New here - Should I care about written specs?

[Don87]

Truly well said. I have learned a lot in just the few weeks, especially on later thread pages where the topic takes a left turn ... enough to feel stupid asking questions already answered in numerous other threads. I will continue to look at specs but will take butt-in-seat factor into consideration along with dealer reputation/fairness/service.

I don't really care about what class you call a given tractor. My neighbors will not snub me if I get a SCUT compared to their CUT if the SCUT meets my needs. If I have to think a little larger due to shortsightedness and that puts me into a CUT, so be it.

I think you missed my point, or I didn't state it clearly. Your first post was comparing 4 compact tractors to 1 subcompact tractor. While the subcompact tractor is very good(and was the proper tractor for my property), I just wanted you(and others) to understand that there is a big difference between the cut, and subcut.

There was a fella that posted that very thing in here a while back. He didn't understand the difference between the 2 classifications, and was totally confused(to the point of giving up) until the specs were pointed out to him.

The main thing is that you buy what you need, that fits you the best, because it's a very large investment that you should have for a long time to come.

 

[Don87]

This is why I said specs are important.

Sometimes people look at classification and price only, especially when looking at subcuts.
Base tractor only:

John Deere 1026r 12,847

Massey Ferguson about 8,500

Kubota BX about 8,500

Mahindra Max 25 13,000

Just looking at the price of the 'subcompacts' listed, The Mahindra Max is highest price, with the least well known brand name here in the U.S.

But if you go over the specs, one will see that the Mahindra is more powerful, and sits higher allowing the use of full cat1 implements without fear of tearing up the ground as the others will.

While Mahindra has decided to classify thier Max series as subcompacts, the price point is hurting them. Even the 'cream of the crop' John Deere 1026r is cheaper.

Now if you take that same Max series, and compare to the CUT size tractors, the price in question becomes very reasonable, and the specs are more in line with that size also.

Personally, if the Max series would have been available 2 years ago and there was a dealer close by I may have purchased one. I looked at specs before I purchased, one would be surprised as to how many people don't.

Some on here think I'm bashing Mahindra because of 'brand loyalty. That would be incorrect, as the prices I've posted show the differences. And if one actually looks at the specs, the differences can be clearly seen. My only point has been that people need to know what they are looking at.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

Now if you take that same Max series, and compare to the CUT size tractors, the price in question becomes very reasonable, and the specs are more in line with that size also.

Thats because its not a subcompact...? They market it as one because subcompacts are a huge part of the market in which they have no product to sell. I think your making the point that specs are of somewhat limited use and are very often used as a marketing tool. There is value, but your gotta read between the lines.

 

[tkappeler]

Well, we made it to three dealers today. Here are my impressions given the feedback you all have provided and the published specs:

Kioti CK20 - Dealer: He seemed to be knowledgeable, asked questions, explained about service, parts, history, locations, etc. He seemed to be hungry. The dealer is about 20 miles away. Ergonomics: I am 6'1 and my girlfriend is 5'4". She will use it as much as I will. We did not have to make any seat adjustments to switch between each of us. It was very comfortable with easy reach to all controls, especially the FEL controls. The single pedal for forward reverse worked ok for both of us. She preferred this arrangement as compared to side by side and I like side by side better, but can live with this. The throttle seemed a little hard to slide forward/back. Maybe it was overtightened as it was new or will loosen slightly with use. This was only an issue for her. The unit feet great otherwise. The controls worked smoothly. Specs/Use: Of the units that I am listing here, this is about middle of the road in terms of lifting capacity, dimensions, 3PH, etc. We liked that it had position control.

Kioti CS2410: Dealer: same as above. Ergonomics: This felt really nice as well. Definitely smaller in size but still comfortable. No clutch, similar to the Max25. Side by side pedals for forward/reverse. Turning radius was great, power seemed to be really nice. Definitely lower ground clearance but I would expect that from this size. Could be a problem with some 3PH attachments we can envision such as post hole diggers. Specs/Use: This unit was much closer to the BX below. For the $2,000 difference, I would probably go for the CK20 IF Kioti is the final make we choose.

Mahindra Max25 - Dealer: The dealer is really far away as in you almost can't get there from here. The dealer was certainly knowledgeable for the locals but the man we spoke to seemed uncomfortable with our silly questions. He did not offer too much information and it felt like we had to drag it out of him. Ergonomics: This unit required adjustments for each of us to use. The FEL controls felt really awkward to reach that far to use them. She liked the throttle better on this one as it was a horizontal handle that you pull like the old column shifter in cars. The other controls seemed ok. Specs/Use: The unit was clearly the strongest of the bunch and I can see why you all have said to check the specs but compare apples to apples.

Kubota BX2360: Dealer: The dealer was a little closer and certainly easier to get to. He was knowledgeable in explaining the model we directed him to but did not ask too many questions and did not really explain the differences between the B and BX series. Ergonomics: We both felt comfortable in this one without any adjustments. The unit had the smoothest operating controls, especially the FEL. She had some problems with changing from Low to High ... would engage cleanly without nudging the pedals. She preferred the clutch on the Kioti CK20. I can see why people like these so much. Specs/Use: The listed capacities on this are clearly at the low end of the bunch and could be a deal breaker.

Oh ... quoted prices BEFORE haggling:

CK20HST - $13,276
CS2410 - $11,238
Max25 - $14,000
BX2360 - $13,200

Sound reasonable?

I still have a few more to look at. So far, the CK20 is at the top of our list as a good compromise between features, ergonomics, dealer, price.

 

[meburdick]

Sounds like good progress so far...

What other products are you considering? Do you have other Mahindra / Kioti / Kubota dealers to check out for these same models?

FWIW: The Kubota dealer that I tried to work with was happy to put together a quote for a machine that I asked about, but when I asked to know what the next size down was, he got indignant that it wasn't enough machine. When I told him I was looking at a comparable Deere for much less money, he told me that there is no comparison between the Deere (that I ultimately bought) and the Kubota I originally spoke to him about. He couldn't cite any specifics as to why... Just "trust me" logic.

 

[XSKIER]

Tkappeler,

The quote on the CS2410 sounds too cheap. Did it include the FEL? I think once you get near that T273 you'll love it! I can't wait to hear the results!

 

[tkappeler]

Tkappeler,

The quote on the CS2410 sounds too cheap. Did it include the FEL? I think once you get near that T273 you'll love it! I can't wait to hear the results!

Yes it included the FEL. $10,443 for the tractor + $2,295 for the FEL - $1,500 promotion by Kioti. The CK20 was $13,276 with the FEL free.

 

[DK35vince]

Thats because its not a subcompact...?

Then what is the exact definition of a subcut. Where do they start and end vs other cuts?
I see people saying time and time again that the Max is not a subcut, but every time I've asked them to define subcut I have yet to get an answer.

 

[94BULLITT]

When you look at the specs be sure you are comparing apples to apples. For an example most manufacturer show their 3 point hitch ratings @ 24" behind lift point and others just give a number and don't tell if it is at 24'' or at the pivot. The lift capacity at 24'' behind the lift point is a real world number in comparison to at the pivot.

 

[XSKIER]

Yes it included the FEL. $10,443 for the tractor + $2,295 for the FEL - $1,500 promotion by Kioti. The CK20 was $13,276 with the FEL free.

Wow, that is cheap! Now if they bring back the CS3010, they'll really have my attention! The boomer 1030 was the first tractor I really had my heart set on, but it was discontinued. Now with kioti breathing new life into the baby shubiras(?) they could be a serious contender. From what I hear, my local kioti dealer is the best of the best (Michigan iron). Of course my trade in is probably like kryptonite to them