Buying Advice need advice for new kubota

   / need advice for new kubota #21  
Art, back it up! The example I gave above are both liquid cooled and as close to apples to apples as I think you will find. Philip.
 
   / need advice for new kubota #22  
Lets try to compare apples to apples. Both Kubota engines. Both naturally aspirated. Both nearly same displacement.

Kubota WG972-G-E3 gasoline engine. 962cc. 32.5 peak hp @ 3600 rpm. 55 peak ft-lb @ 2300 rpm.

Kubota D1005-E3B diesel engine. 1001cc. 24.8 peak hp @ 3600 rpm. 41 peak ft-lb @ 2400 rpm.

Fact, same displacement, gasoline makes more torque and horsepower. Peaks are about same rpm.

You have to add a turbo to make a diesel a torque monster.

Philip/

I'm not sure which of my apples you consider an orange.

I also disagree with your numbers. Although I don't have the specs on the Kubota diesel engine you're quoting, here are the specs for the Kubota D1105-E3B.

1119 cc
24.8 hp @ 3000 rpm
53.1 lb-ft torque max @ 2200 rpm

now, I'm not sure who runs their tractor at 3000 rpm, personally, I'm between 2000 and 2200 rpm, which puts me in the max torque range. For this Kubota engine it also means the hp rating would be about 21 hp according to the power chart. So 21hp with 53 lb-ft torque. and that's in line with the numbers Kioti is putting out for my 30 hp engine.

For the gas engine, lets try comparing one that's a little closer to the diesel.

WG752-G-E3
741 cc
24.5 hp @ 3600 rpm
41.3 lb-ft torque max @ 2500 rpm

Again, most people run gas engines wide open, I know I do on my Ferris IS3000 mower. At 3600 rpm, the gas engine is doing 34 lb-ft torque.

So under normal use these two engines are

Diesel: 21 hp and 53 lb-ft torque
Gas: 24.5 hp and 34 lb-ft torque

http://www.kubotaengine.com/products/pdf_en/09_d1105_30.pdf
http://www.kubotaengine.com/products/pdf_en/wg752_g_e3_ol.pdf
 
   / need advice for new kubota #23  
Here are the engine spec sheets to back up my data. Philip.
 

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   / need advice for new kubota #24  
We had a 25HP Craftsman Garden Tractor with a large mowing deck (don't remember the size) , got rid of it and got a BX1500 w/54" MMM. The BX1500 would work circles around the Craftsman tractor. Traded the BX1500 for a BX1860 w/54"MMM for the wife. She says the BX1860 is more comfortable and she is happier with its performance. We have some hills to mow and she said the 1500 would run out of power, she says the 1860 does not. We have liked all our Kubotas, the diesel definately better than a gasoline engine for economy also.
 
   / need advice for new kubota
  • Thread Starter
#25  
Ok everyone, thanks for all the good advice and feedback. Now down to the purchase. I have decided to go with the bx2360 60"MMM and front mounted blower with hydraulic rotating chute. Price quoted from dealer is $15,000 any thoughts?
 
   / need advice for new kubota #26  
Ok everyone, thanks for all the good advice and feedback. Now down to the purchase. I have decided to go with the bx2360 60"MMM and front mounted blower with hydraulic rotating chute. Price quoted from dealer is $15,000 any thoughts?

Well, out of respect that this is a Kubota forum, I've refrained from talking about anything other than diesel vs gas engines, but, since you've asked...

I think $15K is a lot of money for a little tractor. Before I get yelled at, I'm saying little, not bad and maybe little is what you want and need, but you could get a whole lot more tractor for that kind of money.

I was convinced I was buying a new kubota to replace my JD. I really only shopped the other brands to satisfy myself that I wasn't jumping into something blind and had done my homework. I found that the world has more than (Kubota) orange and JD green.

Before spending that much money, go look at a Kioti CK20 or Bobcat CT122 (exact same tractor except for the loader). If you don't have either around, look at McCormick or Landini (I don't know their model #, but again, same tractor, different FEL (FEL = Front End Loader) and color. You'll find they are small compact tractors, 22hp (roughly the same as the BX2360), have almost twice the loader capacity (assuming you're getting one, Kioti/Bobcat have a free loader program), weigh almost double without the loader and the Kioti version will have 4 years of warranty. You'll also get features usually reserved for the bigger more luxury line tractors. For a tractor, weight = traction, it also means there's a lot more metal in the Kioti with larger, stronger frames, axles etc. I don't do any damage to my lawn with my 6500lbs TBL (tractor, loader, backhoe) with loaded R4 industrial tires.

After you've looked at those, look at everything else from JD, Case, Mahindra, LS, New Holland (made by LS) etc. In the end, the Kubota BX2360 may be perfect and the one for you, and that's great. Don't spend that much money without looking at EVERY option first.
 
   / need advice for new kubota #27  
Phillip8n, I think if you looked at torque curves at lower RPM's, this is where you will find a diesel outperforms a similar gas engine. When you overload a gas engine, say when mowing grass that is too long and your going to fast, it will drag down, get below its torque peak, and start to die out. With a diesel engine, it will drag down also, but still have good torque and continue to lug along and not die out as easy.

Look at the torque of both a gas engine and diesel engine at say 1500 rpm, and this is where a diesel will outperform a gasser.

From personal experience, I had a gas mower, about 700 or 750cc in size, 25 hp, 54" mower deck. I now have a Kubota, 900cc engine size, 25 hp, 60" mower deck. There is just no comparision between the two, the diesel pulls much better, but it is also a larger displacement to make the same horsepower.

The truth is, its tough to compare a diesel and gas engines, its the proverbial apples to oranges comparision.
 
   / need advice for new kubota #28  
Ok everyone, thanks for all the good advice and feedback. Now down to the purchase. I have decided to go with the bx2360 60"MMM and front mounted blower with hydraulic rotating chute. Price quoted from dealer is $15,000 any thoughts?

If you go to Kubota's website they have a "build my tractor". You can go through it and add in each option and it will give you the retail price. 10% off or more is a pretty good price. I quickly went through it and it looks like you're getting about 15% off, if so that would be a very good price. You can make a few calls to other dealers.
 
   / need advice for new kubota #29  
We are comparing a B&S or Kohler air cooled (possibly single cylinder) gas engine in a riding mower to a liquid cooled Kubota Diesel in a BX tractor.
 
   / need advice for new kubota #30  
I think if you looked at torque curves at lower RPM's, this is where you will find a diesel outperforms a similar gas engine. When you overload a gas engine, say when mowing grass that is too long and your going to fast, it will drag down, get below its torque peak, and start to die out. With a diesel engine, it will drag down also, but still have good torque and continue to lug along and not die out as easy.

Look at the torque of both a gas engine and diesel engine at say 1500 rpm, and this is where a diesel will outperform a gasser.

From personal experience, I had a gas mower, about 700 or 750cc in size, 25 hp, 54" mower deck. I now have a Kubota, 900cc engine size, 25 hp, 60" mower deck. There is just no comparision between the two, the diesel pulls much better, but it is also a larger displacement to make the same horsepower.

The truth is, its tough to compare a diesel and gas engines, its the proverbial apples to oranges comparision.

It is hard to compare, but the turbo is what gives diesel torque such a good name. For the same cc engine, look at the peak torque. Gasoline is 2300 rpm, diesel is 2400 rpm, nearly the same rpm level. For a diesel to make more torque, I have to go to a larger displacment than the same cc gasoline I am comparing it to, or add a turbo. Then yes, I will have more torque. In this size engine, who cares what the torque is at 1500 rpm? You are well below your peak torque, so you better slow down or cut your grass more often. My 540 pto speed is at 2650 engine rpm. When I mow my rpm's will not drop more than 200 rpm. If you are lugging down to 1500 rpm you are doing something wrong. I am not anti-diesel. I love them. I own 2, and work with diesel engines everyday from 4.5 liter 173 hp to 32 liter 800 hp. Just trying to make a point that for everyone who owns a 300hp 600ft-lb turbo diesel in thier 3/4 ton pickup truck, that the torque curve on a little naturally aspirated Kubota is much different. Philip.
 

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