Snow Equipment Owning/Operating Cutting / Groving / Siping R-4 for snow

[DAY]

Oh, the dilemma: groove the turfs, or trade the 30 year old tractor for 4WD HST. . .

 

[djradz]

gladehound/Ron, what technique did you use to not go all the way through when moving to the center (ending the cut)? I like the fact that both ends are protected. My concern with going all the way through is that like the outside edge (where everyone comments you don't want to go all the way through as it weakens the edge) I'm concerned that most of the pressure and wear is in the middle, where I don't want it weakened either. Did you simple lift or kind of pry the iron out as you came to where you wanted to end?

 

[Carl Bert]

gladehound/Ron, what technique did you use to not go all the way through when moving to the center (ending the cut)? I like the fact that both ends are protected. My concern with going all the way through is that like the outside edge (where everyone comments you don't want to go all the way through as it weakens the edge) I'm concerned that most of the pressure and wear is in the middle, where I don't want it weakened either. Did you simple lift or kind of pry the iron out as you came to where you wanted to end?

I agree with DJRADZ. Seems like you wouldn't be compromising the strength of the lugs as much if you stop the cuts before the ends. I guess you can always draw it out first, then start on each end and meet in the middle. Never used or even heard of this tool before reading this thread. Thanks and can't wait to try it on my B26

 

[gladehound]

In response to the last 2 posts - it is very easy to plunge in or pry out of a groove anywhere you want. The shape of the tip looks like it is designed for exactly that. If you lower the handle towards the tire the front tilts up and the "U" shaped blade rides right up to the surface. Starting a groove in the middle of a lug is just the opposite.

 

[gladehound]

Here is the jpeg- again. Hope it stays here!

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=200388&stc=1&d=1297691882

I had those exact same tires on an old Satoh 30 years ago. Must have been popular back then!!! When it came to traction, those tires really weren't good. Not nearly as good as a modern turf tire with gooves, sipes and sharp edges! So you need to cut them.

I also vote for the New 4WD HST tractor with front mounted power angle frame mounted plow Grooved R-4's and as much weight on the 3 pt as it will carry.

Since you will want to groove either the tires you have or the new R-4's on your new 4wd HST tractor I say buy the groover and start grooving the ones you have. It will give you traction in the short term and practice for when your grooving a new R-4. If I had your turfs, I would just put an "+" on each diamond shaped block and wouldn't worry much about them chunking out. They are 30 year old tires.

Pulling a rear blade for snow removal with a small 2wd tractor with poor tires isn't exactly the ideal set up. But you know that. If you want to make it tons better on the cheap...

1. Groove the tires
2. Rig up a front mount for your rear blade (keeping the blade as close to the tractor as possible)
3. Put as much weight on the 3pt as it will carry.

If you do those three things, it should be able to move some snow. Buy the new tractor and you'll do even better :thumbsup:

 

[Deadman]

All the weight of tractor rides on center of R4 on hard surface. I wanted the center of the lug cut so it could flex and get traction. If you don't cut the lug to the center, it will not dig down as good and will want to act more like a non-cut R4 (which sucks)
The R4 is so hard, I can't see it chunking on a compact utility tractor. I'll report back on mine after time.

 

[DAY]

I had those exact same tires on an old Satoh 30 years ago. Must have been popular back then!!! When it came to traction, those tires really weren't good. Not nearly as good as a modern turf tire with gooves, sipes and sharp edges! So you need to cut them.

I also vote for the New 4WD HST tractor with front mounted power angle frame mounted plow Grooved R-4's and as much weight on the 3 pt as it will carry.

Since you will want to groove either the tires you have or the new R-4's on your new 4wd HST tractor I say buy the groover and start grooving the ones you have. It will give you traction in the short term and practice for when your grooving a new R-4. If I had your turfs, I would just put an "+" on each diamond shaped block and wouldn't worry much about them chunking out. They are 30 year old tires.

Pulling a rear blade for snow removal with a small 2wd tractor with poor tires isn't exactly the ideal set up. But you know that. If you want to make it tons better on the cheap...

1. Groove the tires
2. Rig up a front mount for your rear blade (keeping the blade as close to the tractor as possible)
3. Put as much weight on the 3pt as it will carry.

If you do those three things, it should be able to move some snow. Buy the new tractor and you'll do even better :thumbsup:

Come to think of it, I HAD a Satoh, (gas) back in the early 70's! (turfs and FEL). Your three suggestions sound like a plan, but snow season is over:laughing: and writing a check may be the better way to go.

Now the thread takes a slightly different tack: I plan to get R4's on the new machine, because I mostly will bush hog a couple of scraggly acres, and venture into the woods to skid logs, haul rocks and firewood, plus dig some really nice clay (I'm a potter). Q: Will the R4's still be the choice, or the modern turf- since you say they are better in snow than either type of bar tread? (finish mowing is not an issue).

 

[gladehound]

Come to think of it, I HAD a Satoh, (gas) back in the early 70's! (turfs and FEL). Your three suggestions sound like a plan, but snow season is over:laughing: and writing a check may be the better way to go.

Now the thread takes a slightly different tack: I plan to get R4's on the new machine, because I mostly will bush hog a couple of scraggly acres, and venture into the woods to skid logs, haul rocks and firewood, plus dig some really nice clay (I'm a potter). Q: Will the R4's still be the choice, or the modern turf- since you say they are better in snow than either type of bar tread? (finish mowing is not an issue).

Congrats on your decision to get the new tractor!! :thumbsup:

Now that I have cut my R-4's I'd take them in snow over a modern turf any day. They are really amazing in snow!

Also, if you are venturing in the woods, definitely R-4s. The R-4 is the most likely to survive without incident. Turf are much more likely to puncture.

I us my tractor much like you do and from now on will always get R-4's and groove them.

 

[Deadman]

calling for 12 inches of snow tomorrow! Oh the Groovy-R4's will be out in action! :thumbsup:

 

[Deadman]

OK, SNOW PLOWED! :licking:

I will say that last week we had warm weather, and all the previous snow melted down into layers of glare ice, and then it got cold and froze solid. Now, we got 8-10 inched of snow on TOP OF that icy crap.

I decided to TRY the newly grooved tires in 2 wheel drive just for fun. I plowed the whole driveway and NEVER ONCE engaged the 4x4. I never really spun much at all, other than when one wheel would get on a nasty ice spot. If I stepped on the posi then, it would just blast forward with authority! These tires now dig thru the crusty old snow underneath, and dig into the dirt or whatever they get ahold of, and absolutely ROCK! :thumbsup:

I plowed in 2wheel drive MORE THAN it would have ever done in 4x4 before I cut these. If ANYONE is unsure about cutting theirs, at the very least, cut your rears and forget about using 4x4!

I was blown away by the difference. My dad was watching me plow, and he assumed it was in 4x4 until I told him it was in 2wd! He made me stop and check the 4x4 lever. I rammed it into a huge snow bank and spun the rear tires just to prove to him it was really only 2wd.........His eyes got the size of GolfBalls!

Seriously guys, this is the most impressive modification I have done to anything in years that has made such a huge improvement. I have tinkered with a lot of stuff BTW! :laughing:

Cut them however you want, and you will be amazed! There really is no wrong or right way, it all depends on what you want or like! I personally could not think of any way I would change my grooving job so far!