Backhoe Design Ideas

[dfkrug]

Why do you say the slight restriction is desirable? Is it just a speed issue?

It dampens the jerkiness you will get as a valve is quickly opened and
closed. Another way to achieve this dampening effect is to install
restriction orifices somewhere between the valve work port and the
cyl. I remember that my JD leader had them from the factory. You
only want damping in the work circuits.

 

[dfkrug]

Thanks for raining on my parade. But, seriously, that's the kind of advice I want to hear now vs. after I'm half way through the build.

So, let me ask you this... Did you ream before and after, or just after? I guess what I really want to know is if having the machine shop do the reaming will make the hand reaming I have to do after welding easier.

I have experimented with tightly fitting male-female self-aligning frame
elements and it is very tough to wiggle around a 1000+ lb hoe to get
them together (or apart).

As for reaming, first choose your pin/bushing strategy. 1.000" DOM bushings
will be too small for 1.00" pins. You will have to oversize your bushings or
use undersize pins (25mm or 63/64"). If you go with the latter, any reaming
is only after you weld. I sold my reamer from that project and since then
I have done dozens of bushings. I am much better at heat managment now,
so I have not had to ream at all. I talk about that in my 4-in-1 bkt project.
I just cut out and welded in new bushings yesterday on my pallet fork
frame, and they did not distort at all.

 

[dfkrug]

There is a reason you do not see tight-fitting self-aligning mounts like what
you describe. You are asking too much of your mount when it is constraining
in all dimensions. Alignment will have to be perfect before the mating parts
will slide together. With a 4-pt mount, the lower pin/saddle alignment
provides alignment in only 2 dimensions (up/down & left-right), leaving the
rotation angle to be constrained by the top 2 pins. My suggestion is to
go to a tractor dealer and study a commercial TLB, or at least one of the
very modern 4-pt setups.

This whole concept of self-alignment deserves more attention, IMO. In
my previous post, I meant to say the lower part of the 4-pt frame
constrains the hoe from left to right as it gets mounted. but the up/down
movement is constrained downward only. If you fabricate a couple of "ears"
on the lower subframe mount, the action of moving the hoe closer and closer
will be self-aligning as the hoe hits the "ears" and constrains left-right
movement. Hard to describe, but it makes sense when you see it. ANYTHING
you can do to allow the hoe to self-align while mounting will be a Good
Thing. You will appreciate that if you ever have to spend the hours JOEL
is talking about trying to get a difficult-to-mount hoe on the tractor. BTDT

 

[charlz]

This whole concept of self-alignment deserves more attention, IMO. In
my previous post, I meant to say the lower part of the 4-pt frame
constrains the hoe from left to right as it gets mounted. but the up/down
movement is constrained downward only. If you fabricate a couple of "ears"
on the lower subframe mount, the action of moving the hoe closer and closer
will be self-aligning as the hoe hits the "ears" and constrains left-right
movement. Hard to describe, but it makes sense when you see it.

I believe you can see this in my pic here of the rear hoe brackets. The slots are for a cross-bar on the hoe, aligns it up/down and front/rear. The 'ear' sticking out of the side just fits between the rails that run forward to the loader cross member. This aligns left to right. Once I have the pump attached and the cross bar sitting in those notches it is a matter of using the swing and crowd on the hoe to get the front bolts (on the arms that run forward to the loader cross member) to align. Some days it works like cake and other days it can be a pain. The initial alignment of the tractor when backing up to the hoe is the tricky part.

On the Kubotabooks.com site there are several Kubota backhoe parts manuals that might give you some design ideas.

 

[Renze]

It dampens the jerkiness you will get as a valve is quickly opened and closed.

i've never heard of restrictions in work lines to get smooth controls.. The official solution is to change the valves for ones with slots in the edges, so they cheat some oil before they fully open... You can also grind them yourself, we've done that on payloaders that needed more precise tilt control when used with a 20 meter hoist boom on the quicktach.

A more efficient way to decrease jekiness is to reduce the speed by decreasing engine rpm, instead of wasting power by restrictions.

 

[philbuilt]

Iplay,
I thought I would post the link to my subframe fab. I had allot of the same concerns and mybe it would give you som ideas. This link started as a repair of my woods loader frame. I hope it helps.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/customization/95563-woods-1012-fel-mount-problem.html

Phil

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Iplay,
I thought I would post the link to my subframe fab. I had allot of the same concerns and mybe it would give you som ideas. This link started as a repair of my woods loader frame. I hope it helps.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/customization/95563-woods-1012-fel-mount-problem.html

Phil

Wow!! Excellent fabrication skills. Thanks for that post. I've got your subframe all figured out, but I'm not sure how your backhoe attaches to your subframe. It almost looks like you have a second subframe that interconnects with the subframe that stays on the tractor.

I'd love to see a picture of the tractor and then a picture of the backhoe when they are not attached to each other. That may help me figure it out a little better.

With so many testimonials and convincing arguments against my first draft attempt at a quick connect, I've changed my mind. I need to get into the details of it more, but I'm going to re-visit the connection mechanism to get something more workable.

Thank you to all for the input. This is a HUGE help.

 

[philbuilt]

Iplay,
I did make a separate frame that goes under the tractor and slips onto the pins that you see at the mid point. Then I put the riggers down and pin the back. Also note the hitch bar goes though as well.
I went looking to see if I had some more pictures and I have found a few. They were posted before but I can't remember where.
,,

,,.
I added the last few to show some of the uses.
The rock was heavy and it pulled it out without trouble. I thought that you would like to see the trailor attached. This has worked very nice. I did lower the hitch some for easer loading. With the offset I can dig and load without unhooking.
Phil

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Iplay,
I did make a separate frame that goes under the tractor and slips onto the pins that you see at the mid point. Then I put the riggers down and pin the back. Also note the hitch bar goes though as well.
I went looking to see if I had some more pictures and I have found a few. They were posted before but I can't remember where.
View attachment 123625,View attachment 123626,View attachment 123627

View attachment 123628,View attachment 123629,View attachment 123630.
I added the last few to show some of the uses.
The rock was heavy and it pulled it out without trouble. I thought that you would like to see the trailor attached. This has worked very nice. I did lower the hitch some for easer loading. With the offset I can dig and load without unhooking.
Phil

Holy Cow, Phil!! That's a big rock!

Thank you very much for those pics. That's a big help.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

For about a 100 I bought a pump from surplus, used a coupler to couple to my PTO shaft and then welded up a bracket for it to line up with the PTO shaft and keep the pump from spinning. Never a problem in approximately 3 years of use. No need for a dedicated PTO pump, those things are big money.

Joel

Can you give me more details on what you did? Did you hook up to the rear or the mid PTO? I've been looking on Surplus Center's website. I can see pumps that I think would work, but I haven't found anything to adapt from the PTO to the pump. My mid PTO is a 1 inch 15 spline. My rear PTO is a standard 540 PTO.

There's this that matches the PTO output shaft, but the other end doesn't match any of the pumps that I've found in the price range on thier website.