving dirt - that is an FEL job. The FEL is not a liability if it is used correctly and will be a great asset in dirt moving. I find that on my 1710 without loaded tires is more stable with the FEL on - scoop low of course. I have even added some dirt in one side of the scoop for additional stability on a side hill. Tires like the MF135 pictures above would be great.

 

[Creamer]

View attachment 422564View attachment 422565

Now that is a cute little tractor! I like the wide, low stance!