Wheel spacers or weights for slopes?

[number9L]

Called and talked to Lonestar Wheel Weights. They have 60# weights to fit my tractor for $53ea. They are stackable. How many - how much weight - is typical when adding wheel weights? I don't want to buy too many but don't want to wish I'd bought another pair either.

Would 120# each wheel be enough or would 180# be better? I'm thinking 180# each wheel....

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[SPYDERLK]

Yes I do have a FEL - and no, it is not on the tractor when I mow - tried that once, NO WAY does it help. It reduces the level of slope I can cross drastically. Up and down, it's a must - sideways, no way.

I do have a QH and it stays on the tractor all the time, so yea it is adding to the leverage that the rotary cutter or finish mower act on the tractor.

I did kinda do the fishing line thing once a long time ago but used a motorcycle tie-down hung from the ROPS. I don't think this is very accurate (I'd say it's close and worth being able to see) as the area the tractor is sitting on gets crossed every time I mow with no problem or pucker factor. It's the area just to the uphill side in the pic from the rear that is the area that rolls up to about 25*. There is a tree just out of the edge of the picture. I've only drove across that next tractor width between where it is now and the tree twice.



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It would help your control on sideslopes if the QH was removed during the mowing. It would not be huge, but should be easily noted in comparison. Combined with the extra width you plan, yould probably be comfortable -- perhaps to the point of doing it all sideslope. You might want to explore this setup before buying weight.

The up and downslope mowing options will always be under some handicap since the tractor does not carry any of the mower weight, but must have enuf traction to control its motion with no slip. Adding weight to the tractor is about the only way to help under that circumstance. The wheel weights or extra tire ballast are best options. 300 more pounds at the rear might be enuf.

 

[Wolfy]

9L, those last pictures, I mow like that with my Ford 1600. Which is 2WD, with R-3 tires and wheel weights. It is close in size Id say to the L3800.

 

[spitter]

I have property pretty close or steeper than yours. I have a tc 29d and went through the same thing .Finaly diced to build ballast box for fel and 4 inch wheel spacers .Turned tractor into enterly different machine . first time i put tractor on the not so steep part i could lift the up hill tire off the groundAfter the ballast box and wheel spacer install tractor is planted .:cool2:Got wheel spacers from bora or motor sports tec good product crap custumer service .It took three months to get right lug nuts after spacers were delivered.:thumbdown:Read all thetreads about pros and con of wheel spacers it boils down to usable tractor or spend another 20 thousand on wide machine .Didnt read on thread about anyone with wheel spacers going through bearings or other negative repairs.Only had mine a few months but it made mine a useful tractor.:drink:

 

[RaydaKub]

Obviously if you have a FEL the bucket needs to be as close to the ground as is feasible and having something in it helps too.

Mark

Clever idea on the fish line and weight.

Totally disagree in having stuff in the FEL for adding stability. Every pound of weight you have in the FEL (and the FEL itself) transfers weight off the stable rear wheels to the tippy front wheels. No way that adding more weight to the FEL is going to make that better.

 

[Leejohn]

Do you really change rollover if you add 100# on each wheel? Maybe think about finding away to make a swingging weight that you swing from side to side. I know it sounds crazy, but just think about.

 

[CobyRupert]

Do you really change rollover if you add 100# on each wheel? Maybe think about finding away to make a swingging weight that you swing from side to side. I know it sounds crazy, but just think about.

Haven't read whole thread, but this crossed my mind too. It seems adding weight at the axle height with wheel weights would only lower the center of gravity (c.g.) , if the c,g. was originally above the axle height. If the original c.g. was below the axle height it would seem wheel weights would raise it (bad). Though in some conditions the benefit of having more traction and less side slip would be a beneficial trade-off.

Loaded tires would seem to lower the c.g. the most if adding weight.

Before and after widening the track on mine was like night and day.

 

[number9L]

Well, I placed an order with Motorsport-Tech for 5" spacers. I want to add wheel weights too and have a call in to my dealer to get a quote and see how it compares with Lonestar Weights.

Almost wished I'd done weights first and then got wider spacers if it wasnt enough, but.....I need to get this figured out of this tractor is going to continue to do the work I need it to do or if I need look at other options.

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[SPYDERLK]

Do you really change rollover if you add 100# on each wheel? Maybe think about finding away to make a swingging weight that you swing from side to side. I know it sounds crazy, but just think about.

Haven't read whole thread, but this crossed my mind too. It seems adding weight at the axle height with wheel weights would only lower the center of gravity (c.g.) , if the c,g. was originally above the axle height. If the original c.g. was below the axle height it would seem wheel weights would raise it (bad). Though in some conditions the benefit of having more traction and less side slip would be a beneficial trade-off.

Loaded tires would seem to lower the c.g. the most if adding weight.

Before and after widening the track on mine was like night and day.

The axle is below CG so any weight added that is centered at axle height or below will lower the CG. ... Sounds just like making the wheels heavier doesnt it? ":wink:

 

[skyhook]

Lets not forget, that once the tractor is leaning towards it's side,
as in mowing "side to side", on a slope, the CG is now changed.

 

[RaydaKub]

Lets not forget, that once the tractor is leaning towards it's side,
as in mowing "side to side", on a slope, the CG is now changed.

That's a great point. And if you think of just the wheel itself, the fixed weight is going to shift its CG much faster than the fluid that sits right on the ground.

 

[CobyRupert]

Lets not forget, that once the tractor is leaning towards it's side,
as in mowing "side to side", on a slope, the CG is now changed.

Unless you add/delete or relocate weight on the object, the location of the object's C.G. is at a fixed location no matter how the object is rotated.

Liquid loading the tires will lower the C.G. more than the equivalent wheel weight centered on the axle.

 

[Texasmark]

I dont see how youre relating highest point to center of gravity.

Reason being an attempt to get a "line of sight" to the rear wheels since they are what keep you from rolling over. Putting a string 2" long 8" off the ground on the tow hitch at the rear of the tractor tells you nothing.

Years ago, I think it was a Toyota Ridgerunner or some kind of narrow, off road, SUV that a friend had and on his dash one of his instruments was just such a readout. I thought it was a very appropriate instrument for a vehicle of the sort.

Pull up some videos (You tube?) of tractor overturns deliberately set to illustrate the hows and whys, and see for yourself. Until you get more weight (force vector if you will) outside the support point than inside it you can't turn over. However, as I said, hitting a bump at a critical time going too fast and all bets are off because you now have acceleration accompanying dead weight.

Rops help, but you need your seat belt for them to be effective. How many use their belt? I don't because tractors are in use on rough terrain a lot and it will beat you to death....no pun intended and the ratchet does just that.....ratchets you into the seat where you can't move. However I do have a cab and don't worry about it. I have used the string and weight thing in my Branson to determine where I am on the slopes and now don't worry about it. And I mow slowly. I can't mow vertically on a lot of it as I have woods and fence rows at the bottom of the slopes in a lot of the areas.

Mark

 

[number9L]

So thinking about the wheel weights...I'm definitely going to add some in addition to the 5" spacers. At this point I'm wondering if the additional 4" rear width will make that much a difference over adding #300+ to the rear wheels. I'm also kinda wondering if 5" spacers are gonna be too much for the bearings to handle. Guess I'll find out on that one, after all bearings are cheaper than major tractor/implement damage from a roll over.....or a funeral.

Lonestar Weights has weights that look just like the OEM Kubota weights but are 60#ea and they are $418 for 3 sets shipped (360#). That's without mounting bolts, he said i could source them cheaper.

My dealer quoted me $492 carry out for 3 sets of OEM weights and they are 64# ea with the OEM bolt kit (384#). So for an extra $74 I'd get OEM Kubota weights, bolt kit and an extra 24#.

I'm leaning toward the Kubota weights.

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[Wolfy]

The OEM wheel weights will look and mount great, and boost tractor resale value as a bonus.

 

[vtsnowedin]

I'm all for liquid tire ballast and wheel spacers but I've got to say for that small steep area between the trees and the pond I'd use a string trimmer after I got what was practical and safe with the tractor. "A man's got to know his limitations".

 

[skyhook]

Unless you add/delete or relocate weight on the object, the location of the object's C.G. is at a fixed location no matter how the object is rotated.

Liquid loading the tires will lower the C.G. more than the equivalent wheel weight centered on the axle.

What I meant was that the CG now "shifts" to the downhill side or slope.

 

[Gary Fowler]

Moving the tires wider isn't going to help with traction backing up that steep slope but the wheel weights should. Are you mowing with it in 4 WD? You should have no problem climbing that hill in 4 WD unless it is much steeper than the photo makes it out to be.
I think you will find you have a very capable tractor for slope mowing when you get the spacers and wheel weights PLUS liquid ballast in the tires. I don't recall if you mentioned having put liquid ballast in your tires, but if not, go ahead and do that also, that is the best thing for weight distribution that you can use as it puts no strain on the axle other than additional torsion due to extra traction.

 

[number9L]

Gary, I do have the tires filled (all 4) and currently have 3" rear wheel spacers.
I don't have any problem going up & down the slopes as far as the tractors ability, BUT when I do, the tires pull the grass lose from the ground or just tear it out if they spin and that leads to erosion and ruts. Mowing side slope doesn't result in that, which is why I prefer to mow that way.

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[number9L]

Called the dealer this morning and had him go ahead and order the Kubota wheel weights, 3 sets at 384# total.
192# extra on each wheel doesn't sound like much, but I guess it's 192# more than is on them now.

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