Winch

[gwiley]

I use a pull line to bring large trees down on a regular basis and have found that I have to rely on the tractor or truck to move fast enough to keep the line tight enough to guide the fall. Having 2 people is an absolute must - one on the saw the other on the pull line driving the tractor.

I actually prefer using 5/8" bull rope (11K lb breaking strength) because I can toss a throw line into the canopy then use that to pull the larger rope into the tree and put a bowline (slip knot) in. This lets you get leverage MUCH higher in the tree which is a lot safer (as long as you dont pull too hard). I then secure the other end to my skid steer through a redirect (large pulley at the base of another tree) so that I am pulling outside the fall zone.

 

[oldballs]

I use a pull line to bring large trees down on a regular basis and have found that I have to rely on the tractor or truck to move fast enough to keep the line tight enough to guide the fall. Having 2 people is an absolute must - one on the saw the other on the pull line driving the tractor.

I actually prefer using 5/8" bull rope (11K lb breaking strength) because I can toss a throw line into the canopy then use that to pull the larger rope into the tree and put a bowline (slip knot) in. This lets you get leverage MUCH higher in the tree which is a lot safer (as long as you dont pull too hard). I then secure the other end to my skid steer through a redirect (large pulley at the base of another tree) so that I am pulling outside the fall zone.

That's my method also.....one person on the saw and me in the F250....with the rope attached to the front tow hooks. It makes for a controlled fall. But not every situation allows for the space and truck, however.

 

[timbatrader]

Runva electric winches look a lot like a Superwinch, maybe they're made in the same place. After using mine for a couple hours, the idea that it would be a temporary installation is out the window. I think I'll order another snatch block so I can use two, one up high on the tree dragging end, and another down low, so I don't lift the tractor. Besides, using one looks too much like a sling-shot aimed at my head. I have to skid pan it too, to protect the wires on the bottom. I would have mounted it the other way, but that would have put the cable slot on top of the mount and weakened it. (probably could have wound the cable the opposite way on the drum, and run it backward, now that I think of it.. 20:20 hindsight) anybody know if the winch cares?

On my Landcruiser I have a 9000-pound Come up electric winch that was made in Taiwan I believe they also make the gearbox and drum for Superwinch. I have been told Superwinch assemble with an American motor wire rope and a few other parts to get it up to the correct percentage so they can label it 杜ade in USA
The Runva winch is of similar design but much heavier with cast steel casing痴 fine on a bulldozer but would be to heavy on a 4x4 front bumper the Come up winch has alloy casing and not so hard on the Landcruiser front suspension

 

[tungularafishcamp]

That's my method also.....one person on the saw and me in the F250....with the rope attached to the front tow hooks. It makes for a controlled fall. But not every situation allows for the space and truck, however.

That and you might not always have an extra set of hands available. I had a couple of doug firs leaning 180 from my desired direction of fall last winter and I just cut a small box into the backside of the tree with the tip of my saw so the backcut went thru the middle of the box, made the face cut, started the back cut so the chain past the box, then stopped and put a bottle jack in the box and just jacked the tree over in the desired direction. It was quicker and easier than using the winch and I didnt need anyone else to help, just go slow alternating jacking and sawing, maybe do a practice tree first. Take it safe, slow, and easy Jake and have fun!

 

[MBTRAC]

We regularly use winches to drop trees & apart from a logging winch attached to our D7 size dozer (which even I am sceptical about using as an anchor for larger trees) there's no way I'd advocate using a winch attached to any lighter machine or vehicle - people understimate the forces & loads even a relatively small tree can exert with catastrophic results

Our experience has found the safest way to use electric winches, we use Warns a XD9000 & 120000 ( with either a stand alone battery or power cables running to machines) , is to mount the winch in a portable frame & anchor/chain to another tree away from your intended direction of fall running the cable through a snatch block pulley anchored to second tree where you wish to direct the tree you're felling, requires:
- Two people, 1x operating the winch & 1x chainsawing who both know what they are doing & are coordinated with agreed hand signals/escape plans
- Secure the winch & pulley as low as possbie on the anchor trees & the winch cable hook to a chain as high as possible on the main trunk of the tree you're felling
- Initial winch cable tension only minimally taut (not fully loaded) on the felling tree
- Usually a humbolt cut controlling the intended direction of fall which also minimises the risk of a barber chair/shattering &/or the tree bouncing on the stump
- Gradually increase in the winch cable tension as the back cut commences, it's imperative that the hinge is even/square (from both humbolt & backcut) & that the tree is felled from increasing/continuing the winch tension pull until the tree is on the ground - and NOT by the chainsaw severing/diminishing the hinge (which can lead to the tree spinning/changing direction or shattering in a barber chair) .

Take care.

 

[Baby Grand]

We regularly use winches to drop trees & apart from a logging winch attached to our D7 size dozer (which even I am sceptical about using as an anchor for larger trees) there's no way I'd advocate using a winch attached to any lighter machine or vehicle - people understimate the forces & loads even a relatively small tree can exert with catastrophic results

<snip>

Thanks for confirming my suspicion. Something about having a 5000# tractor directly attached to a 10000# tree that is in free fall with the chain making a 30 degree angle to the trunk makes me think you're going for a fast ride to wherever the tree is inclined to take you if you don't have some kind of fuse (shear bolt, clutch, etc) to let go for you.

 

[johnk]

Thanks for confirming my suspicion. Something about having a 5000# tractor directly attached to a 10000# tree that is in free fall with the chain making a 30 degree angle to the trunk makes me think you're going for a fast ride to wherever the tree is inclined to take you if you don't have some kind of fuse (shear bolt, clutch, etc) to let go for you.

I second those feelings............. Have to be careful out there. Can't underestimate safety...

 

[jake98]

I put the bucket up against another tree, (I'm not a total idiot..) that's why I put the winch on the front. :laughing:

 

[jake98]

That and you might not always have an extra set of hands available. I had a couple of doug firs leaning 180 from my desired direction of fall last winter and I just cut a small box into the backside of the tree with the tip of my saw so the backcut went thru the middle of the box, made the face cut, started the back cut so the chain past the box, then stopped and put a bottle jack in the box and just jacked the tree over in the desired direction. It was quicker and easier than using the winch and I didnt need anyone else to help, just go slow alternating jacking and sawing, maybe do a practice tree first. Take it safe, slow, and easy Jake and have fun!

That's an interesting method Rick, thanks, I'll maybe try that some day.

 

[dstig1]

The jack method is a pretty common one for large trees. Like this:

Or you can just do it old school with wedges

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leM-d2tIZts
(can't put more than one video in a post I guess...)
I love this video every time I look it up. Don't worry, it was a dead tree which is why they were cutting it. That is why all the water is pouring out of it during the cuts.

From a winch standpoint, a PTO logging winch works great for this. Still a 2-person operation (not possible with one person as you have to be holding the winch rope for it to do anything), but if something starts going in the wrong direction, you let go and the winch can freewheel out so it won't drag your tractor around. Plus they pull a lot faster than normal electric winches, so you can keep ahead of the early moves of a tree tipping reasonably well. OBVIOUSLY you need to use your brain on this. When I have done it with a friend, we used a long rope to attach to the tree and the tractor was far enough away that it could not be hit. Allowing plenty of cable left on the drum to pay out if trouble strikes is another key point. It is felling trees - there is always something that can go wrong, but you can do a lot of things to put the tree where you want it and do it pretty safely with some experience and thinking it through.

 

[oldballs]

In my rope method.......the rope is quite longer than the tree. Thus with me in the truck and the other guy on the saw, the truck only guides the fall to start. It does not fight the direction and there is no tension on the truck.

 

[kco]

I use a pull line to bring large trees down on a regular basis and have found that I have to rely on the tractor or truck to move fast enough to keep the line tight enough to guide the fall. Having 2 people is an absolute must - one on the saw the other on the pull line driving the tractor.

I actually prefer using 5/8" bull rope (11K lb breaking strength) because I can toss a throw line into the canopy then use that to pull the larger rope into the tree and put a bowline (slip knot) in. This lets you get leverage MUCH higher in the tree which is a lot safer (as long as you dont pull too hard). I then secure the other end to my skid steer through a redirect (large pulley at the base of another tree) so that I am pulling outside the fall zone.

I use a similar method with a 150' 10mm(about 3/8") rope from my climbing days and a 6" snatch block. There is a lot of stretch in the light rope. When making the back cut you can watch the cut open. If needed you can go back to the tractor and reapply tension for the amount the top has moved. I cut alone and find it a controlled and safe way to fall trees. My trees are fairly straight forward--fir, spruce, pine and birch to about 70'. So there are no massive side branches or tops to make the natural fall direction hard to judge.

Where I don't need too much height to attach the rope and I can get the tractor to the tree, I climb in the bucket to attach the rope. Where more height is required I use my belt and spurs (from lineman days long, long ago) to attach the rope as high as needed. A timber hitch works well as it is easy to remove.

An advantage of a long rope is that it puts a lot of pat52rl's suggestion("throw a bit of nylon into the equation") into the equation. The 150' length means I can sometimes pull without the snatch block. But I'm in hilly terrain with winding trails so a snatch block is often required.

Most of my trees are straight forward and I can just fell the tree. But I always make sure my tractor is far back just in case it goes completely wrong. My dog is smart, she leaves the area whenever the chainsaw is running and returns once it's off.

A thick forest presents other hazards. One must be aware of existing dead branches and broken branches caused by felling. Check the canopy before you go back in. It is also not uncommon for me to misjudge and have a tree hang on an adjacent one after cutting. Watch carefully when skidding them out. If the butt snags on the stump or a root it can quickly stand the tree back up and perhaps over on to you. It isn't safe until the whole tree is on the ground.