Best Home Defense Rifle?

[Soundguy]

I agree... A high powered rifle would be my absolute last choice for home defense. That said.. if I'm ever cleaning my 30-06 some day and the local drug lord comes in.. and my only chance for survival is shooting him with the deer gun or me dieing.. I'll take the best.. safest shot ( to others ) I can get. And yes i agrree.. the reason you don't use a rifle is due to the possibility for over penetration.. that's why i even like a shotgun vs a pistol. It's the size of the individual projectiles.. with the .38 being larger than a buck pellet... IE.. more chances for something to stop the buck pellets before they do damage to something other than the target.

As for the comment about shooting blindly into the dark.. yeah.. that one scared the bajeebers out of me too.

know your targets and your backdrop.. first rule of shooting.

soundguy

Well, you know I'm afraid of guns...in the hands of Rambo wannabe people. Some of the wild ideas explained here right out of the movies are rather scary. Their unreasonable concerns of being attacked in their homes by a squad of enemy combatants would be laughable if it weren't for the fact that their advice is likely to get themselves or a loved one killed. Most of these people would honestly be far better served using a light like this The Torch Flashlight? The World's Brightest Flashlight from Wicked Lasers before ever considering the use of deadly force. At least that way there would be no doubt of who/what is in your home. Then, the idea of using a high powered rifle for home protection is absolutely insane. Some of the suggested firearms would not only kill someone in the next room, but several rooms away or even in the house next door.

If you pull the trigger at an intruder it is imperative that you consider what is behind the intruder. Again, most high powered rifles would pass right through the intruder, through the wall behind them, and be very capable of killing your wife, child, etc. in any room behind where the intruder is. Low power hollow point .45ACP cartridges are great for a pistol and and 12 gauge shot from #2 to #6 are better suited for home defense. A blast from a short, say 18 1/2", barrel shotgun spreads fast and would make a big hole in a gypsum board wall, but would be highly unlikely to seriously injure someone on the other side of that wall, thus greatly reducing the chance of killing or seriously injuring someone you did not intend to shoot.

I've been through several courses that train for the possibility of a home intruder. Not one single instructor advised using any high power rifle unless you just happen to live in a war zone where your intent is to kill everyone in the home. You don't even need a 12 gauge shotgun if you are not comfortable with one. A 16 or 20 gauge will work just fine. Heck, it was in one of those classes that I learned that the "gauge" of a shotgun is determined by how many lead spheres with a total weight of one pound would fit in the bore. In the example of a 12 gauge, 12 of these spheres would fit in the bore. A 410 shotgun would be an exception. It is measured by the size of the bore. Here, I found an online explanation here Shotgun shell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Anyway, in the case of a home intruder your response should to be to eliminate the threat. In many cases the extremely bright flashlight I mentioned earlier would at the minimum blind the intruder and allow you to ascertain if the 'intruder' is indeed an intruder and a real threat. In most cases you also just bought yourself 15 seconds or more to decide your next move as your 'intruder' is blinded and disoriented. If you see it is an intruder with a firearm in your home, a blast at that close range with #2 shot will most certainly ruin his day. A slug or 000 buckshot would do the same but also possibly not stop at your intruder. A high power rifle would definitely have a real possibility of passing through the 'bad guy' and pass through walls to who knows where.

In the horrible event you are forced to use deadly force in your home, I don't believe anyone here can honestly say that they couldn't care less about their fire continuing on into other rooms and possibly pass on into a neighbor's home. There is no sense making a very bad situation into a complete tragedy. As I was told (several times), be safe, but be careful and be smart.

 

[JB4310]

All good points in Dave's post #46, I agree the hand gun is the greatest equalizer for most situations.
The only thing I disagree with is the idea that you can carry a gun everyday with out the kids knowing about it. which may or may not be a problem, in a rural area I think that would be fine as I believe the kids are a little more accustomed to that, but for me in a suburban setting it gets a little sticky when little Jimmy tells little bobby daddy carries a gun, then little bobby's mom calls to find out if it's safe to let her child play with your child etc etc. Don't ask.

Anyway that doesn't seem to be Dennis's problem, as to the orig ? I think the best choice would be an AR 15 or clone of one. definitely the most versatile with all the different configurations, light weight for the amount of fire power/capacity, ammo is most plentiful. Not the cheapest solution but it's a weapon that's designed for exactly what (I think) your looking for.

Since we're not talking close in, I would go for a full size H-bar with a good scope system, Curtis bi-pod, a bunch of 30 rd mags w/military pouches and A.L.I.C.E belt and suspenders.
Ya you will look like Rambo but you'll have a complete ready to go package if needed, hopefully it'll just stay hung up in your closet and never be used, just like an insurance policy. The rifle could still be used to get game.

Just don't meet those strangers turning around on your property with this "package" like you said you do with the shotgun, or you might turn your place into another Ruby Ridge. Besides you want to maintain the element of surprise.

JB.

 

[Soundguy]

Ok.. I think I missed something.. what's a 'black gun'.. If it referes to something in a previous post.. i missed it??

soundguy

2. I would not want a semi or a black gun or an AK etc. etc. except maybe as a last ditch. The reason really ties back to the answer above. When your adreneline is up and rushing, you will go through bullets at an incredible rate. Everyone want's to portray themselves as calm and cool when the crap is coming down, but the reality is that most folks, even the best in the world, tend to fire LOTS of ammo in a fire fight. I don't think many of us here on this board do the practice and training that many of the guys that we picture and think of in these scenarios do all the time. I think with a black gun you may find yourself with a stick in the first 3 minutes of a fight. Might be all you need, but it may go 4 minutes, and bringing a stick to a gunfight is no fun.

3. I would like to have a black gun too the side if the situation gets dire, but from the $ comments made etc. I doubt a black gun and the ammo to feed it and the ammo to practice with it are really in range. It is what I would grab second.

4.I have the cheery thought that fortunately for me, my next door neighbor, whom I do nothing with, but he is in the employ of someone that has sticks that reach WAY out there While we may not be aquaintances, we share a common interest in preservation and I think his stuff will reach a lot farther then mine will

Good luck with your decision. Let us all hope that none of these things ever come to pass.

Edit, while yes, he said "home defense" and most folks seem to take that in the context of being "in the home" I took it too be more of "homestead" or "property area" which is why he posted about the fields, animals etc. If I read incorrectly, my apologies. (and I am in the Shotgun/ pistol crowd)

Also, if you do not get the Pat Frank obtuse reference, look for the book Alas Babylon written where I grew up, still interesting reading today.

Got thinking about it a bit more, and wanted to add this thought as well on ammunition consumption.

Go play paint ball. Play serious, count how many balls you shoot. Limit yourself to X number. While it is not realistic in some ways, the ranges are a lot less and that would probably be where I would want a semi anyway, I think you will be amazed at how fast those balls disappear. I think my kid went through 1000 balls Sunday.

 

[JB4310]

It's kind of a newer phrase referring to military type assault riffles, that have all kinds of add on accessories. AR's, HK's etc.

Edit; for the obvious reason, they're all black no wood grain, stainless. just polymers and parkerizing.

 

[Chuck52]

Burt Gummer

Chuck

 

[schmism]

I would add a couple thoughts.

1. I think the most important thing in that scenario would be Ammo more then rifle.

this is why i primarily talked about the ammo choice before what gun it went into.

 

[litework]

Anyway, in the case of a home intruder your response should to be to eliminate the threat. In many cases the extremely bright flashlight I mentioned earlier would at the minimum blind the intruder and allow you to ascertain if the 'intruder' is indeed an intruder and a real threat. In most cases you also just bought yourself 15 seconds or more to decide your next move as your 'intruder' is blinded and disoriented. If you see it is an intruder with a firearm in your home, a blast at that close range with #2 shot will most certainly ruin his day.

That's if you are lucky enough to shine the light into their eyes. If you don't, you've alerted the intruder to your exact location while losing your own night vision. You won't gain 15 seconds if the person is armed either. If you have blinded an armed and angry intruder, expect a flurry of bullets to come your way. The aim might not be deliberate and the action desperate, but they could be lucky too. The defensive properties of a flashlight are grossly overstated. It is a complimentary tool at best.

 

[Dargo]

That's if you are lucky enough to shine the light into their eyes. If you don't, you've alerted the intruder to your exact location while losing your own night vision. You won't gain 15 seconds if the person is armed either. If you have blinded an armed and angry intruder, expect a flurry of bullets to come your way. The aim might not be deliberate and the action desperate, but they could be lucky too. The defensive properties of a flashlight are grossly overstated. It is a complimentary tool at best.

Yes, but that is a chance I'm willing to take 100% of the time as opposed to possibly shooting my wife, one of my kids, one of my kid's friends etc. Fortunately, I do not live alone in a war zone. If I did, I may not be so positively adamant about knowing exactly what is in the sights of my firearm. Making a positive identification of your target has been one consistent theme in the few courses I've taken for personal and home defense. What you consider a "complimentary tool at best" is considered an absolute mandatory requirement as I've been trained.

 

[AlanB]

Ok.. I think I missed something.. what's a 'black gun'.. If it referes to something in a previous post.. i missed it??

soundguy

As JB4310 says

I am not competent to go into the discussion of an Ar, vs, M, vs, so and so and so, even though I have probably used more then most here.

Kind of a Pick your flavor, Podunk I think, has an avatar with 3 black guns in it. From my standpoint, in this discussion, that is narrow enough of a definition and did not want to go further.

 

[Doc_Bob]

For most home defense a rifle is silly and a shotgun is perfect.

Most rifle projectiles can travel miles. The intruder may not get hit by a rifle round, but the person you did not see downrange may get hit. If you cannot see past your target, don't shoot.

Shotgun is nice and if you miss, the range is very limited (the kill range).

Bob