Future of New Holland Utility and Compact tractor line.

[Robert_in_NY]

Neil is a good guy and will go out of his way to help others even if they didn't buy from him. On here it is tough for him because I believe he forgets he is representing his dealership and as such he has to be careful of what he says. So as much as he would love to speak completely honestly he has to be careful as there are OEMS watching these boards.

As for Messicks credibility, look on here and try finding anyone with a legitimate complaint against Messicks as a business. They treat people fairly and will advise them properly. If your looking for a compact would you want them to sell you the boomer without telling you they feel a particular Kubota they sell may be better? Has nothing to do with pushing a "more" profitable Kubota as Messicks is a large dealership and sells a lot of large tractors and equipment as well with higher profit margins.

Neil is easily one of the most helpful and friendly people on here and this board would be lacking without him.

 

[murphy1244]

I remember when I first joined this forum and lambasted an advertiser, only partially fairly. That thread disappeared.

Yea Daugen I remembered that thread when you were very mad about a paint job on a implement, boy that was a page turner. Didn't think you would come back after that. Glad you did. The thing is Everyone must keep in mind that Neil is in Sales to sell his Kubota's and that's his job. So take what he say's with a bucket of salt cause you are gonna hear what he wants you too not always what you need too.

 

[GManBart]

Its not in my interest to publicly hash out where we see these differences, but suffice to say... if you hop from one to the next they become apparent quickly. I'm not trying to cut down anyone's purchase decision, just calling a spade and spade.

If we're talking about engineering, materials, and construction, how is anybody going to see those differences jumping from tractor to tractor? I can't pop open the transmission case and get a look at the insides to see how good their machining is, tear apart the rear end/final drives to see what those look like, or do metal analysis to see what sort of steel they're using, can I?

If you jump from machine to machine, all you're going to really see/know is ergonomics, fit, and finish, maybe a little bit of NVH, and the obvious things like transmission options/modes, etc. Those things count, for sure, but they aren't the difference between a "good" tractor, and a "bad" tractor. Refinement/complexity and quality aren't the same thing. You can have a machine that is simpler, and be every bit as good in the quality department as something that's far more complicated, and refined.

 

[Harold_J]

New Holland is committed to the compact tractor business. The 2014 models are currently being launched to dealers. While still produced by LS, the "new" Boomers will feature an improved, larger platform that is similar to the Shibaura produced tractors. Also, the engine will be a tier 4 Shibaura instead of the current LS/Mitsubishi engine. Overall, the tractors are a lot more comfortable and quieter.

OK, so there you have it for inquiring minds about what Messick and CNH dealer are meaning about 15 year old technology. They needed the new/larger platform and better quieter Shibaura engine in an attempt to try and catch back up. Having to promote and sell a product that's a step 15 years backward from its predecessor can be a disappointment for skilled salespersons dealing with experienced customers.

 

[TSO]

OK, so there you have it for inquiring minds about what Messick and CNH dealer are meaning about 15 year old technology. They needed the new/larger platform and better quieter Shibaura engine in an attempt to try and catch back up. Having to promote and sell a product that's a step 15 years backward from its predecessor can be a disappointment for skilled salespersons dealing with experienced customers.

Lol actually they switched to Shibaura because LS was not going to make their own tier 4 engine ... they bought the Shibaura instead. And where LS goes, so goes NH.

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Daugen & Robert... I understand what you're saying, Messick (Neil) may very well be a nice guy; most salesmen are. I'd even have a beer with him, doesn't mean I'd trust him to bring me a beer that was already opened.

Imagine if NH corporate was watching this thread and saw one of their dealers saying one of their tractors was "just not a good machine" ... yet didn't provide to folks any specific facts to support that. Then, that very same dealer touts the quality and technological prowess of a different brand he sells. Well, I can say that if I was NH corporate, I wouldn't be too happy about it.

 

[Guesseral]

OK, so there you have it for inquiring minds about what Messick and CNH dealer are meaning about 15 year old technology. They needed the new/larger platform and better quieter Shibaura engine in an attempt to try and catch back up. Having to promote and sell a product that's a step 15 years backward from its predecessor can be a disappointment for skilled salespersons dealing with experienced customers.

Really that's how you take those changes, as being made just to satisfy CNH! I mean really! I guess if that settles the dust K!

 

[94BULLITT]

I always enjoy reading Messick's posts. It is nice to hear things from a reputable dealers point of view.

Sent from my GT-P3113 using TractorByNet

 

[pacerron]

I always enjoy reading Messick's posts. It is nice to hear things from a reputable dealers point of view.

Sent from my GT-P3113 using TractorByNet

I appreciate the online parts diagrams they provide easy access too for various products and have their url to it on my favorites bar.

 

[Harold_J]

Really that's how you take those changes, as being made just to satisfy CNH! I mean really! I guess if that settles the dust K!

I certainly didn't mean the changes were made to satisfy CNH, although that may be part of it. My point is that the need for the changes in the first place verify the fact that the initial LS CNH's were a step backwards as had been stated earlier in this thread.

 

[Guesseral]

I certainly didn't mean the changes were made to satisfy CNH, although that may be part of it. My point is that the need for the changes in the first place verify the fact that the initial LS CNH's were a step backwards as had been stated earlier in this thread.

Oh come on changes are made all the time for many different reasons, and yes some of them are from customer comments. I am sure that JD, Kubota, Mahindra, and yes even Shibaura will or are making changes to many or all of there lineup, but that doesn't make them a step backwards all it means is that they made an improvement. LS made a change in 2010 or 11 (not positive when) when they changed from the R4020 to the R4047 it was mostly the style of the hood. Yea as you said the changes were needed because they were improvements not because the tractors were a step backwards, but because of feedback. I think the main point is that one manufacturer doesn't need to be ridiculed as being a step behind for making a change while another would praised for making an improvement!