Ventrac Mowing Speed?

[gretnagritty]

Hi -

I have read the posts and watched the videos comparing a Ventrac with a ZTR.

Recently aquired some land. Previously, property (15 acres) was mowed with a ZTR (Scag 60"). Very hilly so I am interested in a Ventrac, and also some need for light brush clearing.

Basically, trying to decide between (i) having a Ventrac with several attachments, or (ii) having high-end ZTR and then getting a small, old tractor or mini-skid steer for those duties.

How does the Ventrac 4500 (with 72" finish or fast cut flail and duals) compare to a high end ZTR in terms of speed on the 80 percent of land that is relatively flat? What speeds do folks mow at? I demo'd the Ventrac but candidly forget to put a GPS on to see speed, and I thought others may have better, real world experience.

Thanks.

 

[prestond]

I mow several acres both with the Ventrac (72 inch finish) and a 61 inch Scag zero turn. I have both hilly areas and flat areas.

I mow the larger flat areas with the Ventrac and the 72 inch finish deck in high gear at about 8-9 MPH. Top speed is 10 MPH. In low gear, top speed is 5 MPH.

The zero turn is much better at maneuvering and turning, but the Ventrac is much more enjoyable to mow with. It is more comfortable, much better on steep hills, around ponds, and creeks. Plus you sit up a little higher than a zero turn and don't eat and inhale so much dust and grass.

The Ventrac is indispensable for me. Not only do I mow with it, but I use the power bucket and grapple to move dirt, rocks, and brush. I also aerate and fertilize with it. I have also used it to pull my zero turn out of the mud.

 

[workinonit]

Yea, a ZT isn't worth a crap in the mud or slick areas. I've pulled mine out many times.

 

[2manyrocks]

What degree of slope will you be mowing?

Besides Ventrac, some members here use Power Tracs, Kubota F3680s, and Cub Cadet Pro Zs to mow some pretty good slopes.

 

[gretnagritty]

Hi- Appreciate the advice, and you all can probably imagine the choice I am wrestling with.

About 25 acres to mow in Virginia. Below is photo of top 15, bottom 10 similar. Most is at a 5-15 percent grade, but probably 10% is around 30 percent grade. Rocks interspersed and some trees down low, but also lots of open field. The guy who has been doing the mowing has done it with a 60" Scag ZTR, but that is kind of nuts. He occasionally secures a brush hog, but without ready access to one it means staying on top of mowing more frequently. There is about 3-5 acres of woods where I would like to keep some trails open for ATVs.

I absolutely love the Ventrac and did a demo. Setting aside price, I think it is perfect as I could get attachments over time. And I love the safety/stability, though nervous about giving up some mowing speed to a ZTR.

The alternative is a CubCadet slope mower ZTR that would be perfect for the fields, and then a smaller used SCUT or CUT that I could use with a brush hog, loader, scraper, etc. That might actually be cheaper and I would have two tools that are more specialized, but also two tools that require maintenance, etc.

I do value everyone's advice and experience so thank you in advance.

And yes, I feel luckier than a kid at Christmas to have picked up this land. Nothing on it but a trailer for next few years, but hope to build down the road.

 

[plowhog]

I mow about 15-20 acres every summer. I previously used an 8ft rotary cutter behind my tractor mowing at 3mph. Now I am using a Ventrac 4500Y with tough cut mowing at 5mph. Overall, although the cut width is less with the Ventrac, I know I am at least as fast to finishing the job with the Ventrac compared to the tractor. If conditions really suck I will use the tractor since it has a cab.

I mow at 5mph with the Ventrac because I use low gear and the terrain is rough enough so that I can't realistically go any faster without being bounced out of the seat.

On flat ground there is reasonable equivalence. On slopes, below apple trees, into/out of ravines, wet and marshy areas, the Ventrac is far superior. I have the dual wheel kit and diesel engine.

I once did a "price per pound" comparison of my Ventrac and tractors. The Ventrac "price per pound" was double ....

 

[2manyrocks]

I am also trying to decide about a slope mower, none of which are cheap, that I can find.

Another option is one of the remote control Spider slope mowers. This 48" 25hp EFI unit is $37K for Black Friday. SPIDER Lawn Mower | SPIDER 2SGS EFI | Steep Slope Mower It would be terrific for a really steep, otherwise impossible to mow, slope because the hydraulic winch assist enables it to climb slopes that hardly anything else could touch. There are some smaller units that are less expensive.

Last time I looked at the Ventrac manual and specs, dual wheels are required to get the 30 degree rating and you have to pick one of the higher engine options.

The Cub Cadet Pro Z 960 that has the dual wheels has a 25 degree rating according to the manual I looked at, but my dealer can't keep them in stock.

25 acres is a lot to keep mowed, especially when it involves hillsides.

If the remote control mowers were more affordable, I would want one for the worse of my slopes, and use a normal tractor for the flatter areas, but $37k might buy a Ventrac with a rough cut mower. Is that the kind of pricing you have been quoted?

 

[gretnagritty]

I mow about 15-20 acres every summer. I previously used an 8ft rotary cutter behind my tractor mowing at 3mph. Now I am using a Ventrac 4500Y with tough cut mowing at 5mph. Overall, although the cut width is less with the Ventrac, I know I am at least as fast to finishing the job with the Ventrac compared to the tractor. If conditions really suck I will use the tractor since it has a cab.

I mow at 5mph with the Ventrac because I use low gear and the terrain is rough enough so that I can't realistically go any faster without being bounced out of the seat.

On flat ground there is reasonable equivalence. On slopes, below apple trees, into/out of ravines, wet and marshy areas, the Ventrac is far superior. I have the dual wheel kit and diesel engine.

I once did a "price per pound" comparison of my Ventrac and tractors. The Ventrac "price per pound" was double ....

This is really helpful. To clarify: is double price per pound good or bad for the Ventrac? i.e. more expensive or less expensive?

 

[prestond]

For slope mowing, my Ventrac (with the duals) is the only choice for me. I have owned it for 3+ years and I am still amazed at how wonderful it is on slopes.

 

[2manyrocks]

There's another member here who does a better job of explaining this, but his take on mowing speed is that most property is rough enough that there is a practical limitation on mowing speed of say 5 mph. Any faster, and the operator and equipment gets jarred pretty hard.

If you can only travel 5 mph because of the ground being rough, then the next option for mowing any faster is to use a wider cutting width. Wider cutting decks require more HP that costs more money. Setting aside the question of what you could safely operate on a slope, a 10' batwing will cut faster than a 5' cutter on flat ground, but takes more HP to run.

OP's property looks great in the photo, but the effective ground speed may be limited by how smooth the ground actually is on the flatter areas.

 

[plowhog]

This is really helpful. To clarify: is double price per pound good or bad for the Ventrac? i.e. more expensive or less expensive?

It was something like if a regular tractor and a Ventrac each weighed the same, the price of the Ventrac would be double. That's about what it was compared to my Massey 1710 although I did buy it several years before the ventrac.

The ventrac is expensive-- but does unique functions others do not do well with. I'm glad I bought mine-- no regrets period-- and I should probably look at some additional implements and capabilities for it.

 

[CADplans]

We have had three neighbors,, all experienced operating other types of equipment,,, turn over ZT's.
They all have slopes like I have,,

AND, they all mow with something similar to what I use.

Every time I mow, I trim over ditches that would leave a ZT stuck.

I could mow right over this driveway edge,, no concerns about getting stuck.

I say "could", because I decided to remove that 12-18 inch elevation change,,
because of the grandchildren riding machines on my property.

I figured the dozer/excavator work was cheap, compared to an injured grandchild.

As far as speed, I can drive my fields with that tractor easily 50% faster than a ZT,,
the big fluid filled tires smooth out the bumps.

I paid $8K for that JD 4105 in 2016,, one of my best tractor purchases,,

 

[2manyrocks]

The OP's predicament is he estimated 10% of his 25 acres to be mowed is 30 degrees. That is 2.5 acres of steep slope mowing to be done. Ventrac is one of the relatively few brands of ride on machines in the USA that advertises the capability of mowing a 30 degree slope, and they have a Youtube video demonstrating mowing a 30 degree slope.

Power Trac also has a Youtube video of a dual wheel PT 1850 mowing a steep slope as well.

The other issue that comes to mind is the OP doesn't live on this property and would either have to transport a machine to the property or come up with some secure storage solution. A Ventrac would be easier to haul than a full size tractor.

FWIW, there's an area calculator based on google maps that can be used to estimate areas to be mowed if that would help in estimating how large the steep areas may be. Google Maps Area Calculator Tool

 

[Yander]

I don't think a Cub Cadet is going to hold up to that much mowing. You'll probably need to spend at least $10k (used) to get a good enough quality ZTR for that much land. I recommend full commercial quality ZTR or Ventrac for that much acreage. It is hard to tell the amount of slope from that overhead pic. I was looking at the ventracs yesterday and they really look stable for hillside mowing. Pricey but usually you get what you pay for. They are kind of a niche machine.

If I had a lot of hillside mowing, I would probably go that Ventrac direction. One thing you could do is hire a commercial landscape pro to mow the whole area once and then speak to them about the stability of a ZTR as you watch them mow it. If they can mow it with a ZTR, so can you. You may also be able to get wheel spacers for the ZTR. Even a good quality commercial ZTR is $15k (Gas) -$30k (diesel)

 

[2manyrocks]

Also worth mentioning is that you can calculate an estimate of acres mowed per hour based on cutting width, overlap, and ground speed. Mowing Calcuator | How many acres can I mow in an hour

What the calculator won't tell you is your ground speed if the vegetation grows up and you have to slow down in order to cut it.

 

[Yander]

Looks like a beautiful piece of property BTW!

 

[gretnagritty]

Thank you. This is all really helpful.

Here is where my head is at:

- For mowing: either Ventrac or a Cub Cadet Z972SDL slope mower ZTR. Both are expensive, and both seem designed for the kind of mowing I am looking at. I think either could handle the slopes. As I said, the guy today uses a traditional Scag ZTR, but I think it is not safe. Both are the same size cutting width (72") and as folks point out....there is only so fast someone can go on the fields. So any differential in speed will be minor and the tires are similar in size.

- For other work: if I get the Ventrac, will acquire attachments as I go (e.g. bucket and grapple, etc.). If I go with Z972, then get a used compact tractor.

- Note: ruled out a large HP tractor because of slopes and my ability, though I recognize it may be fastest. Maybe down the road once I have a better feel for which attachments I use and which I can hire out.

Financially, I think I end up in a similar place either way. Meaning the Ventrac and attachments (35-45k) will be about the same price as a dedicated slope ZTR (25k) and a used tractor (15-20K). But then I have two to maintain, and I have to explain to my better half why I need two tractors

Please pick apart my thinking. Thanks.

 

[prestond]

I am biased, but if I had to choose only one for my property it would be the Ventrac. It really does do a lot of things great (I sound like their marketing team).

I vote for...

 

[LittleBittyBigJohn]

I am biased, but if I had to choose only one for my property it would be the Ventrac. It really does do a lot of things great (I sound like their marketing team).

I vote for...

View attachment 837652

View attachment 837653

You just sold me and I don't even need one! that is some beautiful grass/ stripes/ land.

 

[2manyrocks]

Thank you. This is all really helpful.

Here is where my head is at:

- For mowing: either Ventrac or a Cub Cadet Z972SDL slope mower ZTR. Both are expensive, and both seem designed for the kind of mowing I am looking at. I think either could handle the slopes. As I said, the guy today uses a traditional Scag ZTR, but I think it is not safe. Both are the same size cutting width (72") and as folks point out....there is only so fast someone can go on the fields. So any differential in speed will be minor and the tires are similar in size.

- For other work: if I get the Ventrac, will acquire attachments as I go (e.g. bucket and grapple, etc.). If I go with Z972, then get a used compact tractor.

- Note: ruled out a large HP tractor because of slopes and my ability, though I recognize it may be fastest. Maybe down the road once I have a better feel for which attachments I use and which I can hire out.

Financially, I think I end up in a similar place either way. Meaning the Ventrac and attachments (35-45k) will be about the same price as a dedicated slope ZTR (25k) and a used tractor (15-20K). But then I have two to maintain, and I have to explain to my better half why I need two tractors

Please pick apart my thinking. Thanks.

Others feel free to correct me if I'm mistaken, but I believe Ventrac has two speed ranges where the Cub has one. Ventrac has an optional Kubota gas engine where Cub uses a gas kawasaki. Ventrac is 4wd where Cub is 2wd.

I have never operated either one.

If you add up all your estimated mowing time and time required to get to your property, will you have enough time to mow all 25 acres or do you realistically still need to hire someone else to mow for you? A guy with a 10-12' cutter could cut the flatter sections more quickly than you could cut it with a 6' cutter. I just don't know how much of the rest of your property would be suited to being mowed by a big tractor with a wide cutter.