when will led lamps go mainstream for auto's

[Soundguy]

should just be a matter of time till they can handle hi brite and what not without self destruction.. especially if there was a significant push to do so..

 

[dstig1]

A huge issue with Hi brightness LEDs is heat dissipation. It may not seem logical but LEDs have a much bigger heat problem than incandescents. Incandescents waste a lot of energy as heat, but much of that is IR (radiated heat). There is a great article that describes the heat issue here (The table is very helpful):
http://www.em.avnet.com/en-us/design/marketsolutions/Documents/Lighting/LightSpeed-Eskow-0508.pdf

Lots of more general HB LED info from the same source here:
Lighting (Lightspeed)

I think you overestimate the electrical savings and what it is worth. For vehicles that are hybrids or electric, then it is important, but for IC engine cars, the lighting load is just not that significant. Most cars don't have 300A alternators, or need them, so you aren't going to save weight or parasitic loss from a smaller alternator. Most of the electrical load is computers, injectors, engine management, and stuff like radios/GPS. The best you could hope for is a percent or two total system efficiency gain, and I suspect that is optimistic. Keep in mind much lighting is intermittent - Brake lights go on and off, most lighting is only at night, etc. Plus it is hard to beat cheapo conventional bulbs. They tend to last a very long time too. I think I have replaced 2 halogen headlights on cars over the years, and maybe 3 dash lights, and 3 taillights. Over 20+ years. The way I see it, there is very little gain from an efficiency standpoint, a huge cost penalty, and some risk on the part of the automakers. They are the most risk-averse businesses on the planet...

 

[Soundguy]

I replace trailer lamps often.. and at least 1-2 non headlamps on my vehicles per year.

electrical savings is electrical savings.

we need to reduce overall fuel usage on the planet. think of it in those terms.

entire planet saving 1-2%.. that's alot.. long term....

it's all about efficiency.

TC's are efficient.. etc... other benefits and costs as well though.. diesels like em though.. especially in high altitudes..

I guess I'll bow out of my own thread now.

I see there is no general interest in any bit of efficiency savings from the bulk of the general populace. No reason to continue with the thread at this point.. .. was just wondering.

thanks for the comments.

 

[dstig1]

it's all about efficiency.

I beg to differ: It's all about tradeoffs. Mostly Cost vs Benefit. LEDs are too much cost for too little benefit, and probably will remain that way for auto lighting for a good bit. Yes, eventually that will change... As I noted, 1-2% is probably overstating the potential gain, perhaps by quite a bit. The biggest benefit the automakers would see is that whatever load they reduce from using LEDs allow them to use that capacity for other electronics. No actual reduction in these cases, just rejiggering where it goes.

If you are seriously curious about HBLEDs, there is a ton of good info at that source, and the articles are written at a decent level for comprehension. You need to have a brain to understand them, but not a PhD in Electronics or anything. With your background in sound equipment, you should have no trouble and it is interesting reading (well to me at least).

 

[Soundguy]

If you are seriously curious about HBLEDs, there is a ton of good info at that source, and the articles are written at a decent level for comprehension. You need to have a brain to understand them, but not a PhD in Electronics or anything. With your background in sound equipment, you should have no trouble and it is interesting reading (well to me at least).

my background in sound equipment comes from EE school.. however I changed my major to CE , took a few more classes and graduated as a CE, not EE... was a money issue the co i was working for was a GC.. needed a CE, not an EE.. paid off the college loan.. couldn't resist that.. so I sold out.. Most of my friends went EE, one ME, and one Computer science.. I was the black sheep .. while all of them get to work in clean environments.. I get to work around rock and dirt and whatnot..

soundguy

 

[dstig1]

If you are careful, your friends won't have to find out that you got the good end of that deal Dirt and rock! How lucky can a man get?

 

[Soundguy]

If you are careful, your friends won't have to find out that you got the good end of that deal Dirt and rock! How lucky can a man get?

I'm glad actually. It helped get me into farming and more in touch with tractors. I was around tractors growing up.. and then around heavy eqiipment for a loooong time before getting back around tractors.

I knew how to drive ag and heavy equipment long before a car..

 

[LarryD]

Getting back to your EE roots Soundguy, the Navy installed LED fixtures on one of the runways and several taxiways a little more than a year ago. The pilots didn't like them at first claiming they were to bright, even though they have a five step regulator and were run at step one on clear nights. Skip to a foggy/low vis day and now its seems they're the cats meow.

Although we don't have Solar Lighting , this application appears to offer a significant cost benifit over conventional systems. I can't comment on advertised MTBF this early but these are not cheap lights. Fixtures have to be replaced and a couple have failed but considering there are hundreds, so far so good.

This really doesn't address your original question but I'd bet LED's will be be the standard for most things in the future.

 

[Redneck in training]

I gave up on turning the light off in our house during the day. My wife and children don't cooperate. Since some light were on for 12 hours a day I figured that it might be cost effective to go LED. The dimmable were 50 and no dimmable 40. I bought 10 dimmable and 4 non dimmable reflector R30 in HD. 10W for 65W incandescent equivalent. I calculated about $ 285 saving/year.
All lights work great and have pleasant light.

Lights for cars can bring cost benefit to manufacturers in example in assembly. They can be just glued to the body, they can be shaped to any shape you can immagine and have thin wire to feed them etc.

 

[BobRip]

I replace trailer lamps often.. and at least 1-2 non headlamps on my vehicles per year.

electrical savings is electrical savings.

we need to reduce overall fuel usage on the planet. think of it in those terms.

entire planet saving 1-2%.. that's alot.. long term....

it's all about efficiency.

TC's are efficient.. etc... other benefits and costs as well though.. diesels like em though.. especially in high altitudes..

I guess I'll bow out of my own thread now.

I see there is no general interest in any bit of efficiency savings from the bulk of the general populace. No reason to continue with the thread at this point.. .. was just wondering.

thanks for the comments.

I am very interested in energy efficiency. I have an ICF House, two speed heat pump and solar hot water heater. All of my bulbs are CFLC or LED. I am now working on getting my Church to improve energy efficiency. This will take time, patience, and persistence. Don't give up.

As automotive efficiency improves the importance of bulb efficiency will increase. I don't think LED Life is a good as stated, but it has the potential.