wood processor build

[CDN Farm Boy]

Good suggestion Mud. I was thinking similar of trying to find a worn our mini-ex: 5 or 6 cyl and 3 motors along with all the valves etc. But as of next Tues, I've got a 2.0 Jetta available for nothing that I'm thinking of using to power my build next summer.

 

[triangel]

How will you govern the motor? I have a used toyota 2.2 laying around but don't know how to put a governor on it to control the speed and power. Also checked out those ditch witchs on ebay pretty pricicy even the parts ones. will keep looking for answers.

 

[muddstopper]

I have never had much luck looking for parts on Ebay. Seems everybody has a buy it now price and its for more than the parts are worth. Most luck I have found is just checking scrap yards. The machines are sold at scrap metal price and parts are pretty cheap. I bought a pump, mount, and control valve, complete with the joysticks for $20. Bought another pump for $2. bought a complete a620 backhoe attachment for $300. (sold it for $800) You just have to be at the right scrap yard at the right time. With cheap scrap prices right now, selection isnt as great as it used to be, but bargains are still out there.

As for the toyota engine, think about using a cruise control as your governor. The oild dueltz engines we used to use at work had a throttle lock. Motors cranked wide open and stayed there all day.

 

[Wild Bill the 2nd]

I was looking up info on adding a governor to an automotive engine last week. This is what I came up with as far as manufacturers. They appear to be a dying breed.
Can't find them for sale anywhere on the net which is odd. I haven't found an engine for my processor so I haven't made any calls.

Foley Universal Governor Installation Guide Foley is producing the old Pierce / Hoof products
Woodward Universal Governors Purchased Barber Colman who purchased SynchroStart
Governors of America (Electrical)

Possibly a place to buy the GoA units​

Many forum threads on this topic say to find belt drive governors off of old construction or farm equipment such as combines.
I have seen inquiries into using cruise control but have not seen where it has been done. (I'm sure it has)

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

Throttle control on a cable operated automotive engine is easy. Cruise control is an option. I know a couple guys that used a bicycle shifter to rig up a hand throttle on their Jeeps. Anything that will keep the cable taught and the throttle plate at the right position will work.

Now if its a drive-by-wire throttle body, that's a whole different story and out of my league.

 

[Wild Bill the 2nd]

A throttle cable will set the throttle easy enough but it does not adjust the throttle when load increases. What is being discussed here is an engine speed governor that monitors engine speed and adjusts the throttle to maintain a certain RPM as load on the engine increases and decreases.

 

[muddstopper]

I just did a quick search and this cruise control poped up. https://www.autoelec.com.au/ssl/public_autoelec/store_v4/product_detail.asp?id=2218&cat=52, Its $225 kangaroo money, but there should be American alternatives. At one time JC Whitney sold aftermarket cruise control kits. AudioVox was a major brand back in the day.

 

[Wild Bill the 2nd]

They are still available.
Amazon.com: Rostra Universal Electronic Cruise Control 250-1223: Automotive
Here is a servo motor actuated one.

So I have a question of vacuum actuated vs servo actuated. If my memory serves me right I'm thinking you could easily have 3-4 MPH swings on vehicles in the 80's. Vehicles from the 90's and up you generally set and that's where they stay. So I'd be inclined to think that a servo motor may be more accurate but it is a guess.

The other thing that I would question on any cruise control setup is just how quickly they will react to a change in the engine RPM. Cruise control in cars typically works to minutely adjust the throttle. A car gradually transitions form flat land to a grade. It's not like the car engine goes from no load to 75% load in the blink of an eye which will happen when engaging the splitter in a log that is up against the wedge already.

I'm not saying it won't work, but those would be my concerns.

 

[triangel]

I would agree, I think cruise would not be fast enough however as Wild Bill stated I know of older massy combines that had governors on their flathead motors however they would be getting pretty old

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

What is being discussed here is an engine speed governor that monitors engine speed and adjusts the throttle to maintain a certain RPM as load on the engine increases and decreases.

Really? Since this:

How will you govern the motor? I have a used toyota 2.2 laying around but don't know how to put a governor on it to control the speed and power. Also checked out those ditch witchs on ebay pretty pricicy even the parts ones. will keep looking for answers.

was seemingly directed at me with my comment about using a Jetta motor, I answered with my plans which is just throttle control.

I'm well aware of the difference between basic throttle control and a governor. Sure, a governor is better but look at how many things out there just have basic throttle control that you (typically) set under load? Most small engines are just cranked wide open and left there. My B3300 has no obvious governor as when the RPMs drop from load, they only come back up when the load decreases. The 4050 AC tractor I grew up with was the same as are the vast majority of the tractors I have driven. Why wouldn't the same work for the Jetta motor?

 

[triangel]

I believe on a diesel the governor is in the injection pump and I am assuming the Jetta is a diesel then it should be okay, my toyota motor is gas motor from an old 80's Celeca that hit a deer and has been sitting in the back for a number of years.

 

[Wild Bill the 2nd]

I'm well aware of the difference between basic throttle control and a governor. Sure, a governor is better but look at how many things out there just have basic throttle control that you (typically) set under load? Most small engines are just cranked wide open and left there. My B3300 has no obvious governor as when the RPMs drop from load, they only come back up when the load decreases. The 4050 AC tractor I grew up with was the same as are the vast majority of the tractors I have driven. Why wouldn't the same work for the Jetta motor?

I believe most all of those engines you speak of probably have a built in governor not an external belt drive unit that I was posting about. Most of the small engines that I know of do have a governor. They have a shaft that comes out of the block and attach to a linkage that will adjust the throttle depending on load. This is invisible to the operator of the engine. The throttle cable that the operator sets will not move.

On tractors like your B3300 the governor is in the fuel system and it will certainly have a maximum amount of fuel that it will supply to the engine. The tractor will only increase fuel supply on its own to a point. If the load you apply to the tractor exceeds the available power then it will lug (RPMs will drop as additional work is requested by the operator) and the RPMs will not return to normal until the extra load is removed. Its not to say that there is just a throttle cable that is set and there is no governor.

I suppose if you have an automotive engine that has a good amount of extra power and torque, like you only ever use 60 HP if you max out your hydraulic pumps but you have a 120HP engine. You might be OK, but I suspect that you would still see a significant RPM change with the change in load. Probably at least 500 RPM. If you set the throttle under load obviously make sure that you don't over rev the engine or the hydraulic pumps when there is no load.

Anything is possible and what you speak of could work. It would depend on the application and how tolerant you are in RPM changes.

 

[Wild Bill the 2nd]

I've been trying to find some examples of people using cruise control as a governor.
Here is a thread where someone says they have tried it and it does not react fast enough (without any further details)
Here is a thread where someone says they have used one for years + another person saying that it does not work.

So I would say it definitely has some potential.

 

[muddstopper]

The old cruise controls worked off engine vacuum. As the load on the engine increased, more vacuum is created giving the engine more throttle. This makes engine speed more or less self regulating. One step newer cruise controls used vacuum as well as a electronics to regulate engine speed. Results are probably a little more precise. The really new cruise control systems are all about electronics and cumputers. I dont have a clue as to how they work. If I was going to try to use a crusie control to regulate my engine, I would probably go for something older and much easier to adapt, unless I had the complete electronic set up off the vehicle I was salvaging the engine from. For my processor, I just plan on a throttle lock, rev the engine to the rpm range I want and lock the throttle in place. I ind of figure when I am processing, I will either be at full production or complete stop. The equipment we use at work has been configured that way for over 39 years, which is probably why I cant hear a lick.

 

[triangel]

I tentatively found an engine, stuck however the owner says it was a good running engine and has not been stuck long. assuming this will work v4hd wisconsin. not diesel but the price is free so that is my next project as to how get this engine loose. any suggestions are welcome.

 

[triangel]

I also have a question for all you hydraulic guys, I have seen on several processors the control valves on the splitter they have two. they are both with a kick off on one direction. somehow they hook them up so they pull both valves at the same time and this allows the cylinder to split and retract hands free. If anyone knows how this is done and would like to share it would be appreciated, thanks

 

[triangel]

I have found the valve, it is a Prince valve rd525mmee5a4b1 but very pricey I will keep looking

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

The valve you are talking about is an "auto cycle valve" specifically designed for exactly this purpose. Sure, they cost double that of a standard log splitter valve but pretty hard not to justify the extra $150 on a processor build for the convenience they add. Keep in mind that these types of valve (apparently) have fairly high GPM requirements.

 

[triangel]

I guess that is right however it in the US and with freight and shipping exchange 600 dollars my cost so am trying to find a canadian product of the same

 

[firefighter222]

I found one in the surplus center catalog on page 23. Nice build ,I am gathering parts for one also could you tell me what size off roller chain sprockets you used on your infeed conveyor build and would you have a picture of the finished products .I was to your province a few years ago for forest fires that were there we had a great time and great people there to work with.