Well.......................this isn't good
- Thread starter RandyinTN
- Start date
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The Fred
Veteran Member
Whatever
k0ua
Epic Contributor
Who is going to split his tractor to replace a clutch? Is he going to do it? Far more clutches fail than hydrostat solenoids. Hydrostat failures are rare, Clutch replacements in your gear tractors are NOT rare. Especially when operate by novice clutch riders.
DK35vince
Super Member
Can't speak for the OP, but if I ever need a clutch I plan to do it myself. (2160 hours, haven't needed the first clutch adjustment yet.)
Hoping for thousands more hours from original clutch.
k0ua
Epic Contributor
Your clutch isn't ruined because you know how to operate a gear/clutch equipped tractor to preserve its clutch disk integrity. Not all operators do. And if you have the wherewithal and the tools and the space to replace the clutch when that time comes, that is a good thing. Not all do.
We hear AT LEAST as many clutch replacement stories here as hydro troubles. And the majority of CUT owners have hydro machines.
Pawatch
Member
What is the ratio of HST to manual transmissions sold?
k0ua
Epic Contributor
No one has figures like that, or at least they would want to release to the public, but judging by the number of cuts on a dealers lot and looking how they are equipped, I would say 3 to 1 Hydro over gear. With in increasing trend to hydro. Try selling your gear CUT on craigs list. Now full sized farm tractors, is a total different story with all of the variation of geared tractors in the vast majority.
k0ua
Epic Contributor
This is one of the reasons I coined the phrase "if you have to ask should I buy a CUT with a geared transmission or a hydrostat" you NEED a hydrostat. And here is why. The very fact you asked means you know nothing about tractors. And being a newbie you will be more inclined to not knowing how to take care of a geared tractors clutch and will likely put more wear and tear on it. Resulting in higher repair bills than you would have had if you had went with a hydro. Besides hydro is better suited for the type of tasks that a homeowner does anyway. Just like geared tractors are better suited for plowing fields and other constant speed tasks due to their greater efficiency. Thats my story and I am sticking to it, even if I have received some flak for saying it.
SirMaxwell
Silver Member
Ahh, and there it is, the ubiquitous post that uses the OP as further proof of their brilliance and how stupid all those that think differently are.
SirMaxwell
Silver Member
I own, and know of even more, many automatic vehicles over 30, 40, even 50 years old and they run perfectly. Yet I have one manual, and it;'s waiting for me to install a clutch. Granted I was hard on the last clutch, but none the less. As to your solenoid sample, well by golly those of us that are not afeared, will simple figure out a replacement for a simple solenoid.
SirMaxwell
Silver Member
Ahh yes James, but you said it eloquently and without damning the rest of us to eternal hellfire. :laughing: Like a car, Tractors have autos and standards, both have their place. For example, 6 hours of bumper to bumper traffic in a 500 hp car. Stick is nice, but auto is better. Road Racing up and down a mountain with many curves. Auto will do it, but stick is better. I'm not a farmer, but I do some farming. Though 90% of what I do is clean up, carry, scoop, drag, etc.. HST is a God send.
Wagtail
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2013
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- 12,927
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- St Helens, Tasmania, Australia
- Tractor
- JD 4105 / JD Z355E (48" deck)
No flack... you've pretty much described me to a "T".
(Well you did miss how incredibly handsome, charming, my razor-sharp wit and how humble I am)
((Forgiving, too))
Pawatch
Member
So HST outsells manual 3-1 but you hear AT LEAST as many clutch replacement stories here as hydro troubles.
DK35vince
Super Member
Kioti didn't offer HST on their tractors when I bought my DK in 2001.
2003 or 2004 before Kioti even offered HST on some of its models.
I am happy with my choice of transmissions. I dont cut grass or bushwack. All of my driving is short distances with a lot of back and forth. Just hope the solenoid issue is a one time deal and the shop does the exchange and buttons up all the loose ends before they deliver it back to me. This means no leaks, no quirks, etc.
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k0ua
Epic Contributor
True, but go look on your dealers lot in the under 50 horsepower CUT/SCUT segment today. How many 1/2 ton pickups of any brand can now be bought with anything but an automatic transmission? It is to the point now that an older vehicle with a standard transmission is considered to have an anti-theft device to younger thieves. Many under the age of 40 cannot drive them.
DK35vince
Super Member
No idea, I never look much at new vehicles.
I'm still driving a 1991 F-250 with a 5 speed manual.
My work truck is a 10 speed Eaton/Fuller.
k0ua
Epic Contributor
The answer is zero in 1/2 tons. You can still get manual in some of the "midsize" like a Colorado, and of course large trucks.
Teachu2
Platinum Member
A new transmission on a tractor with eight hours - a very uncommon situation. As such, it really doesn't reflect on the reliability of HST vs geared.
My dealer - third generation of the family that started the dealership in the 1920's - discussed transmissions with me. In CUTs sold to homeowners, they are over 90% HST. Every tractor under 45 hp he had in stock (three locations) was HST. As we discussed my intended use in steep mountainous wooded terrain, he said I was in the 10% that would be better served with gears if I drive properly, HST if I drive like most homeowners. Either transmission would require repair, sooner or later, and that would require splitting the tractor. Typically, the geared would be a clutch and the HST would be a pump rebuild/replace. Labor would be slightly less on the geared, parts would typically be considerably less. Frequency would depend on my ability to avoid riding the clutch and using the proper gear selection. He also mentioned how simplicity factors into reliability - there is virtually nothing electrically-operated inside the geared transmission. Since he had to locate me the particular geared model I bought, while he had several comparable HST versions on hand, I believe he truly believed what he was telling me.
As far as failure rates reported on the forums, that's statistically hogwash. Most HSTs are newer than most gear drives. For example: You'll find lots more clutch changes on Ford 8Ns than HST repairs on the same model. Thirty years from now, there will be a lot more HST failures than geared failures on 2018 models - since there are so many more HSTs sold now.
All that said, I'm not anti-HST at all. I have a friend who recently purchased horse property. His slopes are gentle, he'll do maintenance on a ring, and he (and his wife) will be doing a lot of loader work. If he buys new, he should get a HST.
My dealer - third generation of the family that started the dealership in the 1920's - discussed transmissions with me. In CUTs sold to homeowners, they are over 90% HST. Every tractor under 45 hp he had in stock (three locations) was HST. As we discussed my intended use in steep mountainous wooded terrain, he said I was in the 10% that would be better served with gears if I drive properly, HST if I drive like most homeowners. Either transmission would require repair, sooner or later, and that would require splitting the tractor. Typically, the geared would be a clutch and the HST would be a pump rebuild/replace. Labor would be slightly less on the geared, parts would typically be considerably less. Frequency would depend on my ability to avoid riding the clutch and using the proper gear selection. He also mentioned how simplicity factors into reliability - there is virtually nothing electrically-operated inside the geared transmission. Since he had to locate me the particular geared model I bought, while he had several comparable HST versions on hand, I believe he truly believed what he was telling me.
As far as failure rates reported on the forums, that's statistically hogwash. Most HSTs are newer than most gear drives. For example: You'll find lots more clutch changes on Ford 8Ns than HST repairs on the same model. Thirty years from now, there will be a lot more HST failures than geared failures on 2018 models - since there are so many more HSTs sold now.
All that said, I'm not anti-HST at all. I have a friend who recently purchased horse property. His slopes are gentle, he'll do maintenance on a ring, and he (and his wife) will be doing a lot of loader work. If he buys new, he should get a HST.
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