Chevy vs Ford Diesel Shootout

[Diamondpilot]

And of course the 10X as many people's lives they enriched by giving them a lifetime of employment and retirement and health benefits to their families???? We'll just ignore them?

Plain and simple the unions killed that deal but there were promised made by the current administration to earn votes that had to be taken care of.

You are a business owner and they would not have bailed you out. They would have let you file bankruptcy and either re organize or just fail. If you failed the competition would have came in and bought up what was decent and the rest would have been allowed to blow away in the wind. Your employee's who lost jobs would have moved on and went to work for the competition. Its business 101.

In GM's case the crappy lines would have been allowed to dwindle to nothing and the decent lines like Chevy, Caddy, GMC, & Buick would have been picked up by others. The folks that lost jobs would be in a world of hurt for a while but the other auto manufactures would gain market share and there would have been employment opportunities there.

Here is how a government incentive package or bail out works:

A traveling salesman rolls into town and stops at the local hotel. He pays $100 for his room and heads upstairs. Quickly the hotel owner runs across the street and pays the butcher for the meat he got on credit. The butcher takes that same $100 and pays the farmer for the live stock he got on credit. The farmer takes that same $100 to the co-op and pays the owner for the feed he got on credit. The co-op owner takes that $100 and pays the town prostitute for the services he got on credit. She takes the $100 back to the hotel and pays for the room she got on credit. About that time the salesman comes down and says the room is not satisfactory and wants his $100 back. He loads up in his car and heads to the next town.

Every one has been paid but no money has been pumped into the local economy.

So the question is did this do us any good? Unemployment is still at 10%....

Chris

 

[W7XYZ]

IMHO, it was in 1974 that GM started their slide in quality and lived on their name for decades.

I think it started before that, but then, all the US automakers were guilty. Lee Iaccoca had stated in his book that if we could put wheels on it and it would roll under its own power, we could sell it. Only problem, nobody saw the 1955 VW in the rear view mirror or cared about it.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I think it started before that, but then, all the US automakers were guilty. Lee Iaccoca had stated in his book that if we could put wheels on it and it would roll under its own power, we could sell it. Only problem, nobody saw the 1955 VW in the rear view mirror or cared about it.

Then they laughed at the first Toyota's and Honda's.

Chris

 

[crazyal]

My biggest problem with Ford is that most work that needs to be done to it requires the cab to be pulled off the chassis. My coworker who has an 08 3/4 ton got a recall for the injectors and the dealer used a two post lift to raise the cab then roll the frame out to work on it.

A friend who works for the local town was trying to find a spot under the hood of a 09 1 ton Ford to install a relay for a plow and couldn't find a spot. There's no reason for an engine compartment to be so crowded.

I'm the type of person who keeps things long past the warranty is out and do work myself. After about 7 to 8 years things like cab bolts don't come out too easily if the truck has seen winter. Everything extra you need to do to an older vehicle is just more chances of having to repair something that didn't need it.

I can't say I know if the other two brands are any better.

 

[Diamondpilot]

My biggest problem with Ford is that most work that needs to be done to it requires the cab to be pulled off the chassis. My coworker who has an 08 3/4 ton got a recall for the injectors and the dealer used a two post lift to raise the cab then roll the frame out to work on it.

A friend who works for the local town was trying to find a spot under the hood of a 09 1 ton Ford to install a relay for a plow and couldn't find a spot. There's no reason for an engine compartment to be so crowded.

I'm the type of person who keeps things long past the warranty is out and do work myself. After about 7 to 8 years things like cab bolts don't come out too easily if the truck has seen winter. Everything extra you need to do to an older vehicle is just more chances of having to repair something that didn't need it.

I can't say I know if the other two brands are any better.

This is not just Ford. Go to a GM dealer and look around. Last time I was at one in 08 having work done to my dads Corvette they had 3 Dmax trucks with the cabs off.

Its not necessary on either truck, it simply a time saver. 2 guys can pull the cab by lunch to have easy access and a clean work environment. I agree it sucks but that the way its done.

I had to change a heater blower motor on a Buick Park Av when I was in college for a friends mom. It was a 90's era one with a V6 and front wheel drive. We had to take off all the accessories driven by the serpentine belt and the back valve cover. We thought we were going to have to pull the head until we loosened the motor mounts and jacked the engine to get it out of the firewall. Took 2 guys a whole day to replace a $20 part.

Chris

 

[Builder]

:laughing: :laughing:

We're talking about what once was one of the world's largest corporations for what 50 years, and you laugh when I suggest they provided employment benefits & retirement for millions of people?

Talk about a laugh........:confused2::confused2::confused2:

 

[Builder]

Plain and simple the unions killed that deal but there were promised made by the current administration to earn votes that had to be taken care of.

You are a business owner and they would not have bailed you out. They would have let you file bankruptcy and either re organize or just fail. If you failed the competition would have came in and bought up what was decent and the rest would have been allowed to blow away in the wind. Your employee's who lost jobs would have moved on and went to work for the competition. Its business 101.

In GM's case the crappy lines would have been allowed to dwindle to nothing and the decent lines like Chevy, Caddy, GMC, & Buick would have been picked up by others. The folks that lost jobs would be in a world of hurt for a while but the other auto manufactures would gain market share and there would have been employment opportunities there.

Here is how a government incentive package or bail out works:

A traveling salesman rolls into town and stops at the local hotel. He pays $100 for his room and heads upstairs. Quickly the hotel owner runs across the street and pays the butcher for the meat he got on credit. The butcher takes that same $100 and pays the farmer for the live stock he got on credit. The farmer takes that same $100 to the co-op and pays the owner for the feed he got on credit. The co-op owner takes that $100 and pays the town prostitute for the services he got on credit. She takes the $100 back to the hotel and pays for the room she got on credit. About that time the salesman comes down and says the room is not satisfactory and wants his $100 back. He loads up in his car and heads to the next town.

Every one has been paid but no money has been pumped into the local economy.

So the question is did this do us any good? Unemployment is still at 10%....

Chris

I have no different feelings than you about what should have happened to GM & Chrysler. The free market should have taken over and the cards should have fallen where they may. I don't agree with the gov't taking them over, but I do care about the products, the rivalry and the competition continuing on for all our own good.

However, if the only truck was Ford, the world for the truck owner would be a dark and dismal place because there would be no competiton. They would build junk and tell us they were the only game in town and stick it up your rear and buy a mahindra if you don't like it.

Therefore, I like that the competition was saved. As much as you and Drago want to see a world with no GM, you'd only make your beloved & worshipped hero Ford motor company a worse truck product.

I prefer the competition be there so they make each other better.

There's your lesson in economics.

 

[W7XYZ]

However, if the only truck was Ford, the world for the truck owner would be a dark and dismal place because there would be no competition.

Oh, somebody would pick up at least some of pieces if GM folded. All you would have to do is look at the road map of the Jeep nameplate. You mentioned Mahindra, didn't they buy up the old Jeep FC Forward Control series that are still made today in India?

 

[Builder]

Oh, somebody would pick up at least some of pieces if GM folded. All you would have to do is look at the road map of the Jeep nameplate. You mentioned Mahindra, didn't they buy up the old Jeep FC Forward Control series that are still made today in India?

Yep, that's what should have been allowed to happen. However, I am happy the competition between brands is preserved-even if it meant the gov't stepping in. We end up with better trucks.

 

[Builder]

best looking truck, imho

Here's my favorite Ford truck picture: