Metal Roof Question
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clemsonfor
Super Member
****! poor Indians...I bet that would really pizz them off or at least the ones that didn't get all the way well done from the boiling oil.
Wont they just burn your house down? I would not let them get that close!!!
MotorSeven
Elite Member
Eddie we are all speculating. But here are my thoughts: I doubt all the screws have backed out. That being said I would leave the one's alone that have not moved in 14 years and only replace the loose one's. If purlins need replacing then the price could very well go over $2K, and if a lot of tin has to come up then it might be time for a new roof. I kinda doubt the purlins are bad, am guessing a good 8-10 hrs and a man lift would be all it takes to replace what screws need replacing.
EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
I guess I'm not being very clear. As a contractor, I am hired to do the job that the client wants me to do. I tell him what i want to do the job that he wants and he can hire me or find somebody else. As a home owner, I fully understand that I can do my own work, or I can hire it out. I don't believe the debate here is if he should do it himself. He has said that he does not want to do it himself and if $2,000 is a fair price to pay for hiring it out.
My question to those of you who don't feel that this is a fair price, what would you charge to do this job? Remember that there is prep time before the job, what has to be there to make the job happen, (tools, people, supplies, cleanup) and what your commitment will be after the job is done in case one of the thousands of screws that you installed didn't have a defect in it that nobody noticed. Will you do all of it yourself or bring in a crew and supervise?
While my question is a hyperthetical, I am curious because it's real easy to critisize the contractor or the cost of what he is charging to do the job, but another thing when you are a contractor and this is how you make a living. Being there means he can't be somewhere else. Looking at the job costs money, meeting the client costs money and researching the materials costs money. Do you figure that into the job? What is your time worth? Getting to the job costs money, spending time in the store picking up materials costs money and if you rent a lift, then that will cost LOTS of money in time to rent it, time to get it there, time to return it and time to do all the paperwork afterwords.
As for the job itself, I've done a few small jobs like this on much flatter pitched roofs, and a lot fewer screws. It sucks!!!! It's painful to be in that position, it's painful to run a drivier all day and it's painful to just handle that many screws. If it's cold out, it's painful, if it's hot out, it's painful. If the weather is perfect, you will stilll suffer in the early hours or evening hours.
I think $2,000 is a very good price. I wouldn't do this job just because I don't want to go through the pain that I know is part of it. I can make just as much money doing jobs that I enjoy and find to be less painful.
Eddie
My question to those of you who don't feel that this is a fair price, what would you charge to do this job? Remember that there is prep time before the job, what has to be there to make the job happen, (tools, people, supplies, cleanup) and what your commitment will be after the job is done in case one of the thousands of screws that you installed didn't have a defect in it that nobody noticed. Will you do all of it yourself or bring in a crew and supervise?
While my question is a hyperthetical, I am curious because it's real easy to critisize the contractor or the cost of what he is charging to do the job, but another thing when you are a contractor and this is how you make a living. Being there means he can't be somewhere else. Looking at the job costs money, meeting the client costs money and researching the materials costs money. Do you figure that into the job? What is your time worth? Getting to the job costs money, spending time in the store picking up materials costs money and if you rent a lift, then that will cost LOTS of money in time to rent it, time to get it there, time to return it and time to do all the paperwork afterwords.
As for the job itself, I've done a few small jobs like this on much flatter pitched roofs, and a lot fewer screws. It sucks!!!! It's painful to be in that position, it's painful to run a drivier all day and it's painful to just handle that many screws. If it's cold out, it's painful, if it's hot out, it's painful. If the weather is perfect, you will stilll suffer in the early hours or evening hours.
I think $2,000 is a very good price. I wouldn't do this job just because I don't want to go through the pain that I know is part of it. I can make just as much money doing jobs that I enjoy and find to be less painful.
Eddie
mx842
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I don't think too many people are calling you a crook for wanting $2000 to do this job. This job is just like any other job big or small, if who ever is having the work done is happy with the price then he will give the job to said contractor and hopefully everybody goes home happy. I think what most people are saying is that it is a job that they can do themselves and they would rather keep their $2000 in their pocket and maybe go on a nice cruise or buy some new fishing gear.
The op did say he didn't feel comfortable doing it himself so I guess if it get's done he will have to pay someone to do it. No one here knows exactly if it is just a few or a whole bunch of screws that have backed out. I said earlier that if it was just one here and there I would just replace those and maybe check a few here and there just for good measure to see it they are still tight. I would be just as concerned about the flashing and if it is still solid but both of these things are regular maintenance that needs to be done every couple years anyway especially if you have a medal roof with exposed screws.
As far as your question about the price being to much or too little, I just don't know because I can't see it from here. I guess if you took the job knowing the customer wanted all the screws replaced then I don't think it would be too far off. Also I can see your view on replacing all of them especially if you are giving any kind of warranty on a job like this. To me it would be hard for me to do a job like this and then try and warranty somebodies 17 year old roof. I don't know, maybe it's just me but I don't see how you could really be asked to stand behind something like that.
EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
I'm not saying anybody is accusing me of anything. I'm just trying to understand those who think the contractor is charging too much for the job.
As for warrantying the work, that would only be after dealing with the purlins and condition of the metal. If there was a problem, that would change everything.
Eddie
As for warrantying the work, that would only be after dealing with the purlins and condition of the metal. If there was a problem, that would change everything.
Eddie
mx842
Platinum Member
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- Kubota L3301, PowerKing 2414, John Deere 316, Gravely ZT HD 52
My point exactly......When a contractor gets involved with this kind of job (17 year old roof) the $2000 would most likely end up double or triple that or could possibly turn into a complete re-roof all together.
Look, I have been on both ends of the table. I have been the one doing the work and I have also been on the receiving end so I know where you are coming from and I do understand all the pitfalls of doing business in today's demanding market place. When I was in business I talked myself out of more jobs than I got. Most of the time that was because of my dislike of having to go back to the customer and trying to explain why the job is now going to cost more than originally thought. So in my trying to be fair and honest with the customer by telling him all the maybes and what ifs up front, this sometimes comes off to the customer as being wishy washy and sometimes even that you don't really know what you are doing in the first place.
I don't know how many times I got calls from people after the fact wanting to tell me they were sorry for not listening to what I was saying because the next place they stopped at gave them the price they wanted to see but in the end they ended up with a whole new $8000 motor rather than the $1500 that I wanted to replace his manifolds and do a valve job on his 10 year old boat. Awh, but those manifolds looked good on the outside. The next guy told him we didn't know what we were talking about and he could get that motor running like new with just this simple can of fixer flush in a bottle and the whole job would only be $200. Up front that looks like a heck of a deal but it didn't fix the real problem it just got the engine running well enough to get it through the last fishing trip of the season but after sitting a couple months the whole engine seized up.
In the spring it wouldn't crank because the motor was stuck so naturally he carried it back to the last place that worked on it for a new battery and a make ready for spring and before it was over he not only got himself a new battery, he also got a new starter along, with a new slave solenoid, then some 3 more hours labor charge added to the 5 that had already piled up for new battery cables and rewiring the whole start circuit. The total for the repairs only $1250.00 but that is not all. The guy then tells him that the motor is seized because the manifolds froze and busted which allowed water into the engine and locked it up. AND... now he not only has a $1250.00 bill for a locked up engine that is useless, he needed a new one to the tune of just a tad over $9500.00.
Now at this point a lot of people would have just walked out and went to see the people over at Allen, Allen, Allen, & Allen, but being the slick talking dynamic sales person this guy was he was able to sweet talk his way around this minor little problem and talk the customer into a repower job. He did knock off the $600 labor charge on the repair bill but before it was over he ended up with all the new parts he had put on the already seized one by telling the customer that it was sitting out by the shop and the junk man had come in an swept it up when no one was looking.
I know this looks like a halfazzed attempt at hyjacking another mans post but it's not.
It's just that sometimes things are not always what they seem and even when you have the job right in front of you there still can be things you miss when writing up an estimate. Nobody here but the op, that I know of, knows exactly what he has and to be honest I don't think he really knows. All he knows is what the salesman has told him and it's up to him to either say yes or no at this point. Me?? I don't know if it is a good price or not because as I have said I can't see it from here.
clemsonfor
Super Member
First off if i hire your or anybody and i dont know the kind of work you have done other than a few references and seeing a few jobs, You better bet im gonna be there while your working. I either will be there doing it myself or watching to make sure you do it and clean up. I will even get onto the roof to watch you work some times if this were me. There are too many bad apples today to just trust even your trusted and best pic for a job. Yeah its a small $2k job but remember thats 2K out of my pocket wether or not its $2k in your pocket.
As for the job oh yea it will suck and you will have back cramps and busted ankles thats for sure but there roofers that do it all day 6 days a week sometimes. This is why i will never be a roofer!
Again nothing against you Eddie i think you would do a jam up job at a fair price. My point is if he is hiring someone even with references etc I personally will still be there to supervise.
If you were building an addition or building my home or a remodel over more than a day period, no i wont be there the whole time. But you better bet i will be there on the first and last day of the job as well as daily inspections. Too many screw ups now a days. "oh that wall was suppose to stay? OR Thats how we always do it, Or Take your **** lunch trash with you dont put it in my garbage and stink it up"
JB4310
Super Member
You wouldn't be using my equipment to get up there. It's an insurance thing.
You want proof I have insurance, so you will understand when I tell you only me or my employee is allowed on my equipment.
You have a slightly hostile attitude, so I'm sure you would be doing this job yourself. That's fine, that means you are capable.
I'll just say the customer that is hostile or untrusting gets the lowest level of service. Just the bare minimum. The customer that is trusting and leaves you a check before the job is done will get the highest level of service, the most attention to detail.
I know that probably goes against the normal thinking, but that's how it is with me. The easier you make my life the more time I have to dedicate to the work on hand.
No offense to you personally of course, you are probably the type that is very handy and does not need to hire out often, so our paths would not likely cross.
JB.
EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
Not to pick on you, or anybody else who feels the same way, let me explain that one of the perks of being self employed is that I can decide what I want to charge and let you decide if you want to hire me or not. With so much work being available, and the fact that my clients are willing to wait 3 to six months for me to get to them, I can be both picky on who I work for, and charge what I want.
When I go to a house and the client is really nice, fun and a pleasure to be around, I tend to give them a better price. When I get to a house and the client is confrontational, insulting, rude and unpleasant, my price goes up considerably. I don't need the work, and I don't have any desire to work at a place where I will have somebody who knows more then me, works harder then me and feels the need to look over my shoulder all day long. For that, I charge what I feel will make such an experience worth my time. I do the same with painful jobs, nasty locations, and anything that I really just don't want to do.
Nobody is forcing you to hire me, so I don't have any problems with pricing myself out of the job. If you still want to hire me, then I'm charging what I feel it's worth to deal with you, and we're all good.
Just food for thought for anybody who wonders why they are being charged what they feel is too much for work on their place, but everybody else is getting work done for less. It might just be that nobody wants to work for you.
Eddie
