Wind Turbine ********. Just opened the mail and seen the plan for three massive units

[davesl708]

It is amazing the amount of BS put out by the power companies. Eight years ago Kansas City Power and Light asked for five rate increases over five years to build wind turbines in western Kansas to save rate payers money. The turbines are too far away to transmit power to KCPL customers so they sell the energy on the open market (i.e. we pay they profit).
Now they want another 12.7% rate increase to pay for the maintenance on the generators. We pay so Great Plains Energy(parent) gets to profit from selling the energy to others. We (ratepayers) get the shaft. It is costing as much to keep them working as it did to build them.

Got to love the progressives.

 

[Creamer]

It is amazing the amount of BS put out by the power companies. Eight years ago Kansas City Power and Light asked for five rate increases over five years to build wind turbines in western Kansas to save rate payers money. The turbines are too far away to transmit power to KCPL customers so they sell the energy on the open market (i.e. we pay they profit).
Now they want another 12.7% rate increase to pay for the maintenance on the generators. We pay so Great Plains Energy(parent) gets to profit from selling the energy to others. We (ratepayers) get the shaft. It is costing as much to keep them working as it did to build them.

Got to love the progressives.

That all makes sense to me. We got the same thing about how we should be happy about the rate rise because sometime in the future we may get some energy from windmills.

 

[Creamer]

Just curious - how many actually believe the term fossil fuels? Known reserves of billions of barrels of oil and even more natural gas was created from so many plants and animals that died and just happened to not rot but somehow got covered up - some many miles deep - and transformed into oil and NG for us to use. If this was really the case how much carbon dioxide was present before all this carbon entrapment started?

 

[TomSeller]

Just curious - how many actually believe the term fossil fuels? Known reserves of billions of barrels of oil and even more natural gas was created from so many plants and animals that died and just happened to not rot but somehow got covered up - some many miles deep - and transformed into oil and NG for us to use. If this was really the case how much carbon dioxide was present before all this carbon entrapment started?

Gas comes from dinosaurs, I saw it on the signs growing up.

 

[buickanddeere]

Ontario Wind Turbines | Ontario has the most expensive electricity in North America

Groups | Ontario Wind Resistance

 

[buickanddeere]

With the Lithium Supply already stretched. How pray tell does using more of a scarce commodity make it cheaper?

 

[Loren49]

From my perspective only, you do your cause a disservice when you trivialise or do not empathise with people who feel their reasonable enjoyment of their properties has been adversely impacted by anything imposed against their will.

Sure, we can seldom please everyone all the time, but perhaps explaining the lengths the wind generators go to to appease those with reasonable concerns might be a good place to start a discussion on the matter rather than trivialising or ignoring or projecting as unreasonable simply because they are a minority or the things they point to don't bother you personally. Or even laying out the case for these as the best of all the options so that the aggreived can see there was no better option and their quality of life would have suffered without the wind generator anyway, through blackouts, etc, etc.

I just don't think it wise to ignore detractors, or blanket them with the 'minority' moniker as if their voice is no longer important. I'm getting off topic now but that sort of thing happens in all walks of life, and it breeds contempt and disconnected people, and that breeds trouble for everyone in the long run. Similarly, real progress should not be halted because a few crazies who can't see logic cling to unrealistic ideals, but there is a whole phalanx in between who don't deserve to be labelled crazy yet find their enjoyment of their properties adversely impacted by 'progress', and who deserve a voice that is acknowledged.

On this thread I have responded to basically 2 others when they make what appear to be non fact supported claims. I research and find information that that shows this.

I understand that some are actually annoyed by the sight or even thought of these windmills and have referenced studies that acknowledge this. You made an assumption on how I treat people I meet who dislike wind. When claims are made concerning aspects of wind power that are made up I often will respond. Example...dangers of low frequency or noise health claims...MIT studied this and found no link.

No health impacts from wind turbine noise, says MIT study -Recharge News

Anecdotal claims are notoriously used and usually do not hold up to scrutiny.

I agree that it is good to be diplomatic at times but there are also some who take advantage of that approach and are emboldened when not called on non fact supported claims. With the 2 on this thread I am very skeptical that my explanation of the lengths to which my local wind farm went to appease some peoples concern would have done any good. (I was on our Town's planning board for the 4-5 year process for Maple Ridge Wind Farm)

Loren

 

[houstonscott]

On this thread I have responded to basically 2 others when they make what appear to be non fact supported claims. I research and find information that that shows this. I understand that some are actually annoyed by the sight or even thought of these windmills and have referenced studies that acknowledge this. You made an assumption on how I treat people I meet who dislike wind. When claims are made concerning aspects of wind power that are made up I often will respond. Example...dangers of low frequency or noise health claims...MIT studied this and found no link. No health impacts from wind turbine noise, says MIT study -Recharge News Anecdotal claims are notoriously used and usually do not hold up to scrutiny. I agree that it is good to be diplomatic at times but there are also some who take advantage of that approach and are emboldened when not called on non fact supported claims. With the 2 on this thread I am very skeptical that my explanation of the lengths to which my local wind farm went to appease some peoples concern would have done any good. (I was on our Town's planning board for the 4-5 year process for Maple Ridge Wind Farm) Loren

Hears the problem, Loren, you post a link to a MIT study and you think the issue is proven, done, no health issues from wind. Some study from MIT doesn't prove no health issues. It's just a study. Wind turbines make noise, noise can cause health problems, and is not desirable. People simply have the right in this country to live without a gigantic wind turbine in their view if they don't want to see or hear them them. HS

 

[Loren49]

Hears the problem, Loren, you post a link to a MIT study and you think the issue is proven, done, no health issues from wind. Some study from MIT doesn't prove no health issues. It's just a study. Wind turbines make noise, noise can cause health problems, and is not desirable. People simply have the right in this country to live without a gigantic wind turbine in their view if they don't want to see or hear them them. HS

There are many things being done that I don't like. I do not have an absolute right to stop them. Where do you think that right comes from?

Can you find a peer reviewed examination of health problems that indicates a connection with wind towers? There have been many that show not connection and yet the claims continue. Noise at the level of these units has not been shown to cause health problems.

Many really like to view these electricity producing machines. Do I not have that right also. I don't like smoke spewing coal fired stacks or nuclear cooling towers but they are still there. We all live with things a bit different than we'd like and most adjust to it!


Loren

 

[Loren49]

KiwiBro-
You choose to criticize me for responding to these claims with references that question their validity. You must realize that you are free to try to gain their understanding by posting what you know or can find concerning the measures developers take to appease the vocal few. I have heard and dealt with all of these claims for over ten years and assure you that those facts do little to change mind and a belief.

Why were you not concerned enough to criticize the person who posted that I am "mean spirited, hateful and unhappy" because I post information he doesn't like and at times shows he made up things.
We should be able to state differing views without personal attack. It is not reasonable to make any personal claim based on differing view points. I feel this is done as a distraction when the discussion does not go his way.

Loren