Who Should Pay?

[Avenger]

I can't even think of something that might happen that is specifically the fault of the guy you might be doing something for. Everything is generally something that may break on his property or anywhere else. If you are doing something beyond the capability of your equipment, then, again, that's your own fault, not his.

If his truck rolls down a hill and smashed into your equipment, that's about the only kind of thing I can think of where he should pay. Or I guess insurance, but not yours.

Well, the issue is, he asked you to come over and do work unpaid, as a favor. There is not fault. And as a favor back to you, he offers to pay for repairs, because he may feel guilty having you come to his property and do work for him and your equipment broke down. Thats how I see it. Well, I see it as 50/50 if I am unpaid and the price of repairs is high. If it was something like a bolt or hose, then yeah, I would totally pay for it all 100%.

There is a bigger picture here than I think many people are not seeing. The relationship you have with your friends and neighbors, that span decades. Favors exchanged, beers bought for one another, your neighbor sleeping on your couch because his wife kicked him out type of thing. It's not just some random dude you met once that asked you to work for him unpaid. If that were the case, this wouldn't be an issue (it's not really an issue but more of a thought exercise), it would be contracted over a handshake and an agreed upon amount for the task. It's like your best friend calls you because he needs your help moving a couch. Are you going to charge him? I hope not!! But what happens if you throw out your back helping him? Hopefully you have insurance or its not that bad to see a doctor, but if you had to pay out of your pocket, for helping your best friend with a favor that is different. If I were the friend, I'd feel so guilty that I would insist on paying!
It kinda seems like people don't do favors for one another, least not without a contract or prearranged negotiations on what happens if a meteor falls on your equipment. I actually do contract work with my tractor for others. They are NOT friends, but more like acquaintances. They call me and ask to use me and my tractor for whatever and to 'name my price.' I throw out a fair and agreed upon number and time frame then get to work. That situation is different. When someone who routinely does favors for me ask that I do a favor for him, there is no negotiation on price. You just get to work. And if something breaks, he helps fix it, especially if he is right there working along side me. I actually felt kinda guilty because he was doing manual labor and I was driving the tractor!
It is not so cut and dried. Granted, I do believe that ultimately I am responsible for my tractor. And that is why we agreed to each pay half. He felt guilty, but its my tractor that I was operating. We went back and fourth for a while, while drinking a delicious beer, figuring out what went wrong and best way to fix it.

I am fully prepared to pay for any damages I cause to my equipment wherever it happens. But sometimes, maybe you should look at the total picture, take your friend up on his offer to pay, and get the job done.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Ok, for starters, I have a *very* good neighbor (two actually). They've just been fantastic to us in many ways...

I would agree with the sentiment that if I'm using my own equipment to help a neighbor for free (or ****, even for pay) on their place, then if I break something on my equipment, it's my problem to fix it.

If I'm loaning that equipment out to the neighbor (would ONLY consider this for the *very* good neighbor) to use in my absence, and HE breaks something on it, then I would probably expect him to pay for it (possible mitigating circumstances, I guess would "depend" on what it was), unless it was under warranty (mine still is).

But that cuts both ways too.

If he's using his equipment on my place (we both do this for each other all the time), and HE breaks something, then it's on him to pay for the fix. Since none of his stuff is under warranty, I would be more than happy to at least help with my labor/tools to help him do the repair. Plus probably a "loaner" of equipment from my side (if I had it) to keep him going until we could fix it.

And if I'm borrowing his equipment in his absence, and I break something on his, then I pay for the repairs out of my pocket. This part has actually worked out for me rather well in the long run. Most of his equipment is "well used" (nothing wrong with that, just a funny part of the story), and when we first moved next door, he graciously loaned me his oldest riding mower (he had 2 at the time) to use on our place (we didn't have one yet). Well, except for the very first time I ran it, it broke down, or something broke on it, every. single. time. I used it. Lol. Steering gear, belts, carb, tire, ignition, it was always something, every time I used it. I always fixed it, with new parts, and just told him about it afterwards. He offered to pay the first couple times, and I always answered, "Nope. I borrowed it. I broke it. I fixed it."

After about a month of this, I was able to go to my CFO, you know, SWMBO (aka Mrs Slim), and say, with all these repair costs on a "free" mower, we'd be money ahead if we just went out and bought a new one (it really was part of our plan anyway, but "moving" you know, just hadn't gotten around to it). She looked at me, did some quick math, and said, "Go buy the one you want."

So I got a brand new mower out of it.

He also plowed our driveway for us our first winter here. Never charged us a cent (I told you they were *very* good neighbors). I used to bring him cases of beer and booze as "thanks". He used a rather old, and beat on skid steer for this, as well as on his own place. He was always offering to let me use it, and I always said "No thanks. Don't know how to run one, don't want to break anything." He also seemed to have a lot of trouble keeping it running, and was always fiddling with it. Then after that first winter was over, his skidder finally died. Rather catastrophic, engine I believe. Anyway, I came home one day and it was gone. I couldn't help feeling relieved that I never borrowed it, because **** those things are spendy to fix.

Next winter we were on our own. Tried making do with a walk behind blower we brought from when we lived in town, and most times it was fine. Was already in "negotiations" with SWMBO for a tractor. Then we got one really big snow, all at once, and we were out there struggling to clear
the driveway. Our OTHER neighbor happened by and saw our struggling, pulled in and offered to come clear out our driveway if we wanted. Told us to go inside and "get warm", and he'd be by in a couple hours. Well about 3 hrs later, we see this 100-120-ish h.p. cabbed Deere pull in with a FEL and bucket, and just wipe our driveway clear in about 15 min (we'd been working on it for hours, and barely got one "lane" clear to *almost* the road). Lol. I tried to offer him cash, but he wouldn't take any. Not even when I offered to at least buy him a tank of diesel fuel.

Anyway,

My wife and I were standing in the kitchen, and this HUGE mound of snow goes by the window, followed by this HUGE Deere. Lol. My wife sees this go by, turned and looks at me and asked, "Is that the size tractor you want?" Lol, no dear, the one I would want would be *way* smaller (and cheaper) than that!

And THAT is how I got my tractor!

Hahahahahahaha.

I would drop everything to help either one of my neighbors if they asked me for help.

 

[JasperFrank]

It is common knowledge that if you break something on your tractor, on your property, doing your project, that you pay for the repairs. And, (I think) it is common knowledge that if you loan out your tractor to someone else, they operate it on their property doing their project and break down, that THEY pay for repairs. Well, what happens if you are operating your tractor on their property doing their project and you break down? Who Pays?

Situation: Your neighbor calls you up, asks a favor. He would like you to drive over to his house in your tractor and preform some work for him. This work is only going to take a few hours and you decide that it is the 'neighborly' thing to do. There is no mention of compensation, you exchange favors all the time and have a really good relationship with him. You drive up and start working. He is out there helping, but suddenly, your broken. The tractor does not move due to the nature of the break. Now, who should pay for replacement parts/service?

Option 1: Since the project was your neighbors, he was not planning on compensating you, it is on his property, he should pay the cost of repairs.

Option 2: Since it is YOUR tractor that you choose which ultimately decides the price of parts, YOU were operating it when it broke, and YOU are responsible for the maintenance and no one cares more about the tractor than you do, YOU should pay for repairs.

Option 3: Split cost 50/50

What would you do?

Its on you. You volunteered without a contract, verbal or written. You were extending good will. If I broke my tractor helping someone else out, I would never ask the other party to pay for the repairs, its all on me. And I would expect the same if the situation was reversed.

 

[Industrial Toys]

Just thinking. If there was something hiding in the grass or elsewhere that would puncture a tire, and result in costly repairs, that might be different. I would not demand or expect payment, but if it was offered, i would probably take it.

 

[Aquamoose]

Option #2 hands down, without a doubt, end off story.

 

[two_bit_score]

If a friend had something break while helping me (at no charge to me), I would offer to pay for at least part of it, I would probably also invite them and their spouse over for (or out to) dinner on us.

Aaron Z

That would be a most gracious way to handle it.

 

[ch1ch2]

I volunteered my tractor at the church garden moving3 dump truck loads of mulch. While dumping the load, the throwout bearing failed. Luckily, I had just put it in reverse. There was al lady in front of the tractor that might have been run over. It took a second or two for me to stand on the brake and turn off the key.

Who pays for the repair?

Some gave condolences. None gave money. I covered it all.

It was no ones fault and it was my equipment.

 

[4570Man]

I think this question has a lot to do with the repair. A lot of the story’s here were caused by wear and would have failed back home in a couple more days. The failures with a direct correlation to the job are a lot different.

 

[Diggin It]

If I'm loaning that equipment out to the neighbor .... to use in my absence, and HE breaks something on it, then I would probably expect him to pay for it (possible mitigating circumstances, I guess would "depend" on what it was), unless it was under warranty (mine still is).

Brings up an interesting twist. Do original or extended warranties care WHO is operating at the time of failure? What about manufacturer sponsored insurance plans like KTAC?

 

[Diggin It]

I volunteered my tractor at the church garden moving3 dump truck loads of mulch. While dumping the load, the throwout bearing failed. Luckily, I had just put it in reverse. There was al lady in front of the tractor that might have been run over. It took a second or two for me to stand on the brake and turn off the key.

Who pays for the repair?

Some gave condolences. None gave money. I covered it all.

It was no ones fault and it was my equipment.

Brings up another interesting question.

Who would have paid the medical expenses if ... ?

 

[Jstpssng]

Brings up another interesting question.

Who would have paid the medical expenses if ... ?

That's why I carry insurance. We will be doing some work at my parent's church next year. It's only 1/4 mile from their house (my grandfather sold them the land) but I told my mother that I would be bringing my tractor down because I have insurance.
Also because I will have a grapple by then, and we also are going to be cleaning up the property.

 

[CobyRupert]

I volunteered my tractor at the church garden moving3 dump truck loads of mulch. While dumping the load, the throwout bearing failed. Who pays for the repair?

Some gave condolences. None gave money. I covered it all.

You mean their "thoughts and prayers" didn't fix it?

:stirthepot:

 

[Industrial Toys]

They need to pray harder!

 

[Avenger]

I would drop everything to help either one of my neighbors if they asked me for help.

Yep.

I spoke to my neighbor last night about this thread. Showed him actually. He was impressed, and discouraged at the same time. He is still under the belief that if something breaks of mine while I am doing something for him, then he is responsible. This is why we decided to split it, but didnt have too (warranty). I feel responsible because its my equipment, he feels responsible because its his project and I 'dropped everything to help him when he asked.' These are good neighbors. The ones who dont expect repayment or damages for favors. Favors are paid for by favors in return. That's just the way it is.

 

[aczlan]

These are good neighbors. The ones who dont expect repayment or damages for favors. Favors are paid for by favors in return. That's just the way it is.

Those are the ones who are worth their weight in gold.

Aaron Z

 

[Industrial Toys]

I think that may be a little over simplistic.

I have friends and we go back and forth with doing and buying stuff. We could be out thousands and no one really seems to care. It's just you care enough about that person, that if they had a grand of yours, you would not care.

Now, if My Father owes me two dollars and I say don't worry about it, he still insists! Weird, how people are different. He would be aghast, if he knew of my arrangements with other people.

 

[Jstpssng]

^^^
I don't know your father but do know that most parents would be concerned about owing their kids a couple of bucks no matter how they were toward their friends.

 

[Ken Kegris]

I loan very little, but I always say YOU BREAK IT YOU FIX IT. the key word here is YOU if something breaks because it worn out then I should fix it, now if the hood gets smashed or a nail gets run into a tire then he pays. I do a lot of snow plowing for nothing, and I ran into a garage wall and they paid for their wall because of the ice. It was not that much just straighten out the siding a little. Friendships are more important than money.

 

[HillStreet]

Option 2, it’s on you.

 

[joeyd]

A similar event happened to me last winter, I got my tractor stuck while plowing snow. I got the left front tire over the edge of the road and could not get back up. I tried everything I could think of to get out FEL, I was already chained up, blocking under the wheel etc. I called a neighbor and he came over with his plow truck to pull me up, 2-3 feet is all it would take. When he was pulling his front drive shaft & u-joint blew apart. I helped him wire the driveshaft up so it wouldn't drag and followed him to town (20-25 mins) to drop his truck off at his mechanic (his choice). We came back and he pulled me out with his dozer. He didn't ask for $$ help because he said it could have snapped while plowing just as easy. As a neighbor out in the country it is smarter to keep a friendly neighbor than to cause disharmony, after some arm twisting on my part we agreed on a 60-40 split on the repair of his truck.