Waxes and polishes.

   / Waxes and polishes. #31  
Here is Ford Explorer I detailed years ago. It has been neglected and has a clear coat. I will post pics of it in the sunlight and under halogen light. I will also include 50/50 shots of one buffed and restored vs. not buffed.

I'll say it again, it you want your vehicle to keep its shine and maintain its finish you need to protect. Clear coat or not. I have plenty other pics of other vehicles if your not convinced.

Sunlight

100_0366.jpg


Halogen lighting: Notice the severe swirling, oxidation etc. In this pic the left side was buffed, right side not.

100_0376.jpg


50/50 shot: Taped hood off, buffed one side intial pass with buffer

100_0373.jpg


Another 50/50

100_0372.jpg


Finished:

100_0381.jpg


Another finished:

100_0380.jpg
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #32  
Here is Ford Explorer I detailed years ago. It has been neglected and has a clear coat. I will post pics of it in the sunlight and under halogen light. I will also include 50/50 shots of one buffed and restored vs. not buffed.

I'll say it again, it you want your vehicle to keep its shine and maintain its finish you need to protect. Clear coat or not. I have plenty other pics of other vehicles if your not convinced.

Sunlight

100_0366.jpg


Halogen lighting: Notice the severe swirling, oxidation etc. In this pic the left side was buffed, right side not.

100_0376.jpg


50/50 shot: Taped hood off, buffed one side intial pass with buffer

100_0373.jpg


Another 50/50

100_0372.jpg


Finished:

100_0381.jpg


Another finished:

100_0380.jpg

I will bring my duall over to let you clean it, thats a find job you did.
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #33  
The 3-4 hours is an entire detail, and I take my time. Yes I am ****. The people who want buff jobs from me expect that level of detail.

I first wash the entire vehicle and remove all foreign matter from the paint (stuck there due to no wax protection).

Compound the vehicle using whatever grit is called for.

Wash and dry the vehicle.

Glaze the vehicle with the buffer.

Wash and dry again.

Apply and hand remove #7 polish.

Hand wax and final detail....Ergo--3-4 hours.

While maintaining the paint isn't necessary, I've gotten well over book on all of my 150K+ GM pickups due to the level of detail that I go to.

I have also painted and buffed multiple show winning classic cars...The people who come to me expect far more than a 30 minute detail with a WalMart oribital.

Not arguing with you, just seems that our expected outcomes are far different. ;)

Your talking about detailing so it practically can be entered in a car show. Not all customers and vehicles warrant this type of job. You can always reserve that kind of job for when your ready to sell it.

Though you don't realize it, most vehicles can be sufficiently cleaned up with far less effort. Doing much more to an every day car is not excessive.
 
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   / Waxes and polishes. #34  
Here is Ford Explorer I detailed years ago. It has been neglected and has a clear coat. I will post pics of it in the sunlight and under halogen light. I will also include 50/50 shots of one buffed and restored vs. not buffed.

I'll say it again, it you want your vehicle to keep its shine and maintain its finish you need to protect. Clear coat or not. I have plenty other pics of other vehicles if your not convinced.

:confused: You can't protect paint, especially black, from dulling due to wear and tear, unless your going to leave it in the garage with a cover on it.

If it is going to be an everyday driver, your going to have to spend time cleaning and polishing it, if you want to keep it looking like new.

From my first post in this thread:

"Modern finishes do benefit, cosmetically, from having the surfaced cleaned, and polished, such as the use of a clay bar to remove pollution, brake particles, and a cleaner/polish, to remove surface wear and minor scratches".
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #35  
:confused: You can't protect paint, especially black, from dulling due to wear and tear, unless your going to leave it in the garage with a cover on it.

Here is blue: compare left side to right side

100_0149.jpg


Here is green:

Lyonshood.jpg


000_0007.jpg


Paint protection prevents the clear coat from reaching the point it has in the photos I posted. Simply doing nothing to paint over time just as the owners did to their vehicle causes it to be dull looking, makes it easier to induce scratching and swirls when washing and a plethora of other problems.

Its obvious we're not agreeing on the proper care and maintenance of vehicle paint. I'm not convinced "modern day vehicle paint does not need to be waxed". I have a lot of experience restoring neglected vehicle paint. If todays vehicles didn't need to be waxed and polished I wouldn't have people asking me why their vehicle looks faded and worn and can I fix it? If they maintained the paint with a wax or sealant from the get go, it wouldn't need to be restored.
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #36  
General,

We're on the same page...Thanks for the pictures to prove the point..With wax on the surface, one doesn't end up with the hairline scratches and misc surface imperfections that look terrible if you know what you're looking at...Nice job, sounds like we have the same hobby that others like to use use for their advatage:thumbsup:
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #37  
Its obvious we're not agreeing on the proper care and maintenance of vehicle paint. I'm not convinced "modern day vehicle paint does not need to be waxed". I have a lot of experience restoring neglected vehicle paint. If todays vehicles didn't need to be waxed and polished I wouldn't have people asking me why their vehicle looks faded and worn and can I fix it? If they maintained the paint with a wax or sealant from the get go, it wouldn't need to be restored.

It's obvious you not reading, and or getting what I am posting.

Your debating me based on a totally incorrect assumption of what I am trying to explain to you.
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #38  
General , Great work!

Ray: I understand what point your trying to make. Most consumers DONT follow proper procedures when "waxing" and are essentially relying on the polishing properties of the Cleaner/wax they are applying.
Maybe alot of this comes from people not understand the various PROPER terms for products and what said products are designed to do to revitalize a painted surface?

Im trying to pick up a few tips and learn how to properly buff out modern paints here:D:D

Which specific products (Brands, compounds, pads, sealants) are you using for the fast polish jobs? Whats your procedure?
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #39  
General , Great work!

Im trying to pick up a few tips and learn how to properly buff out modern paints here:D:D

Which specific products (Brands, compounds, pads, sealants) are you using for the fast polish jobs? Whats your procedure?

Thanks :) I'm a little short for time this morning, I will respond back this evening with a more detailed response, but for starters I like Optimum compounds or Menzerna for paint polishing. Optimum polishes are very user friendly and have a long working time (stays wet and doesn't dry out and dust while polishing). Plus you can change the level of cut by using a more or less aggressive cutting pad. I also like Lace Country foam polishing pads.

Polish:
Amazon.com: 32 oz. Optimum Polish II ***New & Improved***: Automotive

Polishing pads:
Lake Country Manufacturing - High Quality Buffing & Polishing Products
 
   / Waxes and polishes. #40  
General , Great work!

Ray: I understand what point your trying to make. Most consumers DONT follow proper procedures when "waxing" and are essentially relying on the polishing properties of the Cleaner/wax they are applying.
Maybe alot of this comes from people not understand the various PROPER terms for products and what said products are designed to do to revitalize a painted surface?

Im trying to pick up a few tips and learn how to properly buff out modern paints here:D:D

Which specific products (Brands, compounds, pads, sealants) are you using for the fast polish jobs? Whats your procedure?

I can't write a book here, and that's what it would take. There are a lot of different things involved, depending on the condition of the vehicle. And I don't want to have to debate all of it.

I will tell you this much:

The best advice I can give you is to start out doing the vehicles by hand, and when you have an understanding of the products and how to use them, then you can graduate to using them with a buffer.

I use foam buffing pads. Buffing the latest vehicles, especially with foam pads, can generate heat very quickly, which can result in damage to edges, stripes, painted moldings, and trim work, or worse. Knowing what areas to avoid, and tricks like where to apply masking tape before hand to protect these areas, is essential to avoiding tedious hand work and saving time. Learning these lessons practicing on older vehicles first, is the best way to get through this process.

What should be common sense time savers like, if you spend <2 minutes masking off the cowl area before you buff the vehicle, you won't have to clean all the splatter off the wipers and grilles, when your done buffing, are often over looked. I am always amazed that this thought never occurs to most people. This concept will also save time keeping splatter from other areas that can be difficult to clean, such as black textured plastic trim pieces. Using simple techniques such as this, I can also easily eliminate the step of having to wash, and dry, the entire vehicle after buffing it.

I recommend a product called Crystal Shine, made by Car Brite, it is amazing. You will likely have trouble finding it locally, check with your body shop suppliers, it is a professional use only product, so it is not for sale in retail stores. They do package it in small bottles, but that is even harder to find. We bought it in Cleveland, through William Wolf Co. I used a lot of it when we had our shop, when I wanted a one step product to quickly restore a finish. It works well, by hand or with a buffer.

Our customers always wanted us to recommend products for them to use many years ago, when there were very few consumer products that were effective. So, I decided to sell Crystal Shine to our customers. It generally took less than 60 seconds of hand polishing a spot on their hood, to convince them to buy it.

Even my father, who worked in the business all his life, refused to believe one product could do what I was telling our customers Crystal Shine did. Until one Friday, when I sold a bottle to an older woman, (gray haired), who owned a black Tempo. I explained the procedure: Apply the product to a balled up t-shirt, rub in a circular motion, working small areas at a time, flip over the t-shirt and buff the area until it is dry, repeat. This vehicle was as rough as the black explorer illustrated earlier by General Lee. She returned Monday to show me the results, (and buy more product for the rest of her family). She followed my instructions, and worked on the car, off and on, over the weekend. This product reduced a job that normally requires a tremendous amount of effort for an average person who would be working by hand, to a job an older woman could do working at her leisure, over a weekend. The result was the finish had been restored to nearly perfect condition. It's not rocket surgery, even your grandmother can do this.

The closest retail product to Crystal Shine I have found is, Meguiars Crystal Finish, (coincidence?). Which as developed sometime later. People who still ask me for Crystal Shine now, find this an acceptable substitute.

If your vehicle is beat to death, once over will of course not usually get the job done. You simply repeat the process until you achieve the desired results.

Once you have restored the finish to look like you want it, or if the vehicle is fairly new, or in good condition, an occasional once over with a product like this, (by hand, which does not take long at all), will keep it clean and shinny.

I certainly have not used everything out there, so there could be other products that work just as well.

A good, and fair priced liquid rubbing compound is Triple Cut Compound from Fiberglass Evercoat. (Another body shop supply only product). The 3M products are all good, just really overpriced.

If you have a good air supply a 2" micro air buffer with a foam pad, is another way to save time. These can eliminate much of the hand work in tight areas. I have several with different size pads, (buy a full size 9" foam pad, and cut out your own, to suit the area). You can use up to 5" pads on these.

3M, and most paint manufacturers make a water based prep solvent. These do a fantastic job cleaning unpainted exterior, and interior trim. These leave the surface looking exactly as it did when it was brand new, without the amateur, slippery, ArmourAll residue all over everything. Unfortunately, you won't want to spend the $50 for a gallon to try some. But, you probably would if I could show you how well it works. You can clean the dirtiest interior like new, quickly.

This would not even be all of chapter one, if I tried to tell you everything. :thumbsup:

If you have specific questions, you can pm me.
 

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