skidding on black ice

[ultrarunner]

ABS does not stop faster, it simply allows the driver to maintain control during a panic stop. In fact non ABS brakes will stop faster in snow and gravel due to the snow/gravel piling up in front of the skidding tyres.

The cousins in the alps turn off ABS in snow... especially on the gravel roads up to the farms away from where the pavement ends... every car over there with ABS has a switch to turn it off.

 

[cqaigy2]

The cousins in the alps turn off ABS in snow... especially on the gravel roads up to the farms away from where the pavement ends... every car over there with ABS has a switch to turn it off.

I have a car with traction control switch that stops the brakes from being activated due to wheel slippage. So if you are in deep snow, sand or other poor traction conditions, it won't activate the individual brakes when the vehicle senses a slippage. Works pretty well and the feel would be more familiar to those of us with older all wheel, 4 wheel drives.

 

[slowzuki]

To the mason dixon poster, yes we get black ice here, happens every fall and spring rarely in the middle of winter as there is so much residual salt on the road. The patches of it are often intermittent though so you can coast over them. Probably 10 days of driving with it per year locally. Coastal areas up here get it more often. You can tell quickly in most vehicles as the steering feel changes ever so slightly, feels like a little power steering boost.

We also get a lot of freezing rain, maybe 10-15 days of driving with that too. Road looks wet but will become coated in ice under the water.

If you want to get anywhere you drive on it and learn to deal. The worst is the heavy freezing rain. It comes on quite suddenly. The salt trucks can't melt it fast enough and it completely coats all surfaces. You end up having to drive on the snowbanks if there is any turns or hills. 4wd and studs let you get around a bit going slow but steep hills are just a slide. For short distances v-block chains work well.

I remember I got stuck at the top of an 8% grade a few years ago with 4wd and studded snows. There was about a half dozen cars off in snowbanks on the hill.

The people that had tried to get out of their stuck cars kept falling down and sliding down the hill.

 

[Gator6x4]

Black ice or snow I want ABS, traction control, stability control and limited slip differential all working. I also am not going to be traveling in excess of 40 MPH in snow and much less on ice. Once a vehicle starts sliding on ice you are along for the ride. Four wheel drive or six wheel makes little difference, you are not going to move on ice. A good example of people trying to drive on ice was recently put on display for all to see in Atlanta Georgia.

 

[MattLynch]

It makes a big difference when you are used to driving in it. I work in an automotive dealership any a lott of customers come in in the fall and winter asking "how do I turn this **** off"(traction/stability control). Its pretty irritating for people who are experienced driving in slippery conditions.

 

[Gator6x4]

It makes a big difference when you are used to driving in it. I work in an automotive dealership any a lott of customers come in in the fall and winter asking "how do I turn this **** off"(traction/stability control). Its pretty irritating for people who are experienced driving in slippery conditions.

I wonder why? Traction control will engage the other wheel when the primary drive wheel starts spinning. The Stability Control will actually apply the brake on one wheel in an attempt to return the vehicle to a straight line.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Black ice or snow I want ABS, traction control, stability control and limited slip differential all working. I also am not going to be traveling in excess of 40 MPH in snow and much less on ice. Once a vehicle starts sliding on ice you are along for the ride. Four wheel drive or six wheel makes little difference, you are not going to move on ice. A good example of people trying to drive on ice was recently put on display for all to see in Atlanta Georgia.

Ill wager you wont find a Subaru driver in any of those "displays".
larry

 

[daugen]

Traction control will engage the other wheel when the primary drive wheel starts spinning.
I don't think so...maybe just terminology.
to get another wheel moving, you need limited slip, positraction, call it what you want, but I don't think it's called traction control.
I thought that was related to the braking ability similar to stability control, but when the drive wheel has lost traction. It cuts the power to that wheel; never
thought it transferred power elsewhere. ??

terminology?

 

[aczlan]

Traction control will engage the other wheel when the primary drive wheel starts spinning.
I don't think so...maybe just terminology.
to get another wheel moving, you need limited slip, positraction, call it what you want, but I don't think it's called traction control.
I thought that was related to the braking ability similar to stability control, but when the drive wheel has lost traction. It cuts the power to that wheel; never
thought it transferred power elsewhere. ??
terminology?

By braking the wheel that is spinning, it forces the differential to transfer power to the other wheel.
A open differential always puts the same amount of torque to both wheels. If one wheel is spinning easily, the other side gets the same amount of torque but it cant do anything with it as its not enough to turn the non spinning wheel.

Aaron Z

 

[daugen]

By braking the wheel that is spinning, it forces the differential to transfer power to the other wheel.
A open differential always puts the same amount of torque to both wheels. If one wheel is spinning easily, the other side gets the same amount of torque but it cant do anything with it as its not enough to turn the non spinning wheel.

Aaron, ok, so you brake the spinning wheel, but if that does not increase the torque to the non spinning wheel, what have you accomplished other than forcing rpm reduction down to some sane level where traction might be gained?. I thought an open diff sent power to the first wheel that will spin. ?
A closed diff or limited slip diff would actually drive two wheels, not one.

It used to be easy to order positraction or whatever marketing term the big three had at the time, but today it seems you have to order only the highest performance rear wheel drive model to get limited slip on the rear. Instead, it's all electronic nannies and braking control.
And even harder to find on fwd cars.