weight on guage wheels

[Eric_Phillips]

I am designing some gauge wheels to go on my box blade. It is a KK 6' blade. How much of the weight will the gauge wheels see? I am trying to find wheels and need to know what kind of weight rating I need to look for.

 

[tommu56]

Well if your rear tires go in a hole it could be 1/2 the tractor weight but I'm not sure how often that would happen.


tom

 

[pitt_md]

Well if your rear tires go in a hole it could be 1/2 the tractor weight but I'm not sure how often that would happen.


tom

The way I see it if your rear tires go into a hole the wheels would not support 1/2 the weight of the tractor. The 3ph arms should float up. Or did I miss something?

I think you would be safe if you designed them to support double the weight of the BB. Don't take my word on that as I am only speculating.

 

[greg_g]

Gauge wheels onna boxblade? what on earth for? That's what position and/or draft control is for on your tractor hydraulics. Gauge wheels to me would just be an impediment. Or are you trying to make this thing do something other than conventional BB work?

//greg//

 

[tommu56]

The way I see it if your rear tires go into a hole the wheels would not support 1/2 the weight of the tractor. The 3ph arms should float up. Or did I miss something?

I think you would be safe if you designed them to support double the weight of the BB. Don't take my word on that as I am only speculating.

I've never had them on a box blade but on the finish mower I ran didn't have a toggle link on top link and it twisted the rear wheels up about 4" when I hit a ditch yes there should have been a toggle or sliding arraignment on mower top link I didn't hook it up just was told to mow I think you would have the same problem unless you raise the 3 point.

I know with my box blade I haven't gotten results that I would like to smooth my road but then I don't have hundreds of hours with with it or a good feel to float the blade by hand.

I've resorted to box blading the high spots and drag an 6' I beam to level it out .

tom

 

[Willl]

Tom, doesn't your 3pt float ?

 

[WarrenF]

I am designing some gauge wheels to go on my box blade. It is a KK 6' blade. How much of the weight will the gauge wheels see? I am trying to find wheels and need to know what kind of weight rating I need to look for.

I would think the amount of weight you would have on your gauge wheels would be the weight of the box blade. If you dropped your wheels in a hole the box blade will float up so there would not be theoretically any more weight on the guage wheels.

I know on my cultivator bar, when coming to the end of the field, and the nose of the tractor falls into the waste ditch, the bar will actually come up a bit. Conversely if I pull through the waste ditch, the knives and the corrugator shanks will only plow into the ground a little bit.

 

[Eric_Phillips]

Greg,
I am not doing anything unconventional with my box blade. One of the things they can do is smooth out rough ground. When doing this you don't have the 3PH all the way down so it is partially supported by the tractor. What this means is as the tractor goes up and down over the bumps so does the box blade just making things worse. Position control only controls the position of the 3PH relative to the tractor not the ground hence the problems mentioned above. Draft control will also raise the 3PH when it feels more drag. This also would be a problem since you want it to stay at the same height to the ground when taking off the high spots. With gauge wheels the box blade is supported by the gauge wheels behind the box blade where the ground should now be flat. This allows the tractor to float up and down over the bumps with little or no effect on the box blade relative to the ground. You can do similar stuff with a rake but they don't carry the dirt from the high spots to the low spots as well as a box blade. Now some people, possibly you, are good enough with a 3PH lever to know when and how much to move the lever when the tractor is moving up and down. I have tried and I am not there yet and I need to get some stuff done now not hundreds of hours/practice later.

 

[tommu56]

Willl

My 3 point does move up if you lift on links but with the torque on the lift arms motion is not straight up its more of a rotation point around the rear lift pins

There isn't a float position on the control handle

If three points would float up then why on every mower I've used or seen has a slip link (I call it a toggle) or chain on the top link to let deck float.


Eric search for Robs link on his gauge wheels
tom

 

[greg_g]

Now some people, possibly you, are good enough with a 3PH lever to know when and how much to move the lever when the tractor is moving up and down. I have tried and I am not there yet and I need to get some stuff done now not hundreds of hours/practice later.

You're making it harder in your mind than it actually is. In the time it takes you to locate/fabricate and install training wheels, you could already have realized and refined the proper technique. Plus - when a gauge wheel hits a bump or a dip - the lateral angle of your BB is temporarily changed. You won't be pleased with the extra passes needed to smooth out that ripple effect either. And I guarantee that you'll curse those gauge wheels when you encounter a situation where the BB is best used in reverse.

I paid an exhorbitant optional charge to get gauge wheels on my last landscape rake. They definitely got in the way when pushing with the rake. And I spent so much time getting on/off the tractor to raise/lower the **** things, I just quit using them all together. Sorry I spent the extra money for them in the first place, cuz it only took an hour or so to improve the technique of working without them.

//greg//

 

[Eric_Phillips]

Tom,
On a mower you have the front of the mower supported by the lower links and the back of the mower has a tail wheel. As you encounter variations in the ground the mower needs to pivot around the lower links which means the top link needs to get longer or shorter.

 

[Runner]

I am not an engineer, nor did I sleep in a Holiday Inn last night. However, I believe the answer is that 1/2 of the weight of the box blade is on the three-point arms and each gauge wheel would be taking 1/4 of the total box blade weight (assuming only the front of the blade is supported by the hitch and the rear is actually riding on the wheels).

 

[tommu56]

Tom,
On a mower you have the front of the mower supported by the lower links and the back of the mower has a tail wheel. As you encounter variations in the ground the mower needs to pivot around the lower links which means the top link needs to get longer or shorter.

Wouldn't you would have the same reaction with gauge wheels on the back of a box blade? the same geometry just different lengths.

The reaction wouldn't be as extreme because the tail wheel on a mower is 5-7 foot behinds the lift arms and the back blades would only be half that.

tom

 

[greg_g]

Wouldn't you would have the same reaction with gauge wheels on the back of a box blade?

Yes, but it's moot. Mowers work best with flexible toplink brackets, boxblades and rakes work best with rigid toplink connections

//greg//

 

[have_blue]

And I guarantee that you'll curse those gauge wheels when you encounter a situation where the BB is best used in reverse.

You're correct that gage wheels won't help prevent ripples. The only way to prevent ripples is by having a super long wheelbase. However, gage wheels can definitely prevent the box blade from gouging deep when you hit soft dirt. They could be a real help if you're spreading or leveling loose dirt of varying depth.

Why curse the wheels? Simply remove them temporarily. That would take all of 5 minutes.

 

[greg_g]

gage wheels can definitely prevent the box blade from gouging deep when you hit soft dirt.

That's what draft control is for. And for tractors w/o draft control, you simply control maximum depth with the vertical links and/or position control. Relying on gauge wheels alone is NOT going to stop a BB from trying to bury itself in something soft.

Why curse the wheels? Simply remove them temporarily. That would take all of 5 minutes.

You haven't moved much material with a BB then. Backfilling for example. It's not unusual to shuttle between pulling a box full from A to B - then pushing it from B to C. Five seconds forward - five minutes removing gauge wheels - five seconds in reverse - five minutes reinstalling gauges wheels. Sorry - not me !!

//greg//

 

[tommu56]

Yes, but it's moot. Mowers work best with flexible toplink brackets, boxblades and rakes work best with rigid toplink connections

//greg//

That is because mowers are trying to follow the ground not chop it off like you want with back blade and other implements designed to engage the ground.

tom