Comparison Looking at buying new tractor, LS vs Kubota

[two4spooky]

I am not knocking your personal choice of tractor and hope it serves you well. I do disagree with the statements LS is just as good or better than xxxx(JOHN DEERE).

If you could support your inferiority argument with component research where they were using inferior components I might buy it just as I agreed with the "chance" argument and it's validity.

MONTANA is the last brand LS made for North America, yes? OK, forget about resale value, replacement value, future parts and service. Let us just consider design and build quality. Go to the MONTANA section of this website. I see 20 threads on the first page. A quick glance looks like 11 or so of the 20 are mechanical issues/problems and a couple more are looking for parts, manuals or English translations. Compare that to the JD sections, even the section for problems to be posted - "JD OWNING/OPERATING". Not really very comparable, especially no comparision if you add in the other JD sections about buying and pricing. Again, not meant to put down LS tractors just disagreeing with "just as good as" statements. PS-I think the "taking a chance" and "25%" was brought up by the LS owner HoustonS.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I am not knocking your personal choice of tractor and hope it serves you well. I do disagree with the statements LS is just as good or better than xxxx(JOHN DEERE). MONTANA is the last brand LS made for North America, yes? OK, forget about resale value, replacement value, future parts and service. Let us just consider design and build quality. Go to the MONTANA section of this website. I see 20 threads on the first page. A quick glance looks like 11 or so of the 20 are mechanical issues/problems and a couple more are looking for parts, manuals or English translations. Compare that to the JD sections, even the section for problems to be posted - "JD OWNING/OPERATING". Not really very comparable, especially no comparision if you add in the other JD sections about buying and pricing. Again, not meant to put down LS tractors just disagreeing with "just as good as" statements. PS-I think the "taking a chance" and "25%" was brought up by the LS owner HoustonS.

two4spooky, just wondering, have you looked at any of the LS tractors in person? And LS as well as every other tractor manufacturer has mechanical failures. I think that the problem with the Montana tractors is that they are basically out of business and it is hard to get something from a company that is out of business. Actually I believe that Landini and McCormick were the last distributors of LS tractors before LS started to sell their product themselves.

I think that one of the reasons that you see and can read about more problems with the "other" brands is because of the lower quality dealer networks that the other brands have and because of that guys are trying to fix stuff themselves. If you read enough of the posts in all makes, you will find people that have not one good thing to say about the tractor that they bought. I think that people that can afford to purchase a tractor from one of the top 3-4 makers, that they are able to have the dealers fix their problems and therefore you do not hear or read about those problems as often. Typically it is a different type of person that purchases one of the top 3-4 makes and the dealer that goes along with that make. Guys like me that purchase one of the lesser known brands expect to do whatever repair that comes up themselves. That is why you see more of those people on here, they are trying to get help to make their repairs easier.

Just my :2cents:

 

[DwightD123]

Well two4spooky I don't take offense. I did my research and went about it in a methodical fashion. Two takes on the same item...one of the reasons I purchased the LS is that I believe that in 5 years my resale of this tractor will be so much better compared to purchase price and resale of a DEERE, et al . Now I could be wrong. I am divorced so I have been wrong at least once before and if so I will have some extra leg work in maintaining my tractor and if I decide to sell it I will probably suffer the same reduction of value as compared to buying a new DEERE, NH, KUBOTA,ETC and selling it used. I still don't see any substantive evidence of component and build difference. I feel the women and men in the North Carolina factory are taking pride in their final builds based on the QC I saw in the tractors at the dealership and my purchase.
I agree with MtnView, if you search the threads and net you will find someone mad at every manufacturer (LS broke the Montana relationship to sell direct in the US. It is possible that Montana was not doing a good job on their end and just increasing the cost).
If you can find some examples of where LS has cut their build quality or used inferior parts compared to the other manufacturers, then I will agree with your argument but what I have found is that LS is building a quality machine and see the same quality of components in their R series that the other brands use in their high end tractors and the same components in their G series as the other manufacturers use in their economy models.
To me it's a win-break even situation. I have a 41HP tractor with more options and more implements than I could have gotten with DEERE, Kub,NH etc.. It has industry proven components, it is built with a Quality Control you can see. I got this 41hp Shuttle Shift 16 gear 4WD, Dual Rear Remote, EZ Shift, FEL, etc etc etc with a 16' Trailer, Rotary Cutter, Box Blade, Harrow Disc, Rear Tires Filled and some FEL Mods for 24K. It is heavier than any of the name brand similars, it lifts more, and has a wider stance. The hydraulics are smooth, the bolts are tight and the quality can easily be sniffed out with a pop of the hood and a close look around the tractor. I can't see any place where they skipped a quality build and so far can't find any components they are using that are inferior to DEERE et al.. Can you?

 

[TripleR]

Just an observation as I know little to nothing about LS tractors, but it is really hard for me to judge the "newer" companies the same as I do the "older" manufacturers or even the "newer" tractor brands based on earlier builds.

I remember my first exposure to Japanese motorcycles, cars then trucks. I was less than impressed; guess what I now drive.

I also remember the first Korean cars, man what a disappointment, now my brother owns one and they are all over the place.

I suspect this "may" well be the situation with LS and maybe a couple of others.

I have to live with my own prejudices/judgements etc. and will stay with the "top" brands, but I sure can't claim to base this on any empirical evidence.

If you are comfortable with your tractor then nothing any of us "think" should really matter.

Now if anyone can "prove" superior quality on anything, I will be all eyes.

 

[DwightD123]

Let me clarify...I think the amount of return money on purchase price vs resale of my LS vs DEERE, et al will be better. I am under no delusion that my LS will sell for an amount higher than a DEERE, etc.. I just think the return will be better if I did sell it...hope that is clear.

 

[Dargo]

Let me clarify...I think the amount of return money on purchase price vs resale of my LS vs DEERE, et al will be better. I am under no delusion that my LS will sell for an amount higher than a DEERE, etc.. I just think the return will be better if I did sell it...hope that is clear.

That's asking a LOT. I've actually made money on almost every JD tractor I've owned; fact. I assume that like a Harley, you can no longer buy a new one every other year and sell your old one for more than you paid for it. Still, the residual percentage is huge and that's what you're talking about. I seriously doubt the residual percentage on any LS tractor is even close to that of a Kubota or JD.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

Anyway I just gave my 2 cents because two guy were chatting about why LS's seems to moving off the local lots while the Kubota's were not

For what its worth, I sell both an LS made New Holland (same tractor, different hood), and Kubota. We sell Kubota's about 15-1, maybe higher. I can't speak to the utility tractors because we don't have those, but in the compact line there is no question that the LS made tractor is of lesser quality. Its of lesser price though too...

 

[houstonscott]

Can you describe less quality, and be specific. I would like to know where the differences are and you claim to know.


Here is an example of what I'm expecting; Kubota uses sodium exhaust valves, LS doesn't. Kubota used SS water pump, LS is AL.

My bet is you can't make any claims like these, but I would really like to know.

HS

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

The things you notice first are egronomic issues. The levers are placed in poor locations comming up from under the seat rather than up on the fenders. They are harder to reach and catch your shorts when you get on and off the tractor. The loader valve is back at your seat, but the cables are exposed and the handle is just held to the fender with a little bracket. The fuel tank is way up at the rops and is hard to get to, its also prone to condensation since its black and exposed to the sun. The 3pt top link is very light, like the TSC ones for $18. Servicablity is a bear, the hood does not open far enough to really get back into the engine. You'd need to pull it off if your really going to do anything involved.... but most of all... the hydro transmissions are totally gutless. The 30hp model can't drive on a flat parkinglot in high gear without loading up the engine. Same kinda problem we had with the Kubota L48's.

All this said, we do sell them. With a 5 Year warrenty and a price advantage they do meet the needs of some people, I just would never characterize it as on par with any of the mainline companies. There is a place for them, and over the long haul I don't doubt that this will be a good relationship for CNH.

 

[DwightD123]

I seriously doubt the residual percentage on any LS tractor is even close to that of a Kubota or JD.

Please read the post. I am not expecting the return on investment if sold to be equal right now. I am expecting it to be there or greater in the next 5 years. This is based on my theory that LS is buying it's way into the market place the same as Mahindra in the past and not a reduction of quality parts. I could be wrong...I could be right. Time will tell but I really do require substantive proof of claims of inferiority of build.
To just say they are built with less quality without some substance to back it up...well.. I just can't go for that and would not ask you to either.
I was the first in line to go buy a John Deere when I got the permission from the wife to go forward. Then I found out they aren't Made in the US anymore...my heart dropped. Then I started trying to find a tractor that was made in the US...surely FORD...Ughh..nope. That is when I decided to start doing some research. That is when I bought the R series LS.
Again..I will say "to each his own"..but don't knock mine without proof.

Where is the OP? Let's GET HIM!!