Workmaster 33 won't run

   / Workmaster 33 won't run #1  

NTG

Silver Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2016
Messages
140
Location
Roanoke, AL
Tractor
2016 New Holland Workmaster 33
My Workmaster 33 has about 750 hours on it. The other day I went to get something from my shed and it was idling and it just shut off. When I got back over there, I cranked it up and throttled up to move on and it died again. It will not run for me. The "engine problem" light comes on when it dies, but I guess that's about like a "check engine" light because it doesn't tell me much. No AB codes or any other indicators are displayed on the dash. I'm thinking maybe the DPF deal is clogged up. I went and bought a drum of off-road diesel from a Sunoco store the other day. I didn't think to check if it was ultra low sulfur or whatever it is New Holland says to use. I've burned about a half tank now in my tractor and this problem has popped up. Any time I get a drum of diesel, I treat it with that Diesel Kleen that Walmart sells, but since this is the first time I've used this other brand of diesel, I'm wondering if there's something crappy in it that's not burning clean and I've clogged up my DPF. I've ordered a can of DPF Clean from Amazon to try and it'll be here in a couple days, but I don't know if I'll be able to get the tractor to run long enough for this to work even if it will. Any thoughts? The tractor will be 4 years old in September and I've done all the regular servicing according to the manual and haven't had any other problems with it so far. Oh btw, my environment is pretty dusty so I tapped a lot of dirt out of my outer air filter and the inner air filter looks like new. I also cleaned the junk off the screen in front of the radiator. I'm a complete novice, so I don't know where to turn next. Thanks for any help!

Pat
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #2  
Have you changed the fuel filters at all..?
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#3  
Yes, strictly according to the manual. I guess something still could be in there. :) I'll check on that. Thank you!
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #4  
or dirt in the line / fuel tank.
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#5  
Well..... I *guess* I fixed it. :confused: I poured a couple ounces of this stuff in my fuel tank. test.jpeg Before I fired it up, I remembered reading in another thread where someone said check the vent on the gas cap. I figured what the heck, so I took the gas cap off. It has a little liner that comes down in the middle with a hole and then there's a groove in the threads so air comes from underneath. There was some kind of trash completely filling that groove, so maybe it wasn't venting properly. I cleaned out that groove, fired it up and it ran fine the rest of the day. Go figure. :thumbsup: I do think I'm not running it hard enough though to clean out the DPF so I'll use the cleaner I bought when it gets here and I'll run it at a higher rpm. I let it idle a lot and I only run it at 2K rpm unless I'm using the PTO and then I run it where the line is at 2400 rpm for pto devices. I guess I should run it all the time at 2400 and not let it idle so much. Anyway, thanks for the suggestions!
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #6  
Well..... I *guess* I fixed it. :confused: I poured a couple ounces of this stuff in my fuel tank. View attachment 650915 Before I fired it up, I remembered reading in another thread where someone said check the vent on the gas cap. I figured what the heck, so I took the gas cap off. It has a little liner that comes down in the middle with a hole and then there's a groove in the threads so air comes from underneath. There was some kind of trash completely filling that groove, so maybe it wasn't venting properly. I cleaned out that groove, fired it up and it ran fine the rest of the day. Go figure. :thumbsup: I do think I'm not running it hard enough though to clean out the DPF so I'll use the cleaner I bought when it gets here and I'll run it at a higher rpm. I let it idle a lot and I only run it at 2K rpm unless I'm using the PTO and then I run it where the line is at 2400 rpm for pto devices. I guess I should run it all the time at 2400 and not let it idle so much. Anyway, thanks for the suggestions!

Nice to hear your running again.

I have also heard that diesel's with a DPF are better run at a higher rpm = less soot produced?
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #7  
Well..... I *guess* I fixed it. :confused: I poured a couple ounces of this stuff in my fuel tank. View attachment 650915 Before I fired it up, I remembered reading in another thread where someone said check the vent on the gas cap. I figured what the heck, so I took the gas cap off. It has a little liner that comes down in the middle with a hole and then there's a groove in the threads so air comes from underneath. There was some kind of trash completely filling that groove, so maybe it wasn't venting properly. I cleaned out that groove, fired it up and it ran fine the rest of the day. Go figure. :thumbsup: I do think I'm not running it hard enough though to clean out the DPF so I'll use the cleaner I bought when it gets here and I'll run it at a higher rpm. I let it idle a lot and I only run it at 2K rpm unless I'm using the PTO and then I run it where the line is at 2400 rpm for pto devices. I guess I should run it all the time at 2400 and not let it idle so much. Anyway, thanks for the suggestions!

Stanadyne is widely respected...good stuff!
You should consider using it regularly.
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#8  
I was until I started treating the whole drum with the Diesel Kleen. Probably wouldn't hurt to run the Stanadyne through periodically as well.
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#9  
Been meaning to come back and update..... still having problems. :( I ran it that whole day after my last update here and it ran fine with no problems whatsoever. But now it is periodically cutting off on me at various points. Sometimes it just throttles down lower and lower until it dies. Sometimes it'll rev up like it's leaning out maybe with a fuel blockage or something and then it dies. I've tried various things with varying results, none of which apparently are fixing the problem. I guess I have a load up and a trip to a shop somewhere in my future. :( Somehow or another, I missed the maintenance step in my operator's manual that I'm supposed to drain the water in the fuel filter every hundred hours and I have not been doing that. I do have one of those Goldenrod filters on my fuel drum so hopefully that caught any water in there, but I guess does nothing for condensation in the tractor tank. I drained the water out of the tractor filter and thought that fixed it, but nope. Peter 315, thinking maybe my fuel filter was wonky, I went ahead and changed the pre-fuel filter and fuel filter again to make sure that wasn't the problem..... didn't fix it. I haven't drained my tank yet, but I did disconnect the fuel line and let a little bit run out to see if that flushed any trash out..... next time I run out of fuel (not completely, I know not to do that), before I fill up I'll completely drain the tank and see if there's any trash or anything in the bottom. I've got one of those screens in the neck of my tank, but I guess something could have gotten in there somehow. I'll flush the tank out good before I fill it back up. That's exactly how it's acting, like something is blocking the fuel line and it leans out and quits. Sometimes when it's sputtering before it quits, the glow plug light comes on or sometimes flashes on and off making me think I've got some electrical problem, but maybe if the tractor is losing power, those bump on to try to keep it running? I'm not sure how those work, other than their normal purpose of assisting cranking a diesel engine. It's just weird, sometimes it'll work several hours like nothing's wrong and sometimes it's like it's "just not going to play today". The other day i drained the water (I can't really see any difference in what's coming out, so I don't think there's excess water in there, I just let it out for a couple seconds and then close the valve) from the fuel filter and that's when I took the fuel line off the tank and let the tank drain for a couple seconds. It fired up and I worked on one of my roads with my back blade for an hour or two and it ran with no problems. Then it just went to heck. I said I was done, but I did clean the chaff off the screen in front of the radiator (was completely covered, but I had just cleaned it a couple weeks ago) and I tapped out as much dust as I could out of my outer air filter. I'm working in pretty dusty conditions so I need to bring my compressor over there and blow the air filter out from the inside as directed. (Not time to change the outer filter yet, but I will if y'all think that might be it) I know there's a ton of dirt in that filter (inner filter looks clean and brand new) and I might suspect that if it wasn't leaning out before dying most of the time. Lack of air would cause it to richen and just die, right? That being said, it wasn't wanting to run more than a few seconds and I said "screw it I'm done for the day", but it did run for maybe five or ten minutes to get from my front road back to where I park it after I cleaned the screen and outer filter. So next thing I'll do is take my compressor over there and blow that filter out real good. After that, I'll follow whatever anyone has to offer here, I'll ask my neighbor's advise who has a ton of experience with all things tractor and I'll get to googlin' for anything obvious. And if none of that works, I'll load 'er up and get 'er to the shop. I'm just figurin' with my luck it'll either be the DPF unit or something clogging the injectors and I'll be looking at a $2-$3K repair bill. :( Thank y'all for your help!
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #10  
You live in the SE where high humidity abounds. Are you draining your fuel filter and the water separator regularly? Are you finding water in what you drain out? If you are, you probably have a bacterial sludge in your tank. They live in the fuel/water interface. You can't eliminate condensation but you can reduce by trying to keep your tank full of fuel. If you can remove the outlet fitting in you tank, drain the duel out and see if you get a snotty looking substance to come out. Treat your fuel with a good biocide to kill the bacteria and keep treating it. Check the filter head and the separator head itself for debris as well as all the lines from the tank to the IP. If you have a boost pump, make sure that if it has a filter, it's clean. It should supply fuel at 3-5 psi to the IP. you should have full flow from the tank to the boost pump inlet line. If you don't then there is a restriction. Make sure your fuel solenoid is working. It's what shuts down the engine. It's possible for it to intermittently fail. The next time it shuts down, immediately check it by switching the ignition key on and off. You should hear t click open.

I assume you have a common rail fuel system so you have all kinds of sensors feeding info to a computer that's determines when the injectors should open and for how long they stay open. the only way to check that part of the system is using the manufacturer's proprietary software that the dealers should have.
If you go through the fuel delivery system and convince yourself that it is thoroughly clean, then putting it on the dealer's analyzer is the next step.
Good luck!
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #11  
First, change the fuel filter on the tractor and clean the tank. If your tractor has a fuel lift pump, check that too. Also the fuel lift assembly on the tank, maybe it is sucking trash until the screen fills. Once the engine stops, the dirt falls back down... All it takes is to fill the tractor up one time with dirty fuel, and the filter is plugged.
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#12  
I was not draining the fuel filter regularly, but I am now. I don't know what/where the water separator is. One of my biggest problems is I have found practically no information on the internet regarding this tractor and the operator's manual has very little information in it. When I drain the fuel filter, I can't tell if there's any water coming out or not, it all looks the same to me. :( The idea did just occur to me yesterday that it is condensation related or water getting in there somehow as I don't have a shed and the tractor sits outside. After a hard rain, maybe that's when it gives me problems and when I use the tractor after 3 or 4 hot days, maybe that's when it'll run all day for me with no problems because everything is dried up. I don't know that this is the case, but I can't figure out for the life of me how it'll run for hours with no problems and then sometimes won't hardly run at all unless it's moisture related, trash related or an electrical short somewhere. I'll try to go through all this and try all these ideas and I'll find a biocide to put in there. If I can't come up with something quick, I'll have to take it to the dealer because I am swamped with work and it's killing me not having my tractor. Thank y'all for your help!
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#13  
Been meaning to get back in here and update this, but haven't taken the time. Figured I should in case anyone else is having problems. I ended up taking my tractor in to the dealer where I bought it. They kept it for two months and ended up swapping the computer out. I was told they had "2 or 3 more in there doing the same thing" and the NH engineers had been in there trying to figure it out and they weren't having much luck. Personally, I don't buy that. If it was a few months old and a bunch of tractors were doing something, ok maybe it's a mfg defect of software bug or whatever. Four years down the road, all of a sudden 4 tractors are doing the exact same thing and even the NH engineers have never seen this problem? Meh.... Anyway, they swapped out the computer and said it was ready. When I came in, the service manager cheerfully announced that they were covering it under warranty, otherwise the bill would have been $6,100. I told him that was a good thing, otherwise they could keep that sum*****. $6,100 part on a $16,000 tractor brand new. smh I asked him if they could just bypass the computer somehow and he said they couldn't. I also asked him what was the point of having the computer if it couldn't even tell the ENGINEERS WHO DESIGNED THE DANG THING what was wrong with the tractor? He didn't know. So anyway, I take it home and go back to work. First or second time I use the tractor, I'm dragging my driveway and it starts to rain. I keep on going and a few minutes later, the dang thing shuts off on me again. I was not a happy camper. I call the guy up and give him the news and he says they'll come get it. I forget what they did to it that time, but when I talked to him, he said, "It's on you this time. The lights you had connected into the wiring was causing a short." I replied, "No sir. When the problems first started, the first thing I did to diagnose the problem was disconnect those lights and they have not been connected since. When I got ready to connect them back up, I was going to mount an external battery box and wire them into that so they would not interfere with the electrical system in any way." He was like, "OH. Well, we got it running and you shouldn't have any more problems out of it." And I haven't. I've got 1400 hours on it now and haven't had any more problems out of it. They didn't charge me anything for either trip, so I was happy about that.

Now here's my take on it, keeping in mind that this was my first tractor and I know very little about tractor design and engineering. If he was telling the truth about there being 3 other same tractors in there with the same problem, I believe the Workmaster 33 has some type of design flaw that allows an electrical short when something gets wet. I did get a foot throttle switch sensor code that one time on the dash, so maybe that part was bad, I don't remember now if they swapped that out or not. But before, I never had the tractor under cover and I would use it in the rain if it started raining and I was working on something. Now I keep it in a little lean-to I built until I can get my shop built and I never use the tractor in the rain. If memory serves, every time it shut off on me it was raining or had been raining at some point shortly before using the tractor and I think something was just shorting out. That's exactly how it acted, just like you had a kill switch running to ground on a lawn mower or something. Whether they actually fixed something or whether it's me keeping it dry, it has not given me any more problems. They did take care of the situation and it didn't cost me anything other than driving it over there to them the first time and I appreciated that. The service manager seems like a nice fella and always returned calls and handled the situation. He may have been stonewalling me about the situation, but I'm sure he was just telling me what the engineers were telling him and he was somewhat caught in the middle. I repaired computers and worked on computer networks for a long time and I myself have had situations where I had no idea what the heck I did to get something to work other than waving the old magic wand and saying abra cadabra, hocus pocus, and you just kinda had to tell someone something that would pacify them. :)

Not to knock New Holland, but I'd have to think long and hard before I purchased another new tractor from them. Of course, I guess with new tractor designs, they're all probably the same now. But with a 4"x4" circuit board that could fail at any time, is proprietary and I can't replace it myself costing almost 40% of the cost of the ENTIRE TRACTOR, I'd have to pass. My understanding that if the DPF chamber fails, that's 2 or 3 thousand itself. So over half the cost of the tractor really has nothing to do with putting power to the wheels on the ground, other than it's just designed that way. :( That's a shame. So at my neighbor's equipment auction last summer, I bought a Ford 3400 diesel and a Ford 2000 gasser to tinker with. :D They may end up costing me more by far, but MAN I love 'em!

P.S. I did just break the hydraulic steering link on the tractor and I've got to fix that. The snap ring that held in the pin that went through the end of the hydraulic arm and the yoke on the wheel broke or came off, probably going through brush. The pin then worked its way out of the lower half of the yoke and then the upper half of the yoke just couldn't take the twisting pressure and it snapped off. I think I can just fabricate a new piece and weld it on and get 'er going again. Meanwhile I'm using my 3400. It may not be much compared to what some of y'all are driving, but to me that thing is a BEAST! :)
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #14  
Sensors and computers... Tractors from the 1970s wouldn't be running today if they had them
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#15  
Sensors and computers... Tractors from the 1970s wouldn't be running today if they had them

Agreed. I guess it would be illegal to reverse engineer some of these controller boards, but I wish some bright young engineering or computer science student would come out with some type of universal controller board or something that ran on a RaspberryPi that was open source and could replace some of these things. You just feel cheated when your money is extorted from you by a proprietary part that locks you into that company. How about just building something of quality that'll last or at least can be replaced by someone with a phone call. I understand service is where the money is but dang.... Now that the tractor is out of warranty, if I had to replace the computer or the DPF chamber I would try to sell it or part it out and sell it. 3rd option would be to sand as much paint off it as I could to facilitate a quick rusting and park it out by the driveway as "road art". :) Last summer, I bought a Ford 3400 at auction for $6,000. 10% sales tax & 10% buyer's premium put me at $7,200. If I get 2 years out of it, that'd be a $300 monthly payment. Show me where I can get a 46 hp diesel tractor with a loader that's built like a tank for $300/month and I'll jump on that deal. :)
 
   / Workmaster 33 won't run #16  
Agreed. I guess it would be illegal to reverse engineer some of these controller boards, but I wish some bright young engineering or computer science student would come out with some type of universal controller board or something that ran on a RaspberryPi that was open source and could replace some of these things. You just feel cheated when your money is extorted from you by a proprietary part that locks you into that company. How about just building something of quality that'll last or at least can be replaced by someone with a phone call. I understand service is where the money is but dang.... Now that the tractor is out of warranty, if I had to replace the computer or the DPF chamber I would try to sell it or part it out and sell it. 3rd option would be to sand as much paint off it as I could to facilitate a quick rusting and park it out by the driveway as "road art". :) Last summer, I bought a Ford 3400 at auction for $6,000. 10% sales tax & 10% buyer's premium put me at $7,200. If I get 2 years out of it, that'd be a $300 monthly payment. Show me where I can get a 46 hp diesel tractor with a loader that's built like a tank for $300/month and I'll jump on that deal. :)

Yeah, probably can't. The selling point for me to buy a TYM/Branson, was the lack of computers and sensors. It's a mechanical tractor. They are the only ones left. Everything else is CRDI and run by an expensive ECM
 
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   / Workmaster 33 won't run
  • Thread Starter
#17  
Yeah, probably can't. The selling point for me to buy a TYM/Branson, was the lack of computers and sensors. It's a mechanical tractor. They are the only ones left. Everything else is CRDI and run by an expensive ECM
I'll keep that in mind! I think there's a Branson dealer not too far from me.
 

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