First timer- field prep for field grass

[sd455dan]

Have a couple of small fields that have been compacted (20 years, horses running on them) also have been fighting a Knapp weed infestation. Bought a well used 6' disc, and JD pull type 3 bottom plow, going to try and plow and disc, New to (field prep and planting) want to plant field grass. Ok today hooked up the plow and discovered one of the hydraulic lines was to short when turning the tractor, picked up a drawbar for the disc (didn't come with one) and a short piece of hydraulic line and female swivel, got the hose lengthened, works good no leaks, Headed out to the field made 4 counterclockwise laps (that's the direction) the previous owner said plowing is done, sometimes furrows looked ok some ended up looking like a sod truck had overturned- and so it begins...got to dark- so tomorrow will try again, will try to post pictures of progress.

 

[vtsnowedin]

Must have pictures!! Must have pictures!!!
Soil test? lime? fertilizer? Rocky soil need rocks picked? Picked your seed mix yet?
I'm thinking about all of these things myself for some food plots I want to put in but there is close to three feet of snow on them at present so while I wait it will be interesting to see how you get along. Don't worry about the sods that didn't roll over pretty. Let them dry out and pass over them with the disk a couple of times and you will chop them up well enough.

 

[Verticaltrx]

Sounds like a good project, how many acres are you doing?

As for moldboard plowing, you don't go round and round. You start by 'opening the field' by plowing from one end of the field to the other directly down the center. Then you turn around and make the 'back furrow'. Basically you just come back right along the first pass so you end up with a furrow on each side. Then it's just a matter of plowing up and back until the field is done. On a large field, say over 10ac, you might do this process a couple times instead of once down the middle of the field. This will save some time driving back and forth on the end rows. Once you have done all the way to the edge of the field you can go along the ends plowing inward to clean up the edges.

Once you have that done you can disc, harrow, and seed.

This is a thread with a couple pics of some moldboard plowing I did year before last. The pics aren't the greatest but you can get an idea of how it's done:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/203558-spring-farm-work-pics.html

 

[DB Pilot]

I have been fighting invasive plants for about 6 years now. It is called Dogbane. I mow the field three times a year. Mowing does help but in some cases seems to encourage more than kill off the invasives. I have been using a 1.5% solution of roundup that does a good job, not great but good job of removing invasives while not killing the grass. That solution attacks broad leaf invasives and leaves the natural thin blade grasses alone. Again I have been using the roundup for about 5 years. Discing did very little.
What I think I have learned is that the invasive plants come up at different times so repeated applications of expensive roundup is not always effective. If I spray to early some of the same species of plant will grow later and be unaffected. If I spray to late some of the plants are so hardy that they survive and come back with a vengeance.
While I have had success with keeping the invasive plants down if I miss a year I can see they will come right back and ruin the fields. That means I would waste all the fuel time and herbicides that I have spent to date. So this year I am going to take a section of field and use roundup to kill off everything, keeping erosion in mind. Disc the area after all is gone and plant something I want. I think it will be much less expensive than year after year with so so results and hopefully a great hay field. That's my :2cents:s good luck

 

[rustythe4x4]

I ran a 7 foot cultivator with a set of spring harrows behind it many many times to prep a new spot for grass (about 4 acres). It still wasnt quite right, so I ran a set of overturned diamond harrows over the area to break up the big lumps and pull out the larger stones, then I ran a 20 foot spring harrow over it several times to make it relatively smooth and flat. We broadcast seeded and re-harrowed and in 3 weeks we had a decent grass cover.

 

[sd455dan]

Sounds like a good project, how many acres are you doing?

As for moldboard plowing, you don't go round and round. You start by 'opening the field' by plowing from one end of the field to the other directly down the center. Then you turn around and make the 'back furrow'. Basically you just come back right along the first pass so you end up with a furrow on each side. Then it's just a matter of plowing up and back until the field is done. On a large field, say over 10ac, you might do this process a couple times instead of once down the middle of the field. This will save some time driving back and forth on the end rows. Once you have done all the way to the edge of the field you can go along the ends plowing inward to clean up the edges.

Once you have that done you can disc, harrow, and seed.

This is a thread with a couple pics of some moldboard plowing I did year before last. The pics aren't the greatest but you can get an idea of how it's done:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/203558-spring-farm-work-pics.html

I'm sure that's true with a 3 point plow, but not so sure that is entirely correct for this style pull type John Deere (how about it? deere pull type plow owners) here's a picture the amount of work to stop, back up, re-align the plow would make this a real hassle.
The property is only 10 acres and the fields have been fenced into some really small fields,also it is partially treed further complicating plowing...here's how it looked after my first attempt with the JD 3bottom, the frost wasn't completely out of the ground then switched to the Ford 3000 and disc anyway going to start on it again tomorrow, liked your plowing pictures you the plow and the NAA did a nice job:thumbsup:

 

[sd455dan]

I have been fighting invasive plants for about 6 years now. It is called Dogbane. I mow the field three times a year. Mowing does help but in some cases seems to encourage more than kill off the invasives. I have been using a 1.5% solution of roundup that does a good job, not great but good job of removing invasives while not killing the grass. That solution attacks broad leaf invasives and leaves the natural thin blade grasses alone. Again I have been using the roundup for about 5 years. Discing did very little.
What I think I have learned is that the invasive plants come up at different times so repeated applications of expensive roundup is not always effective. If I spray to early some of the same species of plant will grow later and be unaffected. If I spray to late some of the plants are so hardy that they survive and come back with a vengeance.
While I have had success with keeping the invasive plants down if I miss a year I can see they will come right back and ruin the fields. That means I would waste all the fuel time and herbicides that I have spent to date. So this year I am going to take a section of field and use roundup to kill off everything, keeping erosion in mind. Disc the area after all is gone and plant something I want. I think it will be much less expensive than year after year with so so results and hopefully a great hay field. That's my :2cents:s good luck

I have also been rough cutting with a 6' brush hog about 3 or 4 times a year where the Knapweed is the worst, can't use the roundup with the horses, the wife would kill me- before the Monsanto product killed the weeds...so that's why I decided to work the soil, it literally hasn't been touched other than mowing or hand pulling the weeds since 1985- anyway tomorrows another day, and my new favorite saying is we learn by doing

 

[sd455dan]

Must have pictures!! Must have pictures!!!
Soil test? lime? fertilizer? Rocky soil need rocks picked? Picked your seed mix yet?
I'm thinking about all of these things myself for some food plots I want to put in but there is close to three feet of snow on them at present so while I wait it will be interesting to see how you get along. Don't worry about the sods that didn't roll over pretty. Let them dry out and pass over them with the disk a couple of times and you will chop them up well enough.

started to load a picture and a google malware warning about tbn covered the screen, went into the advanced area and was able to get back here ?? who knows?? anyway first- here are my helpers who will do most of the work. 1967 Ford 3000 ,W/6' interco? disc and a 1993 Rhino 554 w/ JD 3 bottom pull plow and hydraulic lift,
also here's how i finished today ,going to be 22 degrees or so tonight may have to fight the frost again in the morning... Right now everything's on a shoe string budget, Got a fair amount of Horse manure from the barn and run outs (been composting 2 years) and need to move it anyway probably going to bucket that out and plow it again... Thinking about getting a 5 gallon bucket from various parts of the field before and another after the manure is added, Possibly check with county extension office (next week)and find out what the charge is to test the soil...

 

[vtsnowedin]

started to load a picture and a google malware warning about tbn covered the screen, went into the advanced area and was able to get back here ?? who knows?? anyway first- here are my helpers who will do most of the work. 1967 Ford 3000 ,W/6' interco? disc and a 1993 Rhino 554 w/ JD 3 bottom pull plow and hydraulic lift, View attachment 309604
also here's how i finished today ,going to be 22 degrees or so tonight may have to fight the frost again in the morning...View attachment 309605 Right now everything's on a shoe string budget, Got a fair amount of Horse manure from the barn and run outs (been composting 2 years) and need to move it anyway probably going to bucket that out and plow it again... Thinking about getting a 5 gallon bucket from various parts of the field before and another after the manure is added, Possibly check with county extension office (next week)and find out what the charge is to test the soil...

I would not plow it again this year. You want the sods you got upside down to rot in place to kill all the weeds you turned under. Spread your manure and let it and the soil dry out in the spring sunshine and wind for a few days until clods fall apart to dust when kicked then disk again to chop in the manure and give yourself a fine even seed bed. It looks good so far especially considering how wet it still is.

 

[blueriver]

Fall plowing is best ... it has the winter rains, snows, thaws to break down the clumps ... sort a "dissolve" on there own. Then come spring run the disc over it ... a drag harrow and plant.

There are a lot of pre-emergent weed controls on the market ... talk to your local coop they may have something for you.

 

[sd455dan]

I would not plow it again this year. You want the sods you got upside down to rot in place to kill all the weeds you turned under. Spread your manure and let it and the soil dry out in the spring sunshine and wind for a few days until clods fall apart to dust when kicked then disk again to chop in the manure and give yourself a fine even seed bed. It looks good so far especially considering how wet it still is.

Thanks for the info, so when I spread the manure (wish we had a small manure spreader) but we don't I will have to use the loader and just try to dump it out of the bucket slowly while moving a long. It would be better to disc it in now, and then leave it to dry right? Thanks again I do appreciate the help

 

[vtsnowedin]

Thanks for the info, so when I spread the manure (wish we had a small manure spreader) but we don't I will have to use the loader and just try to dump it out of the bucket slowly while moving a long. It would be better to disc it in now, and then leave it to dry right? Thanks again I do appreciate the help

You will probably end up with quite a few lumps and clumps using the bucket to spread manure. Back drag out the worst of them and let it and the dirt under it dry a day or two then disk. It might take you that long to spread all of it anyway. If the suns out by the time you get it all done once where you started will be even more dried out and ready for a second pass. The disk will pull a lot easier and do a much better job if the dirt is dry enough to not stick to the disks and need to be scraped off by the scraper bars.

 

[sd455dan]

I would not plow it again this year. You want the sods you got upside down to rot in place to kill all the weeds you turned under. Spread your manure and let it and the soil dry out in the spring sunshine and wind for a few days until clods fall apart to dust when kicked then disk again to chop in the manure and give yourself a fine even seed bed. It looks good so far especially considering how wet it still is.

Going to take your advice on the plowing, sometimes- the (urge to use new tools, overcomes logic) and ends up causing one to take 2 steps back, instead of one forward.. I transferred 2 of the aged Horse manure piles to the field and just shook the material out of the bucket while in 4th gear, going to leave it alone for a while as suggested , also took a clean 5 gallon bucket and got soil from 5 places around the field, before putting the manure on.. I may try and run the plow thru the other horse field, it has more trees and a whole lot more pine needles, already removed five totally full grapple buckets of just pine needles, last fall...not sure how it's going go with the tree roots.... Anyway thanks again everyone. Will try to post new developments

 

[vtsnowedin]

You never said what you plan to plant for grass. Not knowing anything about Idaho soils and practices I don't know what would be a good mix there. Here I'd go for Timothy and red clover but you might not have the conditions for that.

 

[KennK]

We have a few horses and for 15 years I hand-spread composted manure. I'd manure fork it into a small trailer pulled behind my JD 420 tractor (garden sized), drive to where I wanted to spread on my lawn, and then just hand fling it - kicking the larger chunks down. I'd then let it dry for a few days and then mow to disperse the clumps.

Eventually as my back and the JD 420 got older I moved to a JD 3320 with a front end loader and a smallish ground-driven manure spreader. I still do the post spread kicking and mowing thing.

Around here most people I know that are trying to reseed use a harrow and then rent a slit-seeder. I have not yet had to do that as we have a gravel-covered "sacrifice area" for wet weather and keep the horses off the paddocks when too wet. We also try to rotate them around two areas. The ground can still take a beating though.

By the way, next time we create a sacrifice area we won't use gravel since it can't really be cleaned using the front end loader (we get gravel in the mix). Next time we are thinking of using those rubber mats with the holes in them.

 

[sd455dan]

You never said what you plan to plant for grass. Not knowing anything about Idaho soils and practices I don't know what would be a good mix there. Here I'd go for Timothy and red clover but you might not have the conditions for that.

Oh, on the seed lets see-last year- Before I picked up the disc and plow we overseeded the field next to the one we're working on now, my wife just hand seeded it, with according to her memory (Northwest Horse Pasture Mix).
she believes the main seeds in it are Timothy/Alfalfa/Clover. Thinking of just trying this. There may be better choices, going to ask at the local Co-Op, The girls are the horse experts, so just trying to grow whatever the horses like...

 

[sd455dan]

We have a few horses and for 15 years I hand-spread composted manure. I'd manure fork it into a small trailer pulled behind my JD 420 tractor (garden sized), drive to where I wanted to spread on my lawn, and then just hand fling it - kicking the larger chunks down. I'd then let it dry for a few days and then mow to disperse the clumps.

Eventually as my back and the JD 420 got older I moved to a JD 3320 with a front end loader and a smallish ground-driven manure spreader. I still do the post spread kicking and mowing thing.

Around here most people I know that are trying to reseed use a harrow and then rent a slit-seeder. I have not yet had to do that as we have a gravel-covered "sacrifice area" for wet weather and keep the horses off the paddocks when too wet. We also try to rotate them around two areas. The ground can still take a beating though.

By the way, next time we create a sacrifice area we won't use gravel since it can't really be cleaned using the front end loader (we get gravel in the mix). Next time we are thinking of using those rubber mats with the holes in them.

I tried to talk my wife into the gravel idea around/in the barn to, told me that the horses feet can get the gravel stuck in under the hoofs, also as you stated, glad I didn't put it in the run outs or by the loafing sheds , it would have gotten in all of the manure/fertilizer..
Guess the 3/4 minus will be best used for the driveway.
Many years ago- bought wood shavings /bark for the run outs and feeding area- but I don't want to defeat the purpose of using the manure as fertilizer...unsure on the effect of mixing wood products in the manure??
On the harrow,I do have an ancient 2 section (spike)? harrow with the pointed teeth that look like iron rail road spikes. Tried it years ago on an untouched field ,did nothing but now that the field has been worked by the disc it maybe the last step before seeding ?? Thanks for the post

 

[AKfish]

I have been fighting invasive plants for about 6 years now. It is called Dogbane. I mow the field three times a year. Mowing does help but in some cases seems to encourage more than kill off the invasives. I have been using a 1.5% solution of roundup that does a good job, not great but good job of removing invasives while not killing the grass. That solution attacks broad leaf invasives and leaves the natural thin blade grasses alone. Again I have been using the roundup for about 5 years. Discing did very little.
What I think I have learned is that the invasive plants come up at different times so repeated applications of expensive roundup is not always effective. If I spray to early some of the same species of plant will grow later and be unaffected. If I spray to late some of the plants are so hardy that they survive and come back with a vengeance.
While I have had success with keeping the invasive plants down if I miss a year I can see they will come right back and ruin the fields. That means I would waste all the fuel time and herbicides that I have spent to date. So this year I am going to take a section of field and use roundup to kill off everything, keeping erosion in mind. Disc the area after all is gone and plant something I want. I think it will be much less expensive than year after year with so so results and hopefully a great hay field. That's my :2cents:s good luck

Apologies...Not meaning to get too far off track or hijack the OP's original thread.

I did a quick search of the USDA database and found that 2,4-D is a very effective control agent for Dogbane. No mention of Roundup. For my most stubborn broadleaf weeds in my pastures and hay fields I use a combination of low-volital 2,4-D and Dicamba.

It has done well enough that I've only had to spray my fields about once every 3-4 years.

AKfish

 

[AKfish]

Believe it or not... the best horse pasture mix we've come across is a northern, climate lawn mix. No fescue and heavy on the Kentucky bluegrass. The grass overwinters really well and will grow and regrow all summer-fall.

We keep (I fight with my wife ALL the time on this!) the horses off the pastures when they're real wet and we rotate them about every 3-4 days (have 4 pastures ~ 1/2 acre each). Planted a 5th this past summer and have started on clearing another 1-11/2 acre pasture as well.

Might get a couple head of cows..

AKfish

 

[sd455dan]

Well the last couple days have been sunny, no moisture , so I worked in the part of the field that is treed and just pulled the plow thru the areas that the trees were not closely spaced. Tried not to rip out the root systems of the Pine trees, Once that was opened up , got the disc and worked it over the plowed up parts, and anywhere I could get,
Glad the old Ford does not have a canopy, or it would have been destroyed by the end of the day, as it was- a branch got a hold of my coffee cup and between the disc and loaded 14.8 -28s another cup wiped out.:ashamed:lost count on how many coffee cups have been run over in the last few years...
Today put some extra weight on the disc, and ran it over the manured field - the field was not very wet except in a couple of shaded places, the dirt did not stick to the point of gumming up the disc wheels.
I found the sweet spot on the 3 point top link adjustment,to where both front and rear gang shafts were evenly running above the field, and a good spot for the depth adjustment the front discs are 16" and notched the rear wheels are 18" and smooth. When I took this picture, tractor in 5th gear and a smile ear to ear:cloud9:View attachment 310158 here's where I stopped for the day , still going to look into the soil analysis, if price is not to much