Does building log splitter make $ sense

[Scooby074]

Good info there..i am actually torn between the 16 gpm pump and the 22gpm pump..the 16 is only 200 dollars where as the 22 is 500 dollars..But speed( and strenght) is what i am after and i already settled on a 15 hp motor.. I agree with you that the 4 inch ram is the ideal size and anything bigger is slower.The ram i had picked out is actually 3.5 inch x 24 i just hope it wont be too weak..

I watched a couple videos on those inertia splitter and yes they are definitly fast but for that kind of money they should come mounted on a wood hauling trailer instead of that flismy 1/8 inch angle iron legs..

I have the barnes 22 and a 5" cyl. It is FAST. Actually its too fast if you dont have a couple guys cutting and stacking. Youll get too much built up and start tripping over it. Part of the reason i went with the 22 was also that i intend on adding a conveyor belt at a later date.

Considering i work alone half the time, i usually only run the motor at 3/4 throttle. This saves me money on fuel.

If you typically work alone, id suggest you get the smaller 16 gpm and a smaller more efficient engine ( i think the 16 can run on a 10hp). It would be much cheaper up front and cheaper to run.

 

[LD1]

Good info there..i am actually torn between the 16 gpm pump and the 22gpm pump..the 16 is only 200 dollars where as the 22 is 500 dollars..But speed( and strenght) is what i am after and i already settled on a 15 hp motor.. I agree with you that the 4 inch ram is the ideal size and anything bigger is slower.The ram i had picked out is actually 3.5 inch x 24 i just hope it wont be too weak..

I watched a couple videos on those inertia splitter and yes they are definitly fast but for that kind of money they should come mounted on a wood hauling trailer instead of that flismy 1/8 inch angle iron legs..

The 3.5 inst going to gain much on speed vs the 4". For the power, I'd stick to the 4" unless you are splitting nothing but small and straight grained peices.

And you should really shop around on pump prices.

Here is just one example Haldex | Hydraulic Pumps | Hydraulics | Northern Tool + Equipment

16 GPM....$170
22GPM.....$320

The 16GPM can use 8HP or larger engine
Min for the 22 is 10HP

 

[Scooby074]

The 3.5 inst going to gain much on speed vs the 4". For the power, I'd stick to the 4" unless you are splitting nothing but small and straight grained peices.

And you should really shop around on pump prices.

Here is just one example Haldex | Hydraulic Pumps | Hydraulics | Northern Tool + Equipment

16 GPM....$170
22GPM.....$320

The 16GPM can use 8HP or larger engine
Min for the 22 is 10HP

The min spec for the 22 may be 10hp but i bet thats at 2000psi, i can stall out my 14 hp if i try to turn the pressure above about 2700psi

I probably wouldnt run less than 10 on the 16 if your going to go above factory preset pressure.

 

[toxicjeeper]

I didnt realize i could turn up the factory setting on pump..hmm..I like the 15 hp motor cause it had electric start..not a neccessity but a cool feature and the motor is cheap at under 300 bucks..so 15 hp with a turned-up 16 gpm pump with a 4 inch clyinder should get me a decent cycle time..i was shooting for 7 sec's...

Scooby what brand of hydraulic pump are you running? I see you are from NS..I am from NB..are you running P.A stuff?

 

[toxicjeeper]

The 3.5 inst going to gain much on speed vs the 4". For the power, I'd stick to the 4" unless you are splitting nothing but small and straight grained peices.

And you should really shop around on pump prices.

Here is just one example Haldex | Hydraulic Pumps | Hydraulics | Northern Tool + Equipment

16 GPM....$170
22GPM.....$320

The 16GPM can use 8HP or larger engine
Min for the 22 is 10HP

WOW..Thank you for that link..That is an awsome price for the 22gpm..as long as the shipping doesnt kill the deal that is a better price than i was getting locally..

 

[triptester]

Increasing horsepower can help to increase the pressure setting on the pump but cycle times are controlled by pump gear size X rpm's.

 

[tommu56]

My huskee from TSC says "assembled in USA" probably assembled by the guy at TSC store from parts sourced from all over the world it does have a Briggs engine.

tom

 

[LD1]

WOW..Thank you for that link..That is an awsome price for the 22gpm..as long as the shipping doesnt kill the deal that is a better price than i was getting locally..

No problem. But you may want to do a quick google search on your own when it comes time to buy. Because that isnt even the cheapest I have seen them.

The min spec for the 22 may be 10hp but i bet thats at 2000psi, i can stall out my 14 hp if i try to turn the pressure above about 2700psi

I probably wouldnt run less than 10 on the 16 if your going to go above factory preset pressure.

Probabally depends on how overrated the motor is too. Just too many variables on that one.

If equations are linear (which they are), our 11gpm will NOT stall the B&S 6.5HP motor that is on it, and the psi is set @ 3500 if you let it deadhead.

So, based on that, I would think a 13 HP would NOT stall with double the GPM @ the same PSI:confused2:

Either way, splitting wood rarely makes the pressure spike that high. Usually only when cylinder is fully extended, and that momentary second or so before you let off the lever

 

[Scooby074]

I didnt realize i could turn up the factory setting on pump..hmm..I like the 15 hp motor cause it had electric start..not a neccessity but a cool feature and the motor is cheap at under 300 bucks..so 15 hp with a turned-up 16 gpm pump with a 4 inch clyinder should get me a decent cycle time..i was shooting for 7 sec's...

Scooby what brand of hydraulic pump are you running? I see you are from NS..I am from NB..are you running P.A stuff?

RPM of the motor = more rev/minute= more speed of cylinder in/min.

HP of motor = amount of pressure you can build.

Im using a Barnes 22 GPM from PA.

On the side of the barnes pumps theres a large hex "nut". Under that there is a flat screw. Tighten that to increase pressure. The Barnes units will go up to 3000 psi, from the factory they are 2000-2200 IIRC. You cant increase the output of these pumps, theyre fixed volume, 2 stage.

THe PA honda clones arent bad ive been told. Im running a PA subaru. So far i love the scoobies. Ive had their cars but this is the first small engine for me. Starts easy. Runs quiet. But it is very thirsty at full throttle.

Im using all PA hydraulics other than hoses. The tank, pump, motor, lovejoy, cylinders and valves are all from PA. Theyre hard to beat for hydraulics down here. We'll never see Surplus center / Northern tools prices or sheer number of products, but they arent bad.

I looked at Surplus center when shopping and shipping heavy hydraulic components was going to kill any savings over PA's prices.

For hoses, im using ALFAGOMA. Its italian hose, i liked it better than the new hose at PA and its about the same price. And the people at Alfa are excellent to deal with. I highly recommend.

My build thread, if your interested http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/build-yourself/219145-woodsplitter-build-timberwolf-clone.html

 

[Scooby074]

N
Probabally depends on how overrated the motor is too. Just too many variables on that one.

If equations are linear (which they are), our 11gpm will NOT stall the B&S 6.5HP motor that is on it, and the psi is set @ 3500 if you let it deadhead.

So, based on that, I would think a 13 HP would NOT stall with double the GPM @ the same PSI:confused2:

Either way, splitting wood rarely makes the pressure spike that high. Usually only when cylinder is fully extended, and that momentary second or so before you let off the lever

Yould think that it should run it. Ive seen the recommended HP all over the place depending on which store your looking at.

I looked at the chart for my pump, actually if you look close max psi is pushing 16hp.

Ill post up the pump chart when i find it again.

One last thing, "Barnes" is no more. Theyre "Concentric" now. You wont believe me how long that took me to find out!

Heres the link: http://www.concentricab.com/_downloads/Catalogs/HILO_PUMP_US.pdf

 

[Scooby074]

Ok heres the chart. Notice the HP peaks for both the 22 and 16gpm

See the attachment. 1300488 is the 22GPM. 1300487 is the 16GPM

 

[crazyal]

I'm looking for a splitter that is 3pth but that has its own engine so I don't have to run my tractor engine and because I don't have very good hydraulics on my little GC.

I think I would look into getting a pto hydraulic pump set up over buying an engine and a hydraulic pump. I'm not sure, cost wise, if it would be cheaper but I think it would be a nice setup that could handle anything you threw at it. I would think by doing so, others here would know better, you could get close to the speed and power of a two stage pump with a 5 hp gas engine without having it kick down into slow mode.

 

[grsthegreat]

For a 3 point tractor powered splitter i am currently helping a friend build one. He found a used h beam for $60 at the wrecking yard. plus the following

1. base steel, $30.00 scrap
2. pivot wedge northern tool $30.00
3. Wedge northern tool $33.00
4. 4" x 24" x 2" tie rod cyllinder = $175.00
5. prince splitter valve (surplus center) = $ 70.00
6. hoses - unknown yet
7. rest from scrap in shop.

total = $398.00 + hoses

not sure where there getting 1200 estimates.

this one will be just like mine...and mine works great

 

[gochenour799]

So I've read a bunch of threads about BIY log splitters and everyone has done a great job- I've started pricing out parts as I would need to buy everything new and it doesn't appear that this will save any $ over buying new (with a warranty for what its worth...) and I haven't even figured in labor yet...I guess it makes sense if you already have an engine and the hydraulic cylinder and the I-beam, but otherwise it doesn't seem to make to much financial sense...I could see if there was a situation where you needed special options that were either really expensive or you couldn't find, or for a sense of satisfaction, but for just a basic gas powered 20ish ton splitter, it just doesn't seem to make sense. Thoughts?

weesy

[/IMG]
It will take x2 as long as you think and x2 as much $ ....lol

 

[LD1]

Ok heres the chart. Notice the HP peaks for both the 22 and 16gpm

See the attachment. 1300488 is the 22GPM. 1300487 is the 16GPM

I also notice that for 11gpm model, it is calling for just over 7HP @ max. And our 6.5HP briggs has NEVER stalled:confused2: Very confusing

 

[grsthegreat]

[/IMG]
It will take x2 as long as you think and x2 as much $ ....lol

well... theres always those nutjobs LOLOLOL :laughing:

 

[J_J]

Where did yo get that high price.

Surplus Center - 22 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The 28 only takes about 16 HP to run it.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

 

[J_J]

The min spec for the 22 may be 10hp but i bet thats at 2000psi, i can stall out my 14 hp if i try to turn the pressure above about 2700psi

I probably wouldnt run less than 10 on the 16 if your going to go above factory preset pressure.

The 22 GPM from Surplus has a 3000 psi rating, and if you are using the full 7 GPM at 3000, it will take all of the 14 HP to run it. The relief on that valve should be set about 2900 to 2950 psi.

For a 30 ton splitter, you will need a 5 in cyl and 2 in shaft, and at 3000 psi, you will have about a 29.45 ton splitter.

Of course the 4 in cyl will be faster, but less tons, about 18 ton.

 

[Scooby074]

Where did yo get that high price.

Surplus Center - 22 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

The 28 only takes about 16 HP to run it.

Surplus Center - 28 GPM DYNAMIC 2-STAGE PUMP

I dont trust those catalogs at all. They just say "Minimum X Hp" but dont mention anything about PSI.

The chart in my above post is right from the manufacturer. And im going to say its right on. My 14Hp motor cant run my pump at 3000psi. The chart seems to indicate 15-16 as the necessary HP. Id bet if i had 16Hp id be fine.

 

[Scooby074]

I also notice that for 11gpm model, it is calling for just over 7HP @ max. And our 6.5HP briggs has NEVER stalled:confused2: Very confusing

Actually if you follow the chart across, youll see that at 3000 psi it lists about 6.5-6.75 HP. There are a lot of variables here as youve said.

The peak of ~7.25 is on the high flow side at about 850 psi. The slope is pretty steep and depending on where your pump shifts you might never see 800psi on the HF side. If your pump shifts at say 6-700 Psi it probably is only using 5.5hp.

Or maybe your engine is making more than its rated HP?