PHILIP8N
Veteran Member
I drove Blue, Green, and Orange before my purchase. I learned allot on each test drive. Yes, it helped me decide on color. Philip.
Kubotas in the low/mid 40hp range
- Thread starter carlmill
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I drove Blue, Green, and Orange before my purchase. I learned allot on each test drive. Yes, it helped me decide on color. Philip.
IslandTractor
Super Star Member
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To be clear, as Kleetus seems to feel attacked by my skeptical opinion on HST+, I am in no way trying to criticize those of you who have the Grand L. The point of this thread was to discuss the pros and cons of the various mid 40's hp range of Kubota tractors. I noticed a few posts early that basically said "get the Grand L because of HST+". I thought about that statement and decided I would present the other side. Nothing against HST+ other than it may not be the most valuable feature on a tractor depending on what work you plan to do.
I still haven't heard anyone say it is a critical feature and still haven't figured out if there are any tasks that are much better done with HST+ rather than plain HST. Spending all day moving piles of dirt comes closest to being a justification that makes sense to me. Mowing up and down steep fields might also qualify.
For a newbie trying to decide between the L, the MX and the Grand L, I think it is helpful to distinguish functional features and optional features. I think HST+ fits in the optional category as far as getting work done. I don't doubt it is a convenience advance nor do I doubt that it will be copied and become more common. I'd rank it above cup holders and below a lot of other tractor features that a potential customer should consider.
PHILIP8N
Veteran Member
Then you have low expectations. In fact, I can do without cup holders. Wait, I put my hitch pins in those! Philip.
crazyal
Super Member
Today I took the grading scraper out to smooth out the ROW. It had been years since the road had any work done to it. I set the rippers to their lowest position and I was pulling rocks out of the drive that were up to the size of a gallon of milk. The rocks tended to be grouped together.
With the tractor in M I would work the hard sections with the H-DS set to slow and then shift it to fast as I backed up and then back to low. Also as I was ripping with the shanks when doing long runs I would use the H-DS to slow down and get the extra grunt and control for the hard parts and then shift back up for the places that were loose.
Once I was done ripping I raised the shanks and the started leveling. At times the GS would start filling up with dirt. So again I would just use the H-DS when the tractor would start to get loaded down.
I bet I used the H-DS feature alone about 30 or 40 times. I ran the tractor at about 2000 rpm and over a 2 hour period the fuel level didn't drop. Was H-DS needed? Not at all. I could have ran the tractor at 2600 and stopped and shifted each time I needed to or just stayed in low gear but it would have used more fuel, required more work on my part, and would have taken more time.
If the argument is that HST+ is nothing more than some fancy features that really aren't need, yes, your right. But so is HST, so is power steering, so is a cab. I basic geared tractor will do pretty much anything you want to do. It all comes down to what is important to you and how long do you plan on owning the tractor. To me time and labor saving features are things I like. I plan on owning my Kubota for 20 years or more. The H-DS feature could save me shifting thousands of times, hundreds of gallons of diesel, and who knows how many hours less will get clocked.
For those who don't want to spend the money, that's why Kubota and other brands have models that don't offer it. Not everyone is going to want it. But what I can tell you is that once you get some seat time and get the feel for it it'll be much harder to say "I don't want to pay for that". But that's just the H-DS feature, add in the auto throttle and stall guard. The only way you can decide is to sit on the tractor and play with it.
With the tractor in M I would work the hard sections with the H-DS set to slow and then shift it to fast as I backed up and then back to low. Also as I was ripping with the shanks when doing long runs I would use the H-DS to slow down and get the extra grunt and control for the hard parts and then shift back up for the places that were loose.
Once I was done ripping I raised the shanks and the started leveling. At times the GS would start filling up with dirt. So again I would just use the H-DS when the tractor would start to get loaded down.
I bet I used the H-DS feature alone about 30 or 40 times. I ran the tractor at about 2000 rpm and over a 2 hour period the fuel level didn't drop. Was H-DS needed? Not at all. I could have ran the tractor at 2600 and stopped and shifted each time I needed to or just stayed in low gear but it would have used more fuel, required more work on my part, and would have taken more time.
If the argument is that HST+ is nothing more than some fancy features that really aren't need, yes, your right. But so is HST, so is power steering, so is a cab. I basic geared tractor will do pretty much anything you want to do. It all comes down to what is important to you and how long do you plan on owning the tractor. To me time and labor saving features are things I like. I plan on owning my Kubota for 20 years or more. The H-DS feature could save me shifting thousands of times, hundreds of gallons of diesel, and who knows how many hours less will get clocked.
For those who don't want to spend the money, that's why Kubota and other brands have models that don't offer it. Not everyone is going to want it. But what I can tell you is that once you get some seat time and get the feel for it it'll be much harder to say "I don't want to pay for that". But that's just the H-DS feature, add in the auto throttle and stall guard. The only way you can decide is to sit on the tractor and play with it.
beppington
Elite Member
HST+ is a critical feature to maximize efficiency, ease of use, smoothness of operation & enjoyment factor. All in my opinion of course.
On my dad's gear Mahindra 4110 you have to come to a complete stop to do any gear change at all (or the gear grind). With the HST+ I can change from Rabbit to Turtle by pressing the lever while traveling at any speed. Is it a "must have for the tractor to even be usable"? No. But it is very nice to not have to come to a complete stop or even slow down to gear down for extra torque. It's also very nice to turn on the Stall Guard & Auto H-DS & have the tractor increase power and/or downshift automatically.
Like somebody else said, compare it to power steering: Once you own power steering, are you ever goin' back? Not likely. Is it a "must have" to operate a vehicle? No, not for most people, but it sure is nice.
Yes, I drank the Koolaid ... & now I'm explaining why it tastes so good :thumbsup: :laughing:
beppington
Elite Member
For people who can't understand how cool it is just by reading about it, yes I think operating one in a meaningful situation would convince a lot of people. I don't mean a quick spin around the parking lot.
IslandTractor
Super Star Member
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The cool factor is not in question. As noted, it is more an issue of "if you have $xxxxxx to spend on tractor and implements to accomplish X,Y,Z tasks, then where on my priority list is HST+?"
I was obviously joking about the cupholder but more realistically the question I would personally consider if I did not have a couple of Maserati's parked in my garage and therefore had a budget to work with, is "Would an MX4700 with $xxxx of options and extra implements help me get my work done more effectively, efficiently, economically and comfortably than a Lxx40 with fewer implements or options?" What is the value of a bigger loader and engine on the MX4700 versus the HST+ on something like a L3940 if they cost the same (just guessing, I don't know the cost differential).
Crazyal mentions possible fuel efficiency benefits. I could see that but those are speculative unless Kubota has some data. It doesn't require that much more fuel to run an engine at 2200rpm constantly rather than at 1900rpm and intermittently at 2200rpm doing the same work. I'm a bit skeptical of his "hundreds of gallons" estimate even over 20 years but I don't know. Specific fuel consumption I think is more related to the work being done than how fast the engine is turning but I could be wrong.
PHILIP8N
Veteran Member
I had a dozen implements or more that I used on my 8N for over 20 years. Guess what, they fit on my L3940! That was never part of my equation, and is not for most 2nd buyers (not sure if OP is 1st time buyer or not). One can always pick up implements over the years as needed, new, auctions, used, traded, free, as I did. I have owned the L3940 for 3 years now and the only thing I have purchased is a heavier box blade with hydraulic rippers. The HST+ was my opportunity to get something nice, and it was the right decision for me. But then again, I also choose not to drive a Kia or a Hyundai to save a few bucks. Philip.
IslandTractor
Super Star Member
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Then you made an informed decision that worked well for you. For a newbie walking into a tractor dealership without the benefit of your prior experience or rollover implements, the calculation might be different. I suppose a good salesman like Neal or Art would help the newbie look at the big picture and consider the work and implements etc etc but in my experience the average salesman just tries to sell you whatever caught your eye. I don't doubt the flash appeal of the Grand L and HST+ etc. I wonder/doubt whether most newbies get the benefit of really understanding what they are getting into before they become attracted to the sox appeal of whatever model tractor caught their eye.
By the way, don't knock Hyundai till you've tried one. Drive a Genesis and tell me you're not impressed.
yes I think you should drive one before you go on acting like you know everything about it.. but some how I have a feeling you think you know everything about everything.
I provided factual evidence on why I picked what I picked, my experiences with it and that I liked it with a factual example.. all youve done is provided your jaded opinion that you perceive as fact.