Septic Systems - Aerobic vs. Conventional

[dmccarty]

Yes, we had a waste disposal in the kitchen. We used it but as you mentioned, they are frowned upon in septic system use. We had always used one living in the city so it was just common practice. We learned the hard way that septic systems don't like to have food waste going into them.

With our large family (5+), we had a lot of use. It just overworked the septic. Which brings me to the main point. Since we are currently living on a city sewer should we just stay put and forget the whole idea of going back to the country and living on a septic?

Maybe with our large family and the cooking involved, we just are not meant to live in a rural spot on a septic. If a septic can't handle some food waste, along with a family of 5, then maybe our lifestyle is more suited for city sewers.

Five people on a septic system should not be an issue with a properly designed and installed system. We have four in the house and when my parents visit, six and we have never had a problem.

The only thing that should go into a septic system, that did not go through a human body, is toilet paper. A disposer is nice to have but we have lived without one without a problem. We either compost the waste or toss it in the garbage. One of our local cities has talked about banning disposer because of the sewer clogs they cause.

If you cannot stop using a disposer then yes, you should stay in the city.

Country living is going to require other changes in life compared to the city. We do not have garbage pickup which is a good thing since I get to take the garbage to the dump when it is needed not when the service is scheduled nor do I not dump trash all over the place like the garbage pickup did all of the time.

We are on a well. Water service is my problem to deal with not the city. But it is my water and not full of noxious chemicals. If a tree falls on my road I get to remove said tree or pay to have it removed. I cannot call the city or county. We do not have leaf pickup either. There is no they to maintain the road. It is on us.

Frankly these are not really issues for us. We were tired of the city noise. Loud and rude neighbors. Crime. City politics. Traffic. High taxes. Our kids being used as pawns in the schools for other people politics and issues.

Later,
Dan

 

[LBrown59]

Years ago we had a septic system when we lived in a different area and it was a nightmare.
1*The leach field failed and we had nothing but problems.
From what I have read, aerobic systems cost more but they do a better job of cleaning out the effluent BEFORE it gets to the leach field.
2* Conventional or an aerobic systems allow dirtier effluent to reach the leach field which in turn can clog the lines and make the system fail.
3*Is it true that aerobic systems do a better job of preventing leach field failures?

1*That problem was solved when the aerobic system came along to eliminate leach fields .
Leach fields have always been the flaw in any system and we were free of that until the powers that be reintroduced the problem by requiring leach fields which brought us back to square one .
Untill the leach field is taken out of the picture there will be problems with any system .
2*True for conventional but not so with aerobic.
3*Yes If you don't install a leach field.

I have an aerobic system with a leach field. Works pretty good.
4* One of the downsides is you have to have electricity 24x7 to pump air into the system.
5*I understand now they put a regular septic tank in front of the system to help with settling out solids and then the aerobic system after that.
6*Still preferable over the sand mound they would have had to build but maybe not by much.

4*You don't need power 24/7
5*That's a waist of time/money because the leach field is the problem .
Eliminate the leach bed and solve the problem .
6*A mound or a leach field is part of the problem not the solution .

7*Something to think about would be power outages. If you plan to run a well off generator etc. you would also need to run this pump and thus need a way to get genny power to it. Might be easier to wire that in when installing.

7* That's no big deal because there is no need for 24/7 elect.

8*I mentioned my brother putting in the aerobic system for $5,000.
.

8* My current system cost me a whopping 750 bucks.

 

[creekbend]

I have never seen or heard of an aerobic system being used in NH. Everyone around here uses a conventional septic system with a tank and leach field. The conventional systems are pretty fool proof but like anything they require maintenance and care to make them last.

When we had our leach field installed ten years ago the contractor told me to take a packet of bread yeast, mix it in a glass of hot water and dump it down the drain a few times a year to put good bacteria in the system. I've done this every year and never had a problem. Eight years into the system I had it pumped out(state recomends pumping the tank every 3 years) and the guy doing it said it didn't look like it even needed to be pumped out.

I just had our septic tank pumped today at around 3:00 pm this evening and the owner told me the same thing in regards to Yeast. When I inquired about additives, he advised me to get powdered yeast. He said that I could get it at Walmart. He told me to flush two tablespoons down the toilet once a month. He advised me that this method was much cheaper than using the other additives on the market. He adamantly stood by his convictions in recommending the use of yeast. He was the business owner and had been pumping septic systems since 1993. I had never heard of utilizing this additive before, but he convinced me of its merits and I will definitely try it.

 

[TRR]

I've heard that a sink disposer is a no-no for a septic tank. However, we had one for 29 years, 5 people, and never pumped the tank.

Having said that, the rest of the story is: The drain field failed the 2nd year because filter fabric was not used and the drain field pipes filled with dirt. Required a new drain field. We also have 2 tanks, one for gray and one for black. After the initial problem with the field, never had another issue with it.

 

[Pettrix]

1*
3*Yes If you don't install a leach field.


8* My current system cost me a whopping 750 bucks.

How did your system cost only $750? Is it aerobic?

Out here in AZ one needs to have a leach field by law. If they don't, I believe the engineered system costs them $30k. :confused2:

From what I have learned and researched, septic system design changes have been slow to implement and counties are slow to adapt to changes.

So far, here is where I stand:

* I need a 2,000 GAL tank, while over-sized by what is required, having the larger tank gives me more reserve and gives the decomposition process more time before having to leave and enter the effluent chamber

* Aerating the effluent chamber makes a BIG difference in how clean the effluent is and breaks down the waste much faster than an anaerobic system

* Aerating & Filtering the effluent PRIOR having it go into the leach field helps keep the field lines clear

 

[LBrown59]

1*How did your system cost only $750? Is it aerobic?
2*Out here in AZ one needs to have a leach field by law.
If they don't I believe the engineered system costs them $30k. :confused2:
3*From what I have learned and researched, septic system design changes have been slow to implement .
4*Counties are slow to adapt to changes.

So far, here is where I stand:

5* Aerating the effluent chamber makes a BIG difference in how clean the effluent is and breaks down the waste much faster than an anaerobic system
6* Aerating & Filtering the effluent PRIOR to having it go into the leach field helps keep the field lines clear.

1*I put it in in 1971.
2*This is the problem law requieres an enpensive flawed system .
3*Everything they have changed and implemented since 1971 has been a step backwards.
4*To the contrary counties have been to quick to jump on the change band wagon and are enforcing neledless and worthless changes only to drive up the cost of an inferior system .

5*I doubt if yours is any cleaner than mine.
6* But they can and or do plug up because there is no drain for them .

 

[Bigfoot62]

I was a licensed septic system installer for years. Could you please clarify something?

. . . The perc test showed an "absorption rate of .32" . . .

Is that a percollation rate of 0.32" per hour?

If so, you probably don't have enough land to lay a leach field that will work. Less than 1/3 inch per hour is nothing. Aerobic or anerobic, you will have trouble with a leach field. You would have to use an alternative effluent disposal. (example: holding tank and sprinkler system behind an aerobic plant, or an oxidation pond behind a septic tank)

I found this device, which claims to help conventional septic tanks from failing:
Septic Tank - Septic System - Septic Tank System

It basically aerates and makes the system aerobic.

Putting an air pump on an anaerobic system that doesn't work, will just give you an aerobic system that doesn't work.
BTW, buying bacteria is a waste of money. Period. Human waste is full of bacteria. Just don't kill it. (with grease, chlorine, ammonia, anti-bacterial detergents, etc)

I wonder if getting a larger tank (2,000 or even 3,000 gallons) would help my situation?

Larger tanks are better. It gives you more storage room for solids, and the breakdown of solids takes time.

BUT, it still goes back to the absorbtion rate of the soil. If the soil won't soak up the liquid, the leach field will fill up, then the tank will back up.

. . . In my opinion as an engineer, . . .

If the soil and location supports a traditional gravity feed system and it's installed and maintained properly, it should give you at least 30-40 years of trouble free service (and likely more).

The main motivation to go with an alternative system would be in marginal soils or install locations where a traditional system won't work well or fit in the available space. It's generally not done for reliability, as these systems have more complexity, not less. . . .

He nailed it! :thumbsup:

 

[Pettrix]

I was a licensed septic system installer for years. Could you please clarify something?

Is that a percollation rate of 0.32" per hour?

If so, you probably don't have enough land to lay a leach field that will work. Less than 1/3 inch per hour is nothing. Aerobic or anerobic, you will have trouble with a leach field. You would have to use an alternative effluent disposal. (example: holding tank and sprinkler system behind an aerobic plant, or an oxidation pond behind a septic tank)

The report stated that the percolation rate of 32 achieved (no decimal point) and a soil absorption rate of .36 achieved. With a 3% grade slope. The county stated that I have been APPROVED for a conventional septic system.

Putting an air pump on an anaerobic system that doesn't work, will just give you an aerobic system that doesn't work.
BTW, buying bacteria is a waste of money. Period. Human waste is full of bacteria. Just don't kill it. (with grease, chlorine, ammonia, anti-bacterial detergents, etc)

Larger tanks are better. It gives you more storage room for solids, and the breakdown of solids takes time.

BUT, it still goes back to the absorbtion rate of the soil. If the soil won't soak up the liquid, the leach field will fill up, then the tank will back up.

Would pumping air into an anaerobic system that DOES WORK, will it give me an aerobic system that works better?

What system would you recommend that wouldn't break the bank? Is the Orenco AdvanTex setup good? Or should I just go with the 2,000 GAL tank (2 chamber) with just a conventional gravity fed leach field w/ aeration in the 1st chamber of the tank?

 

[Bigfoot62]

The report stated that the percolation rate of 32 achieved (no decimal point) and a soil absorption rate of .36 achieved. With a 3% grade slope. The county stated that I have been APPROVED for a conventional septic system.

If you have been approved for a conventional septic tank and field line system, that's what I would put in. As already pointed out, conventional systems are the most trouble-free and need the least maintanence.
I'm not sure what the numbers mean, here in LA, we go by inches per hour.

Would pumping air into an anaerobic system that DOES WORK, will it give me an aerobic system that works better?

I wouldn't recommend it. Aerobic systems are designed differently from conventional septic tanks.

What system would you recommend that wouldn't break the bank? Is the Orenco AdvanTex setup good? Or should I just go with the 2,000 GAL tank (2 chamber) with just a conventional gravity fed leach field w/ aeration in the 1st chamber of the tank?

I'm not familiar with that brand. If you must put in a mechanical plant, I would suggest a NORWECO. They've been building wastewater treatment systems, both commercial and residential, for over 30 years. I have installed a few, and they are really good systems. You will need to contact a local authorized installer.

 

[jinman]

I'm not familiar with that brand. If you must put in a mechanical plant, I would suggest a NORWECO. They've been building wastewater treatment systems, both commercial and residential, for over 30 years. I have installed a few, and they are really good systems. You will need to contact a local authorized installer.

I have the Norweco Singulair system. Here is a link to their site where you can download brochures.