Will a Stump Bucket damage my FEL?

[TN8Man]

Was thinking of getting a backhoe for my Kioti NX5010 but the dealer told me I might consider a stump bucket and save some money.

Has anyone damaged their tractor using a stump bucket?

 

[RjCorazza]

Don't have a stump bucket, but I think I would prefer a centered implement to torquing the side of a normal bucket.
With common sense usage I wouldn't be overly concerned.

 

[Notforhire]

I would say a lot depends on how big a stump. Let's face it you can break anything if you push it too hard. RjCorazza summed it up.
I've owned two different stump buckets. I used them for transplanting shrubs and small trees. The most useful one I owned had a curved bottom and a grapple.
IMO the curved bottom penetrates the soil easier than the typical flat bottom style.
I sold my stump bucket to friend shortly after getting my TLB. My friend has a NH TC40DA and has removed quite a few stumps.

 

[The Gaul]

I recently purchased a stump bucket for my NS6010. If you use common sense (i.e. don't slam your machine into tree stumps trying to knock them over), this is nice to have tool. It will not replace a backhoe for trenching, but even if you were to buy a backhoe, I would say it makes more sense to rent an excavator for a large trenching job.
There's amply videos on-line on how to use them in a proper way.
Since this is just welded steel and not high-end technology I went with the Titan large bucket. Deals can be had if you wait for their sale.

 

[CloverKnollFarms]

It can. I've seen a number of bent loader cylinders

 

[4570Man]

With reasonable use probably not but it certainly can and will with abuse. Loaders are made for loading not digging stumps.

 

[garry1p]

I have one and have used it quite a bit.
It is not a backhoe but it does have it's place
It takes some getting used to and the problem child is the stumps with a "deep" tap root.
Best to use it in damp soil after a rain.
The easy ones is the old stumps, 3+ years and they just dig out with very little digging (most of the time).
I have not worried about damage to the FEL since the my stump bucket comes to a narrow point on the end and I am able to keep it centered.
It's great for digging holes for planting trees and stuff.

I am satisfied with mine and would buy again.

Pictured is a group of 8 trees bunched up, largest was over 6" and 15ft tall. Most difficult was the one remaining standing. It took an additional two hours to dig this one tree out, the tap root went down over 4 ft and I was worried about getting stuck when the hole kept getting deeper and deeper.

 

[Vigo327]

Damage is down to user error. A stump bucket is not inherently dangerous to the loader, but a lack of grasp of physics is. I think the most important thing is to go in with patience and realistic expectations. There are not too many stumps that can just be 'popped' out of the ground without a lot of work. Almost all of them will require digging around and breaking a bunch of roots before going for the main stump.

 

[Torvy]

Not something the loader was designed to do.

It only takes one mistake to serious ruin your day. It is much cheaper for me to rent the right tool (mini ex) than risk my investment.

Have people used them successfully? Sure. Others have bent the c-rap out of their loader.

 

[MapleLeafFarmer]

I have one and its great tool.
Operator needs to understand the power of a lever (leverage)
Easy to damage stuff as the bucket can work as a big lever.

 

[Vigo327]

To add to that, a stump bucket on a tractor loader might be pretty underwhelming if you dont use leverage to your advantage. The length of the bucket gives you opportunities to use it as a fulcrum in a way you generally wouldnt use a standard bucket.

For example, if youre trying to pry something up with the tip, you can wedge the bucket under something and with the middle of the bucket as a fulcrum against the ground, you can push DOWN with the loader until your front wheels come up so that in addition to your bucket curl force you also have the weight of the front of your tractor pushing down on the back of your lever, and you wont hurt anything because stump bucket forces are pretty much always centered between the loader arms and all your cylinder rods are in tension in this scenario.

My approach to using a stump bucket (i have maybe 10 hrs on a loaner) is to dump the bucket to near vertical and push it into the ground until the front end comes up. Then try to curl up until the bucket is closer to 30 degrees down. If youre in a hydrostatic machine you may have to let the tractor roll back a bit during this curl. Then as you try to drive forward to push the bucket into the ground you have to balance lowering the loader as it drives in because you want enough weight on the front tires to get 4wd traction (if 4wd) but not so much that your front tires are keeping your bucket from going any deeper and you end up just trying to drive it forward as a plow instead of a spade.

 

[BlueKnife]

Was thinking of getting a backhoe for my Kioti NX5010 but the dealer told me I might consider a stump bucket and save some money.

Has anyone damaged their tractor using a stump bucket?

Neither a backhoe attachment nor a stump bucket are good options for any but very small stumps. Better off renting a stump grinder.

 

[sd455dan]

To add to that, a stump bucket on a tractor loader might be pretty underwhelming if you dont use leverage to your advantage. The length of the bucket gives you opportunities to use it as a fulcrum in a way you generally wouldnt use a standard bucket.

For example, if youre trying to pry something up with the tip, you can wedge the bucket under something and with the middle of the bucket as a fulcrum against the ground, you can push DOWN with the loader until your front wheels come up so that in addition to your bucket curl force you also have the weight of the front of your tractor pushing down on the back of your lever, and you wont hurt anything because stump bucket forces are pretty much always centered between the loader arms and all your cylinder rods are in tension in this scenario.

My approach to using a stump bucket (i have maybe 10 hrs on a loaner) is to dump the bucket to near vertical and push it into the ground until the front end comes up. Then try to curl up until the bucket is closer to 30 degrees down. If youre in a hydrostatic machine you may have to let the tractor roll back a bit during this curl. Then as you try to drive forward to push the bucket into the ground you have to balance lowering the loader as it drives in because you want enough weight on the front tires to get 4wd traction (if 4wd) but not so much that your front tires are keeping your bucket from going any deeper and you end up just trying to drive it forward as a plow instead of a spade.

That works to a point, I blew out a hydraulic hose doing it because the FEL controls were centered while driving forward.
In that position there is no relief valve in circuit, amazing to lose 5 gallons of hydraulic fluid in about a second.

 

[TN8Man]

Neither a backhoe attachment nor a stump bucket are good options for any but very small stumps. Better off renting a stump grinder.

I have one

 

[DarkBlack]

Neither a backhoe attachment nor a stump bucket are good options for any but very small stumps. Better off renting a stump grinder.

Stump grinder is useless if your objective is to remove the stump and roots

 

[5030]

Better off renting a stump grinder.

Or owning one if you have a lot of stumps. I own mine actually and owning one garners a lot of neighbors that want theirs ground as well...for a price of course.

 

[BlueKnife]

Stump grinder is useless if your objective is to remove the stump and roots

Not if you use a decent size grinder. I'm not talking about the little toy grinders they rent out at Home Depot.

 

[oosik]

I use my grapple to remove Buck brush. Buck brush - stem diameter..... 1/2 inch max. Height - two feet max. I let Mother Nature remove my pine stumps. Takes about 12 to 15 years. However - I have no pine tree or stumps in my yard. They start at about 120 from the house and out buildings.

I tried burning one pine stump. What a nightmare. Little "smokes" started showing anywhere from 10 to 20 feet from the main stump. The fire had burned down some of the roots. Last time I ever tried that.

 

[Vigo327]

That works to a point, I blew out a hydraulic hose doing it because the FEL controls were centered while driving forward.
In that position there is no relief valve in circuit, amazing to lose 5 gallons of hydraulic fluid in about a second.

Bummer! Im curious which circuit you blew, the bucket cyls or the boom cyls? Not that i dont recognize the danger of pressure spikes in the hydraulics (Messicks did a good youtube video showing what can happen with grapple lids) but i suspect whatever failed was on its way out as generally I dont think most tractors with loaders can pop any of their own hoses by just driving forward against something.

I can see a scenario with a stump bucket, though.. They are much longer than normal buckets so they put more leverage into the bucket cylinders if you have it stabbed into something and try to drive forward/backward. I suppose the solution would be to only try to drive it forward at lowish angles, maybe <30 degrees? Interesting issue, thanks for posting that..

 

[sd455dan]

Bummer! Im curious which circuit you blew, the bucket cyls or the boom cyls? Not that i dont recognize the danger of pressure spikes in the hydraulics (Messicks did a good youtube video showing what can happen with grapple lids) but i suspect whatever failed was on its way out as generally I dont think most tractors with loaders can pop any of their own hoses by just driving forward against something.

I can see a scenario with a stump bucket, though.. They are much longer than normal buckets so they put more leverage into the bucket cylinders if you have it stabbed into something and try to drive forward/backward. I suppose the solution would be to only try to drive it forward at lowish angles, maybe <30 degrees? Interesting issue, thanks for posting that..

It was the left lift/boom cylinder. I did not have the loader at the lowest height with cylinder rods bottomed.

Was digging with the regular bucket angled down 1st gear weighted wheels and 1100lb on the 3 point lots of traction. I have also blown out a grapple lid hose one time trying to pull a stump over.
Those are a couple reasons I finally bought an old industrial TLB.

On most CUT's when the valves are centered and the cylinders are anywhere but against stops, this pressure spike in a line and against the piston seals can happen when push comes to shove.

ps. the hoses were originals so at least 20 years of use already.
Including digging my first stump out with the grapple early on, along with destroying a chain on my saw cutting some side roots but in the end the tractor did win the battle.
Back then a stump bucket would have been a Much better tool to have than a grapple. but I used what I had.
Them Tap roots can make things interesting.