Got Ambushed Last Night and Shot!

[dogtired]

First let me say this , I work up on a Ridge, below me is a valley and a river. When the rains come and come hard every Copperhead that lived down in the valley heads for high ground and me. When this happens I cut them copperheads no slack

I have to watch real close as copperheads generally do not give ground, they just bite.

My poor dogs all have been bitten and I have had many close calls, I suppose it is just a matter of time though. It is nothing to see 5 or 6 a year and to have a dog come up snake bit at least once a year.

When I see them they aren't cut any slack.

That is why I set up the tractor like this

 

[Soundguy]

Hopefully there will be alot of difference in a real self defense situation .. vs those drills.

for instance.. in a real self defense situation.. hopefully there aren't multiple targes running at you, with people shouting and other distractions.. etc.. IE.. a burgler in your home at night.. and you.. etc... mind you.. my situation is optimistic.. and yours is worst case... reality will probably be somewhere in the middle.. according tot he fbi.. most instances where a person could use a sidearm in self defense.. the attacker is already only 10' away.

I have only once ever had to present a weapon in a one on one situation.. and thankfully did not have to fire. I came home and my house was being burglerized.. as i walked up to the house the door flung open and the burgler ran at me.. ( yeah.. 10-15' away.. maybee less.. ) ( big huge guy.. ).. as big as he was though, my little taurus 85 5 shot 38 revolver made him slide to a stop 5' from me, and turn and run the other way till he got to his car parked one house over...

soundguy

I don't think most people not constantly drilled in these situations would be even close to half as good. I have way more than a hundred firearms and have qualified 'expert' for years with a sidearm. I never could make 'distinguished expert' because of my inability to score rapidly with my weak side drills. Anyway, when I tried once to pass a 'stress' situation drill that included proper target choices (hit or don't hit targets) under varying light conditions with people shouting and other noise I failed miserably. For some reason I liked to shoot at any target presented; which is not good, and I also sprayed bullets everywhere.

My son, who has a couple of years training in these drills in the military, performed much better than me in the stress conditions but I can out-shoot him with both sidearms and rifles at the range. I guess I'm too old and my nerves get too rattled to be worth a hoot in a high stress conditions. Because of this fact, I opt to carry a semi auto rather than a six shooter if I'm packing. I figure I would need the extra tries if I ever had to use a sidearm, which I never have fortunately. Hopefully the original poster heals completely and the criminal is removed from society for a long, long time. I personally don't ever want to have to see if I can react properly if literally under fire.

 

[LBrown59]

What would have happened had you not had the 38?

I have only once ever had to present a weapon in a one on one situation.. and thankfully did not have to fire. I came home and my house was being burglerized.. as i walked up to the house the door flung open and the burgler ran at me.. ( yeah.. 10-15' away.. maybee less.. ) ( big huge guy.. ).. as big as he was though, my little taurus 85 5 shot 38 revolver made him slide to a stop 5' from me, and turn and run the other way till he got to his car parked one house over...

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

I'm sure the large fellow would have attacked me hand to hand.. he was a full foot taller, and probably 1.5x my weight.. he was running at me at full charge, like for a 'tackle'. I had no intentions of getting anywhere near his big smokewagons.. his hands were the size of my face... I can just imagine what one of those things would do on contact to my nose.. luckilly he decided my 38spl+P HP's were more formidable than his 22" pythons.. who says all criminals are dumb.. this one knew when to break and run....

soundguy

 

[patrick_g]

Well, like another poster, I have an affinity for an 870 slug gun with buck shot. What does that do to you in court? You can't say you tried to wound the threat for obvious reasons.

UN, I must have missed where anyone indicated a need to shoot to wound.

I did comment on shooting to wound. It is not a reliable plan as you may be a tad off and kill or miss.

Regarding the use of the 870... if that is what you have at hand when the need arises and it is apparent that you did not contrive the situation to make it seem justified to shoot someone with it then what difference could the defense weapon possibly make. You could have had a golf club, butcher knife, samurai sword, scrap of lumber, tire iron or a rock as the available implement of self defense and it is really all the same.

In fear for your life or that of another you did what you could do with the means at hand to stop the attack. Emptying the tube would probably be excessive, especially if the last shots were aimed downward at a corpse. If after you shot center of mass the attack didn't immediately stop you follow up with another center of mass shot, determine if the attack has stopped, lather rinse repeat as needed.

Pat

 

[unreconstructed]

What I was trying to say if that if one is using a scattergun with buck shot in close quarters, one is obviously intending to kill. How that plays out in some jurisdictions, I don't know. In Texas, as I understand the Castle Doctrine, you are in the clear given the firearm is legal (no M79's loaded with a canister round etc) assuming the shooting is justified under our law.

Having trained in simulated combat conditions, I at least know that the best laid plans of mice and men tend to go out the window in a real hurry. My son, who is a combat veteran, tells me that %^(* goes down really really fast. That's why the 870 is my defense firearm of choice. I am nearly 60 with slowing reaction and poor night vision.

 

[shvl73]

no M79's loaded with a canister round etc

I would hope the legal issue is more important than the type of gun. My M11 is legal and will squirt out 32 rounds real fast.

 

[dmccarty]

The reason for the yelling/screaming, noise and lights is because they are distracting and very likely to be found at the type of critical incidents being discussed. The purpose is to teach focus and control. Focus on what needs to be done, filter out what is not needed, try to keep calm in a not calm situation but at the same time not getting tunnel vision and missing the second threat off to your right.

If you heart rate goes over 135 BPM the motor skills needed to shoot accurately start to go bye bye. As your heart rate starts to red line you fine motor skills get bad very quickly. Hearing shuts down. Time slows down. You do get tunnel vision and will only focus on the threat to your front. That could be fatal if there is a threat that is not to your front.

How to avoid this? Drills that cause stress. Drills in low light/no light. Drills that require movement. Drills that require thought and split second decisions. Shoot/dont shoot drills. Shooting at paper is shooting at paper. It teaches marksmanship. It does not teach shooting and moving while under stress. Shooting paper does not teach combat skills.

People have mentioned that you shoot, evaluate and if required, shoot again. What is missing from that statement is that part of "evaluate" is to scan the area. Ye head better be on a swivel otherwise Ye might miss the threat walking up to you with a baseball bat. And Ye head is going to be the baseball.

Want to have some fun, try to say "Drop the weapon" and shoot at the same time. Can't do it. You can do one. You can do the other. But I bet you can't do both at the same time.

If one has the space one can jog/run to get the heart rate up, setup multiple targets at various distances, and set a time limits on the drill. Time limits will help drive up stress. You dont need an instructor to yell out you, have the wife do it. Helps you. Helps her. Just don't shoot yourself. Or her.

I don't suggest you give the thing that goes bang bang to wife and then yell at her. She might not understand its a drill and she might start drilling.

Later,
Dan

 

[pennwalk]

I hope if people intend to use deadly force for self defense that they know the law of their state. It would be a real shame to go to jail for protecting yourself or your family. Also for people who don't want to use deadly force there are non lethal defensive weapons which while not perfect can be very effective like pepper spray and tazer. You need to know the laws for the use of these too.

Chris

 

[firemanpat2910]

I would love to visit Holland. The people I met from Holland seemed very friendly.
But here in the good ol' USA we have our share of criminals, and even worse, our share of those who are more concerned with the criminals' rights than the victims rights. I live in a state that allows law abiding citizens to carry a concealed weapon and allows the death penalty for those scumbags that deserve it (we proudly fried Ted Bundy). I doubt I will get much argument from fellow Americans on this Tractor thread.

its a shame we had to wait over 10 years to do it.
I remember the bumper stickers when Fla made seat belt useage mandatory, " I will buckle up when bundy does"