You cant call it back!

   / You cant call it back! #41  
Quantity is important for self defense.
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The line of defense should include a very good watchdog inside the home.
 
   / You cant call it back! #42  
We can say inadequate training, insufficient practice, or whatever, but who knows what any of us would do when the target's shooting back.
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Things can get confusing when you're in the fight or flight stage.
 
   / You cant call it back! #43  
penokee,
You are so right. At 51, I've been an NRA member for over half my life. They are a great organization that teaches gun safety, and fights for our 2nd Amendment rights. They think that people should have the right to defend themselves, because the bad guys will always have guns.

Mike

If the government doesn't trust me with my guns, why should I trust them with theirs?
 
   / You cant call it back! #44  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I don't know. It very well may have been his fault. We had 2 officers shot and killed in a gun battle quite a few years ago; both carrying automatics. One of them was sick and they were on their way back to the station for that one to go home sick when they spotted the suspects from a robbery that had just occurred. When the officers got out of their car, the hijackers jumped out of theirs and started shooting. So with the hijackers behind one car and the officers behind another, they exchanged shots until the officers had to reload. Witnesses said the officers reloaded but it appeared that their guns wouldn't shoot when the hijackers walked the around the car and shot both of them. )</font>

This sounds an awful lot like a garbled version of the "Newhall Incident", where two California Highway Patrol officers got killed while trying to reload their revolvers. They had taken the time to carefully put their empty brass neatly into their pockets, just like their STUPID range procedure taught them to do. This incident helped make some change in such stupid training, as it forced people to look at the consequences of ignoring a time proven truth - under stress, we revert to habit.

If your habits are good ones, drilled in drilled in drilled in drilled in drilled in until they REALLY are habits, most likely under stress you will do the right thing. Or so say the professionals (as opposed to the gun store commandos).

That doesn't mean a trip to the range a few times a year.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( In that case, apparently they put new clips)</font>

"Magazine" is the correct term. Clips were used in some early automatics like the Borchardt and the Mauser Broomhandle, but if it is a box-like device that contains ammunition, it's a magazine.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( in their guns, but didn't jack that first round into the chamber. It appeared that in the heat of a gun battle, they simply forgot how to properly use their weapons. So, in that case, we don't think the guns malfunctioned, and of course, one can't help but wonder how they each used a clip of ammo without hitting a suspect, or how they could forget to properly use the weapon. )</font>

Contrary to Hollyweird nonsense and anti-gun propaganda, most cops are NOT well trained. They are not drilled, drilled, drilled. They have a course in the Academy, maybe, and then they qualify once a year, for the most part. It's a budget thing, and often a politics thing. And, according to a lot of folks who are in a position to know, on average about 10% of cops are actually interested in shooting well. Seems strange to me, but it's true. I've heard that from more cops and law enforcement firearms instructors than I can count.

I used to think I knew a lot about guns. After all, I lived, breathed, ate, and slept guns.

Then I took a REAL firearms course. No, not an NRA course - those are great for beginners. I mean a REAL defensive handgun course taught by a nationally recognized heavyweight in the field. It was an amazing eye-opener. I found out how little I knew. Since then I've tried to keep learning.

My first course happened to be from a guy named John Farnam, but there are a number of good schools where you can learn how much you didn't really know. If you are going to keep a gun around for defensive purposes, I highly recommend it.

For those of us on a limited budget, you can get some free education by reading Farnam's Quip's and Quotes.

You might even find out that nobody flies across the room when hit with a .44 mag and there is no such thing as a guaranteed one shot stop with anything that one man can hold and fire, short of an anti-tank missle.
/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
   / You cant call it back! #45  
Be thankful all you gun owners don't live in Assachusette's. You'd all be arrested for having a loaded gun available to defend yourself if your house got broken into. This is what democracy has gotten us here. Your weapons wether loaded or unloaded must be secured under lock and key. I can just see me now telling a burglar this. " Hey buddy, hang on a minute while I get the gun out of my vault so I can shoot you. " Only in Assachusette's, the state that started the revolution, are we held hostage in our own home by peons with no brains that make laws that can kill us. My past police chief once told me that if you are going to shoot someone, shoot to kill. Dead crooks can't sue you. He was gunned down by burglars 10 years ago while giving chase in the woods. One of the burglars hid behind a tree and shot him dead. My choice of self defense is my little S&W Model 642 38 special. I have cookie cutters in it. They are kinda like a hollow point with a much bigger hole in the tip of the bullet. Hence the name "Cookie Cutter". They are nasty and no longer available as far as I know. Second choice is my Remington 1100 slug gun with 00 buckshot. 3rd choice would be my M1 carbine with a 30 round mag. It's small, light and carries a lot of ammo. Enough of this, your all making me wish I lived in Vermont or New Hampshire away from the idiots in society that won't let a law-abiding citizen protect himself.
 
   / You cant call it back! #46  
Several people have mentioned the .44 magnum myth and how what's in the movies is not reality. Another 'myth' that's been mentioned in this thread are posts that display the attitude that anyone who breaks into my house is leaving feet first and not breathing. Those words are as easy to type or say, as it was for Dirty Harry to fire his 'Hollywood' .44.

It's one thing to have armchair debates about the technical attributes of bullets and their stopping capability. It's another thing to be the means by which another human being is ushered into eternity. Something to ponder.
 
   / You cant call it back! #47  
You are absolutely right Mike. It is real easy to sit here and ponder the thoughts of burglars and such. Think about this one a bit. If you hesitate in a situation where deadly force may need to be used to think about what you are about to do. It may be the last thing you ever think about if the intruder is armed.
 
   / You cant call it back! #48  
"Another 'myth' that's been mentioned in this thread are posts that display the attitude that anyone who breaks into my house is leaving feet first and not breathing. Those words are as easy to type or say, as it was for Dirty Harry to fire his 'Hollywood' .44. "

No myth(for me) Mike, I don't think anyone would say it would be easy but the alternative of possibly watching another family member killed or tortured is a worse thought for me.

I pray I am never faced with that choice but also pray I have the courage to defend my family and property when it does come down to it.

The criminals serving life or waiting on death row for 20-40 years at our expense will not make anyone feel better about loosing a loved one.
 
   / You cant call it back! #49  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Be thankful all you gun owners don't live in Assachusette's. You'd all be arrested for having a loaded gun available to defend yourself if your house got broken into. This is what democracy has gotten us here. Your weapons wether loaded or unloaded must be secured under lock and key. )</font>

if it's in your control in your house it can be loaded and does not have to be locked up.

if it in your house and your not home it's supposed to be locked up, which can be done without the use of key's.

as to engaging a threat, you always shoot to stop the threat.
no more no less.
 
   / You cant call it back! #50  
Jim and Jeff, I agree with your comments about hoping to be able to defend your families from bad guys. I just wanted people to consider the aftermath of such an action, even if there aren't legal issues, there could be psychological ones for everyone involved.
 

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