450' wiring conduit -how to assemble?

[tommu56]

It sounds like most of you guys are putting romex in the conduit I usualy use stranded tw ot thhn has a nylon jacket that with a little pulling lube is slipperer than snot
With the correvt size conduit or then next size over(which I prefer) it should pull right in
The problem with gluing pipe together with the wire allready in it is it can attack th insulation and or glue insulation to conduit

Another thing that makes pulling easier if you can pull in too the bell's on the condits and combing the wires out so they don't tangle oin the way in or pull right off indvigual spools.

lhfarm
Can the power company put a transformer close to the meter and run high voltage to transformer then just a short run ( 50 ft) to the service form the trasformer?

The high voltage wire can be direct burial and smaller hence some times cheeper.

tom

 

[lhfarm]

The power company will be out this week to do an assessment. The gentleman I spoke to said that it would be possible to extend the lines and put in a transformer, but that would be overkill for my needs. He said without seeing the setup, his best guess would be a replacement meter base with an extra set of lugs and a 200amp shutoff at the garage. He also suggested a 200amp service panel, even though that would be overkill for the run and my requirements in the barn. I suspect that is so the panel will accept 4/0.

The layout is such that from the garage wall, I need to come out a couple of feet and turn 90 degrees. Then a 20' run to the edge of the field, then another 90 degree turn. It is a straight shoot from there to the side of the pole barn.

My BH skills are such that I'll need to go slowly to maintain a depth. I've dig one 100 foot trench for for a drain pipe, so I know that I can do it, but that it will also take some time. Since the trench will mostly be at the edge of an old hay field, I am not too worried if it I have to leave the trench open over a couple of weekends.

From reading here, I think I may purchase the conduit and lay it out where I want my trench. It will be extra work/walking but I can use the exercise! I'll use the conduit to get a more exact measurement for the amount of cable and I'll paint a line along side as a digging guide.

I'm thinking the glue as I go approach is probably best for me. I am assuming I will get the conduit on the wire for the 400+ straight section, then do the turn and section to the garage.

Where do I locate the expansion joints? Where the cable exits the ground at the garage and barn? If I drop an extra conduit for phone/cable in the trench, how much seperation should I use?

Thanks,

 

[tommu56]

I'm not sure what you mean about expansion joints they are usually used above ground on long runs were the sun hits the conduit and makes it expand. Under ground there is not much tempature swing to cause this expansion.

As for the run up to meter socket I suggest a inveted L shape 5 feet left or right then a sweep down then the riser that way if pipe settels pipe will move but not pull box off wall like if you drop straight out of it.

I've repaired nomerous ones put in incorrectly were the pipe was pulling out of the box or pulling the box off the wall.

If you want to drop straight down then you have to make sure pipe is on solid dirt at the bottom of the sweep and tamp the dirt good before the pipe is put in and in 6" lifts back to grade.

tom

 

[PILOON]

There also exists a lubricant based on silicone (Ideal brand name) that makes pulling much easier to do.
I have pulled 300+ ft of heated tracing wire in 1 inch well line with ease using this method.
Being specifically made for the purpose it will not attack electrical insulation while grease might.
Electrical wholesalers would stock this item. (1 qt = about $7-8 cdn)

 

[EddieWalker]

What expansion joints? Why would the pipe expand?

There is glue designed for gray electrical conduit. I know some people say that the glue will destroy or harm the outer liner of the wire, and that may or may not be true, but that' water pipe glue that they are talking about . Not conduit glue.

Keep it simple, take your time and just slide the conduit over the wire one at a time. Once you get the hang of it, you'll be done in no time. It's just like anything else, repetition until it's over with.

Eddie

 

[studor]

When I ran power to my outbuilding I found out our local code calls for waterproof cable in conduit, 3 feet down on a bed of sand with a warning tape over the top of it -- seems a bit of over kill but
Because i was having a deck built beside the house I had them run conduit in a trench under the deck (with a rope in it) for about 35 feet. Then after the deck was built I ran wire from the panel through the conduit by pulling it with the atv winch with plenty of lubrication. Then for the remaining 100' I slid the pipes over the wire and glued in the trench. If I had of been thinking I would have run a smaller conduit for phone (or just a couple of lines even)
With that much heavy cable I would do the slide and glue routine which will take some time but will not damage the insulation and will make sure the wire goes through -- JMHO
regards

 

[JB4310]

IMO there's no way your gonna pull 4/0 thru 2" conduit with 2 90's not counting the x distance to the barn.

You would have to do the glue as you go thing, which means you would never be able to replace the wire in the conduit if the need ever arose.

As far as an expansion joint, I don't know if one is required underground after some certain distance, but at the riser out of the ground at the meter box or entrance there needs to be an overlapping slip joint to allow for vertical movement.

You don't need any separation in the conduit for phone or cable, but shouldn't put water or gas lines in the same trench.
You should run the marker tape 12 inches above the conduit as a warning to future excavators and to aid in marking out the path the service takes.

JB.

 

[CurlyDave]

When I ran power to my outbuilding I found out our local code calls for waterproof cable in conduit, 3 feet down on a bed of sand with a warning tape over the top of it -- seems a bit of over kill...

It isn't overkill at all. With most underground conduit, the ends point up. If you think about it this is just a u-shaped piece of pipe, with a very long bottom.

Any of the underground conduit I have looked at after a few years in the ground has water in it somewhere. Even if rain is excluded from the ends, condensation will allow water to get in there.

 

[lhfarm]

What expansion joints? Why would the pipe expand?

There is glue designed for gray electrical conduit. I know some people say that the glue will destroy or harm the outer liner of the wire, and that may or may not be true, but that' water pipe glue that they are talking about . Not conduit glue.

Keep it simple, take your time and just slide the conduit over the wire one at a time. Once you get the hang of it, you'll be done in no time. It's just like anything else, repetition until it's over with.

Eddie

I meant slip joint - I think. We have lots of freezing/thawing and ground movement.

Thanks,

 

[SPIKER]

I would do like someone else said buy TYPE "USE" (Under Ground Service Entrance cable) which is rated for direct burial ( did this with my cable I ran to the barn. 1/3 the distance. I decided to put in field tile non-perforated. water is not a major concern wanted to prevent rock damage since it is rated for harsh burial anyhow I figured the tile would help protect it. buried about 4' down. used conduit and end caps for the turn up the conduit is 2.5" heavy wall exterior rated electrical gray type. used end caps on the tile and cut hole large enough to slip fit the conduit and used threaded bushing on each end into the cap glued up to prevent slippage. pulled it in flat on ground like others said then drug wire around the bends and dropped into pre-dug trench. has held up well 7+ years...

Mark