Emergency Generator

[dcyrilc]

:thumbsup: Lots of excellent info guys! I'm going to weight the various alternatives and perhaps soon the days of octopus extension cords will be over.

Whether you do a whole house setup or just a generator sub panel, it's definately the way to go.:thumbsup:

I will comment though that if you go with a whole house setup, spend the few extra dollars and get an automatic transfer switch.

In your case thuogh rekees, since you already have a generator, a generator sub panel will be much cheaper.

 

[rekees4300]

In your case thuogh rekees, since you already have a generator, a generator sub panel will be much cheaper.

That GenerLink alternative seems like a elegant solution. Sent an email to them asking for price. Also needs to be installed by the power company so that's another issue. They may not even allow their meters to be modified?

 

[Johndeere3720]

Whether you do a whole house setup or just a generator sub panel, it's definately the way to go.:thumbsup:

I will comment though that if you go with a whole house setup, spend the few extra dollars and get an automatic transfer switch.

In your case thuogh rekees, since you already have a generator, a generator sub panel will be much cheaper.

Cyril, have you got your generator hooked up?

On another note, It is interesting i found this thread on the HoneyWell generator because this last weekend my neighbor was talking to me about them and how he was considering one since they were so reasonably priced. I wish we had a generator, when the snows hit hard, we can loose power for up to 2 weeks.

 

[dcyrilc]

That GenerLink alternative seems like a elegant solution. Sent an email to them asking for price. Also needs to be installed by the power company so that's another issue. They may not even allow their meters to be modified?

The meter does not get modified. The GenerLink installs between the meter and the meter panel. The meter needs to be pulled (removed) to install the GenerLink and then reinstalled after the GenerLink is installed. That's why the power company needs to be involved. If you have a 200 amp or less service and your power company uses 4 jaw meters, you should be able to use the GenerLink. I would recommend using an electrician for installation as the neutral and ground need to be connected inside the meter panel and that requires working within a few inches of the hot UNFUSED lugs in the meter panel. These lugs are connected directly to the power transformer with no means of power disconnect.

 

[dcyrilc]

Cyril, have you got your generator hooked up? (

Not yet. The only thing left is to connect up the natural gas for fuel and install the battery for the auto start. I've got to get the concrete poared in the barn this weekend (weather permitting), then I can go back to working on the generator.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

I find my most useful generator is a little 1000/1200w 2-cycle that I paid $149 for. It will run 4.5 hours under full load on one gallon of mixed gas. It will run a refrigerator, or the satellite dish, TV and a computer, and is very well muffled so the noise isn't objectionable.

I have a 4400/5000 watt no-name that will run the well pump or water heater for showers. Heat a tank of water, switch over to the pump and shower. It runs about an hour on a gallon of gas.

With wood heat and low pressure gravity feed water, I don't even bother to get a generator out until the second day of the outage.

 

[Chilly807]

The meter does not get modified. The GenerLink installs between the meter and the meter panel. The meter needs to be pulled (removed) to install the GenerLink and then reinstalled after the GenerLink is installed. That's why the power company needs to be involved. If you have a 200 amp or less service and your power company uses 4 jaw meters, you should be able to use the GenerLink. I would recommend using an electrician for installation as the neutral and ground need to be connected inside the meter panel and that requires working within a few inches of the hot UNFUSED lugs in the meter panel. These lugs are connected directly to the power transformer with no means of power disconnect.

The ones we have installed here require an electrical disconnect (via power company) during the install process. They remove their meter from the base, the electrician installs the Generlink on the old meter base, then the power company re-installs their meter on top of the Generlink.

As I recall, the total cost is about the same for either putting in the Generlink or installing the sub-panel. We have the sub-panel, the Generlink wasn't readily available when we built the house.

Sean

 

[techman]

A far cheaper "transfer switch" is from these guys:
Generator InterLock Kit
This is a UL approved add-on that lets you use your existing panel and breakers. By adding a breaker for the genset feed, this kit will interlock it with the main breaker and meet safety requirements.

It is low cost and enables a full house feed. I used their idea and made my own. Works great.

Paul

 

[rekees4300]

The meter does not get modified. The GenerLink installs between the meter and the meter panel. The meter needs to be pulled (removed) to install the GenerLink and then reinstalled after the GenerLink is installed. That's why the power company needs to be involved. If you have a 200 amp or less service and your power company uses 4 jaw meters, you should be able to use the GenerLink. I would recommend using an electrician for installation as the neutral and ground need to be connected inside the meter panel and that requires working within a few inches of the hot UNFUSED lugs in the meter panel. These lugs are connected directly to the power transformer with no means of power disconnect.

Below is the reply I got asking for the price so I emailed the power company's URL to them. No way I'd ever consider doing the meter install myself.

"Thank you for your interest in the GenerLink Automatic Transfer Switch. I
will be happy to assist you with price and availability of the GenerLink,
but I will first need to name of your electric provider to verify their
guidelines."

Update: the cost ranges from $ 550.00 to $ 725.00, plus freight from GA.

 

[dmccarty]

We have something similar to what Techman posted. Cost to install including parts and labor was around $350 give or take a few dollars. We have a "switch" that allows us to be connected to the grid or to the generator. Power is supplied view a 30 amp plug from the generator.

When we built the house we had a panel installed so we could have a generator connection. Once I figure out how much power the generator would supply, this took three years , the electrician did the install.

We have to manage which circuits are alive in the house but that is easy enough. Its cheap and somewhat simple. :laughing:

Later,
Dan

 

[BobOB]

I purchased the Honda 750 at Costco two years ago and absolutely love it. I've only charged the battery one time when I first purchased it, and run it about once a month for 20 minutes. It is very quiet considering the size of the motor, will run 7 hours on a tank of fuel, and starts on the first turn of the key, or if you pull start it, it will start usually on the second pull. I purchased a sub panel for the generator at Home Depot, and had an electrician install it and set up the breakers for about $100.

Costco will stand behind anything you buy, but if you have a choice on generators, you can't beat a Honda motor.

 

[Chilly807]

It's also possible to feed your house by "back-feeding" through your dryer, stove, or welder receptacle, but I wouldn't recommend it. There are two serious pitfalls to this approach, one is that you have to ensure the main power breaker is OFF before you connect the generator. It doesn't sound hard to remember, but it happens. A set-up like techman posted eliminates that possibility.

The second pitfall, and one that is potentially lethal, is that unless you completely disconnect the power feed from the utility to the main panel, it's possible under the right conditions to feed power back through the ground wire to the grid. Step that up through a transformer on the pole outside your house, and it gets really nasty. A repairman on a pole two blocks away can get a fatal shock from your generator.

With most main breakers on distribution panels, opening the breaker only opens the two "hot" leads, and does nothing with the ground wire. What the specific conditions are for this to happen, I can't say for sure, but I've been told that by people that work around this stuff for a living. I believe them.

The commercially available generator sub-panels and the Generlink break all three wires entering your house, two of those being live 110v to provide 220v service, the third being the ground wire to prevent that possibility.

Sean

 

[MossRoad]

It's also possible to feed your house by "back-feeding" through your dryer, stove, or welder receptacle, but I wouldn't recommend it. There are two serious pitfalls to this approach, one is that you have to ensure the main power breaker is OFF before you connect the generator. It doesn't sound hard to remember, but it happens. A set-up like techman posted eliminates that possibility.

The second pitfall, and one that is potentially lethal, is that unless you completely disconnect the power feed from the utility to the main panel, it's possible under the right conditions to feed power back through the ground wire to the grid. Step that up through a transformer on the pole outside your house, and it gets really nasty. A repairman on a pole two blocks away can get a fatal shock from your generator.

With most main breakers on distribution panels, opening the breaker only opens the two "hot" leads, and does nothing with the ground wire. What the specific conditions are for this to happen, I can't say for sure, but I've been told that by people that work around this stuff for a living. I believe them.

The commercially available generator sub-panels and the Generlink break all three wires entering your house, two of those being live 110v to provide 220v service, the third being the ground wire to prevent that possibility.

Sean

I may be totally mistaken, but I do not think there is a ground wire coming in to a house from the power company. The way I understand it is there are two 110 hot leads and one neutral lead.

Please correct me if I am mistaken.

 

[tsteahr]

I may be totally mistaken, but I do not think there is a ground wire coming in to a house from the power company. The way I understand it is there are two 110 hot leads and one neutral lead.

Please correct me if I am mistaken.

Yep, 2 hot and a neutral. That's how it is at my house. The house panels are grounded to at least two copper rods driven into the ground outside.

 

[wdchyd]

It's also possible to feed your house by "back-feeding" through your dryer, stove, or welder receptacle, but I wouldn't recommend it. There are two serious pitfalls to this approach, one is that you have to ensure the main power breaker is OFF before you connect the generator. It doesn't sound hard to remember, but it happens. A set-up like techman posted eliminates that possibility.

The second pitfall, and one that is potentially lethal, is that unless you completely disconnect the power feed from the utility to the main panel, it's possible under the right conditions to feed power back through the ground wire to the grid. Step that up through a transformer on the pole outside your house, and it gets really nasty. A repairman on a pole two blocks away can get a fatal shock from your generator.

With most main breakers on distribution panels, opening the breaker only opens the two "hot" leads, and does nothing with the ground wire. What the specific conditions are for this to happen, I can't say for sure, but I've been told that by people that work around this stuff for a living. I believe them.

The commercially available generator sub-panels and the Generlink break all three wires entering your house, two of those being live 110v to provide 220v service, the third being the ground wire to prevent that possibility.

Sean

Do that in this area and be ready for HUGE Lawsuit if someone gets jolted, yes people backfeed thru dryer plugs and such but it is illegal here......besides if you don't limit what is turned on for your generator then you can overload you equipment.....and yes the transformer out on the pole boosts your 220v to much higher voltage when it goes backword thru to the grid........OUCH!!!!

Best to just do it right:thumbsup:

 

[Travelover]

Check out the Gentran Vintage transfer switches. They are very easy to install and can be had for less than $150. Also sold under the name Reliance, for more $

 

[wdchyd]

I put in a Reliance from Home Depot (Lowes sells it also) for under $300. with everything to hook it up with.....Reliance Controls 31406CRK - Power Transfer Kit for Portable Generator

For years we used to run ext cords all over the house.....not anymore....plus we have our well hooked up......

Last spring we had 6 days without power and other than the noise of the gen in the sideyard we sometimes forgot there was no power outside......

I agree with hiring electrician if you are not elec savy......:thumbsup:

Travelover,

Like this one?

 

[Travelover]

Travelover,

Like this one?

Yep, that's it. I paid a lot less from Gentran.

 

[Pirate]

I tried and tried to get my power company to either let me get a Generlink installed or have them purchase and install for me to rent. They wouldn't do it and would not even consider it. Stupid ignorant. Johnson City Power Board. I wanted a sub-panel but the knucklehead who built this place put the main panel in the kitchen. I have it covered but no room to put sub panels at all. I went with a sliding generator plate. I can now plug my generator in outside, slide the plate over, and use existing breakers. I put two watt meters in the top of the panel cover so I can monitor the usage.

I wish I could economically relocate the panel to the basement where it should have been in the first place.

 

[nwbearcat]

I didn't do anything with a 2nd panel. If you have 2 open adjacent slots in a Square D box, you can get an interlock kit that will tie a 2 pole breaker to your main, requiring 1 to be off for the other to be on. Then you run a heavy wire from this 2 pole breaker to an inlet box, much like the one posted earlier. In the case of a power outage, you plug the extension cord from the genny into the inlet box, start the generator, then flip off the breakers you don't need, and the main breaker, slide up the interlock, and flip on the inlet breaker. I now have the ability to power any outlet or light in my house. Some utilities don't approve of using a breaker like this to be the disconnect, but I also have a hard disconnect on the outside that I can pull to cut my house off of the grid if needed, but the inspector says i'm fine as is. I can't find the kit now, but you used to be able to get them from Lowes for about $30. I think the entire project cost me about $100 including the inlet box off E-bay, the wire and the heavy 2 pole breaker.